HolteExile

Dunno where I stand on Walker. There is plenty to admire about his game, he is a genuine attacking RB and the way modern football is today you need at least one of your fullbacks comfortable further up the pitch. There are things to be concerned with, defensively he switches off at times and can over elaborate. You take the good with the bad though, and hope in time you can iron out the weaknesses. On balance, I'd probably say yes, go for him. Depending on how Tottingham do this year, they may be looking for closer to the finished article. And Levy has demonstrated in the past that he'll do a deal if he likes the price, regardless of what his manager at the time thinks. It would probably take a bid somewhere in the region of £10 million to get them interested (or some kind of trade with Ash, which I'd rather avoid TBH), but I reckon it could be done. Not sure about Hutton though. Losing Walker and gaining Hutton would be like losing a fiver and gaining herpes.

Fully agree. The first Nike kit in particular may be viewed as a classic in a few years, synonymous with our breakthrough season too. This years effort filled me with dread as soon as I viewed it, it looked like the over elaborate Hummel effort of 2005/06 and I had what I thought at the time to be an irrational fear that our season might go the same way. Though oddly, the checks don't look quite as vile on the away kit. You'd have to go a long way to ruin an all black strip though. I'd like to see us stick with Nike if we can get back to the standard we initially had, simplicity should be the key. No chevrons, checks or any other bobbins.

Would agree with a fair amount of it but sacking GH now would damage the clubs reputation significantly. That, for me, is why I would pull back for now. Of course, it might come down to a stark lesser-of-two evils scenario if we're still struggling in a few months. Do we damage the reputation of the club by sacking him, opening ourselves up to the obvious criticism that it was a bad choice from the outset or that we're impulsive? Or do we damage the club be letting him take us down? Aside from the miserable last week and a bit, I still think we have more than enough to stay up this season. It shouldn't even be a discussion, but it is owing to our defence and the poverty of performance on Monday night. The hope is that GH can -at the very least- ensure that we're still in the top flight next year. Regardless of any issues surrounding the club this summer and the injury situation that shouldn't even be an issue. If we can get through to the summer, relatively unscathed in an around mid-table (or slightly lower) we can then reassess. We would then have a whole summer to decide whether GH has enough about him to go a stage further or whether to cut our losses and pay out the final year of his contract (not a huge burden, in the grand scheme of things). This also gives us time to check on the progress of potential candidates such as Di Matteo, Coyle, Jol or any other names who might be linked. There is a danger of course that the likes of Di Matteo and Coyle are flavour of the month type names, as likely to be on the dole queue in 12 months as they are to be in a bigger job. See Pearce, Pardew, Zola and countless many more examples. Nevertheless, after having a manager in GH seemingly happy to live of past successes and coast the obvious contrast to that would be a young, hungry manager looking to make a name for himself. Someone who sees the Villa gig as a step up and wants to create his own successful memories with us, rather than looking at newspaper cuttings of his glory days. That's one outcome. If GH has a strong finish to the season and we finish in and around 6th again the job will be his for the foreseeable. If we finish any lower than say 14th, the hope would be that he does the decent thing and falls on his sword.

Can you see it now? Can you really? I can honestly say to you - yes if we had of won you would have seen completely different comments If we had won 38 games last season we'd have been champions. We didn't. Just as Gh's team (or the one he currently manages) didn't win on Monday. So we'll never fully know what the reaction would have been had we won on Monday because that wasn't the reality. What was the grim, meathook reality of the whole sorry affair was that the manager -after as gutless a team performance as you could possibly wish to see- followed that up with an ode to his former love post match. I can't think of supporters of any other club tolerating that kind of behaviour so why should we be the exception.

^^ Exactly. Last time I heard such downplaying, negative patter was from DOL. Not the only thing that pair seem to have in common.

I'd like to see that happen, I genuinely would. But for that to occur would most likely mean one of two things: (1) we have a crop of talent breaking through that only West Ham, Leeds and Man U would have been able to rival in the last decade and a bit (2) We're content to tread water in mid-table and the standard of player needed isn't so high. I sincerely hope that we have at least five players from the youth team who go on to have big careers for us and form the nucleus of the side. But I'd say the odds are stacked against that volume of numbers breaking through- unless we settle for mid/lower table. As a recent example, if that was acceptable for us Ridgewell, Craig Gardener, Steve Davis, Cahill, Luke Moore and co would still be good enough for us now. Again using those players as an example we can say with a fair degree of accuracy that our academy is decent and produces enough talent to make it sustainable and worthwhile. But is it really capable of churning out 5-6 special players? The players needed who could go on to form the backbone of a successful Villa side because - let's not forget- that's ultimately what it's all about. Realistically I think we'd be doing well to have two at tops three of the names you mentioned carving out long term careers for us. If I was a betting man I'd say Albrighton, Gary Gardner and possibly Clark. Everyone should know what Albrighton is about at this stage - he's quality and looks like he's been playing in the top flight for years. Gary Gardner could be a monster for us. Good touch, technique and decent height and frame -which is useful in the English game. I've also heard good things about Halfhuid. He was playing to a pretty decent standard in Holland with Excelsior and we actually paid money for him. By no means a guarantee, but he must have something.

Dunne was our Player of the Year last season Archie. He hasn't become a bad player overnight. But he is struggling at the moment and I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team until his knee is somewhat better (It's never going to cured) and he loses at least a stone in weight. Collins is a traditional British CB - with the added benefit of decent distribution from the back (though this has gone to seed in recent months). Both are good players, but both could do with competition to keep them on their toes and if Cuellar plays well, he should stay in the side.

He has a long standing knee injury from his time at Citeh that needs to be managed, hence why he's missed a fair bit of training pre and early season and sat out most of the training sessions for Ireland this week. Also explains (though doesn't fully excuse) his weight this year.

Dunne all over the place again tonight for Ireland. He's not the only one to blame by any means, but he looks a shadow of the player we seen last season. In answer to the poll it would have to be Dunne and Collins when Dunne is fit. But he clearly isn't. There is no point having a player as good as Cuellar if he's not going to be utilised in times like these.

Aye. Far better than the current lot.

Nike, but they need to up their game. The first effort was quality, and will probably be viewed as a classic in a few years. The second - so so. The third - down again. This years is horrid, brings back memories of the duff kit we had in 2005/06. That might be OK for hummel, you'd expect better from Nike. The away one is decent though, and the training range/ casual polo shirts always look sharp. If we had to change I'd go umbro, fond memories of the title winning side and BFR's lot in 1992/93.

Worth every penny. Did they show the shark pool under the kitchen, with the glass floor?

I was accused of having it once by some bastard who was out to get me. I'm not paranoid because I know you're all out to get me.

Which is all fine, in theory. But how will you feel if he goes the DOL/ MON route of deflecting blame onto the supporters? If he brings a measure of success such things tend to get overlooked. But he is operating under far less favourable conditions than he enjoyed at Liverpool (biggest spenders between 1999-2002) and Lyon, and he had an enduring reputation for being fractious and divisive even at those clubs.

That's pretty much where I'm at. I have concerns that he has some very DOL and latterday MON tendencies to blame anyone and anything but himself. That's my overriding memory from his time at the Redscouse, and it doesn't sound like he's changed all that much. I also have some pretty major doubts about his ability to stay the course. He seemed to be in wind-down mode, out of the immediate glare of the spotlight and all the pressure associated with a standard managers job. Lets face it, there weren't many major clubs either in England or abroad beating a path to his door, begging him to manage them in the last few years. Managers like players have a shelf life, and maybe he is close (or has possibly even exceeded) his. In the interests of balance, his CV at the various club sides he has managed is very impressive, the hope is we can benefit from his knowledge and contacts.

I think he was hoping for some "LOL! Lets slag our own fans!" type responses. But it is a bit arse, isn't it?

You sir are a DISGRACE. Fancy coming on here and talking common **** sense. What kind of supporter are you? I don't want to hear from fans who actually listen to whats being said, I want to hear from people who take their Gospel from the tabloids thank you very much. I bet you're one of these old school fans who go down VP week in week out and support the team good or bad. SHAMEFUL! It's a unique form of common sense that ignores direct quotes from the horses mouth. How do you reconcile the two? "I have more common sense because I choose to be ignorant of the facts and applaud anyone else who does likewise." Is that it? Curious. And I guess anyone else who doesn't fit this narrow 'ignorance is bliss' criteria isn't a true Villa fan? Or not 'old school.' I see.

I think whoever he selects will hopefully understand and will be grateful for the chance to work for one of the biggest sides in one of the best leagues in the world.

Litigation being what it is today I don't think newspapers would make up direct quotes. Take them out of context perhaps, or if you see cop outs such as 'a source said..' you can question the accuracy. But direct quotes? No. Or 'Non,' to keep it current.

That doesn't matter that's over games played, he is talking about league positions. The avg since the prem started. And you know that how? Sorry, I didn't see that clarification in his comments as reported. You might wish it to be so to suit your argument, but he mentioned nothing about averages, median values or anything else. At a stroke, he effectively labelled us as midtable fodder. On a par with Sunderland, Wigan, Bolton et.c It's incorrect, for the reasons outlined above. Why you do you think you're correct? Why does any of this even matter? so what if he said that....Are you going to jump up and down until someone hears you screaming? I just don't know why everyone is making a big deal about all this crap, if he takes us forward great...What he has said to the French press don't mean balls, we don't even know what questions he was asked for starters. I don't need to scream chap, I'm not seven. Judging by the calibre of your argument you might be though. At best, his arguments were ill informed. At worst, it presents an insight into how he views the club. His perception is 7th-12th, he was quite clear about that. It also ties in with his comments a few years ago when both ourselves and Lyon were looking to sign Milan Baros: "I can't understand why any ambitious player would join a mid-table club like Aston Villa." Ultimately I won't care a jot if he delivers where it matters -on the pitch. I recall Richard Dunne referring to us as a "nice, family club" on joining, making us sound like some homely lower division outfit. In the final analysis, balanced against his contribution on the park it mattered little. But you would prefer to see you manager, perhaps the most high profile figure at the club batting for you, not doing you down in print. Sorry if that troubles you, but there it is.

That doesn't matter that's over games played, he is talking about league positions. The avg since the prem started. And you know that how? Sorry, I didn't see that clarification in his comments as reported. You might wish it to be so to suit your argument, but he mentioned nothing about averages, median values or anything else. At a stroke, he effectively labelled us as midtable fodder. On a par with Sunderland, Wigan, Bolton et.c It's incorrect, for the reasons outlined above.

I'm not sure any of that matters. He said it, and he said it after he had basically got the Villa job. If he thought because he was talking to the French media in French it wouldn't find its way to England then he's a little foolish. And it doesn't matter that he said it in the past tense. Firstly, it's still wrong. And secondly, saying it in the past tense is still planting the seed about the level he is going to elevate the club from. Spot on chap. *We've finished top 6 the past three seasons (and in two of those campaigns we looked like we were on for even better). * We're something like 5th in the all time Prem league *And we're still the 4th most succesful side in English football history. GH might want to lower expectations, ably abetted by some Villa fans it seems. But the above makes a mockery of his 7th-12th summary. Unless he was referring to the brief window he was last in English football. That in itself would be a worry, that he hasn't kept in touch with the English game during his time out and isn't aware of our progress. It would beg the question what else is he unaware of?

I don't think that stacks up TBF. MON had the overwhelming support of the vast majority of match going Villa fans. Indeed, I'd go as far as to say there have been more successful managers (like BFR, Brian Little) who weren't as popular. Not that they were unpopular, you understand. More that the support MON enjoyed was closer to hero worship at times. Fans questioning decisions either in the pub or on internet messageboards is part and parcel of the game. Perhaps his overall appeal was starting to wane. It would have been interesting to see what kind of reaction he would have generated had he overseen a sluggish start to the season or individual results like Newcastle and Rapid Vienna at home. We'll never know - the timing of his departure ensured that if nothing else. Ultimately he enjoyed more favourable conditions than any Villa manager in living memory, popular extended support from the fans and strong financial backing that outstripped even the likes of Manure, Liverpool and Arsenal in recent seasons. Even with all that he still decided to bail when he did. It's history now. GH as an appointment might not have generated the same level of excitement that MON's did back in 2006 - or even DOL's did in 2003. Instead, there might be closer parallels with Fulham's appointment of Woy back in 98. That wasn't an arrival greeted with huge fanfare either. But if -like Woy managed for Fulham- we exceed expectations under GH, I don't think many will ultimately care.

You can't on the one hand apply (or extend) that label to a fellow Villa fan CVB, and then try to claim the moral high ground. You are probably in a minority in so far as you seem to be so forgiving of MON departing when he did. Possibly because you initially blamed the board and -having set that position- now feel you can't backtrack. O'Neill did a solid job. Delivered results (though not often performances) about par for the money spent, and occasionally looked like he could deliver a form of success. However his limitations -be that an almost neurotic fear of changing tactics ( or fear of change in general) did for him in the end. That and an outdated, almost agricultural approach to football. The hope is that GH can drag us kicking and screaming into the 21st century. His trophy haul far exceeds that of MON and his name carries more weight on the continent. It could be a crucial stage in our development. I truly hope it is, rather than another wasted opportunity.

The likes of Mellberg, Merson and even Laursen have had that kind of tag applied to them in recent years -incorrectly in my book, as only a very few elite players fit that criteria- but it has been said all the same. Stan was part of Villa teams that competed for the title and bagged two league cups and yet the reaction his name generates amongst a fair few Villa fans is casual indifference at best. No. This one: Hope this helps. I must confess the relevance of the above is not jumping out at me. In the context of Staunton leaving or this thread, this doesn't make a lick of sense. I don't recall Stan mentioning anything about the accent, Birmingham as a city or any other bobbins -indeed someone who is maybe sensitive to regional accents would probably choose Liverpool as the last place on earth to move to. But thanks for the rare insight into your family life, I think.