TRO

I appreciate your comments, but still say they seem paradoxical to me you make references to "looking for evidence" to negate your doubt in him, but you equally have no evidence to the contrary, but you seem to have chosen to accept that as your default position. i think some of us see him as a success, until he proves he is a failure.....and some see him as a failure until he proves he is a success......by definition, some will be happy Now, some will have to wait, I'm afraid. I accept you reserve the right to have doubt in his ability and I accept that you are not blaming him for our overall state. However, what I fail to understand is when a team is in transition, why are comments being made that insinuate we are the finished article.The team won't be the free flowing blow the opposition away force that we ALL want to see. I can't speak for the man himself, but I am sure by his comments that he is clear on the strengths and weaknesses of his team.....These things take time to fully fix, so is it any wonder that when still see flaws is part of the journey. It may wel be this team will look different again in A few seasons time , in having to improve each players attributes. Steve has started out with an impressive start, then hit a rocky spell of losing 2 key players and stumbling in to window that could have been 2 months earlier ideally....He has now found some form once again as his players are getting to know how each other operates. Progress, too, is not ALL plain sailing.....it is quite customary to zig zag your way to success. UTV

you explain your position well. However, I do feel that your support for Bruce is a tad begrudging and that until we are turning teams over every week, that will continue to be the case. I would respectfully ask you to consider divorcing the current manager from the demise of the past and refrain from associating your frustration with him......judge him on what he has done to trying to turn around a football team that has fallen far from grace faster than an astronaut from space. The demise and mismanagement of our precious club, is almost unprecedented, very few clubs have been so poorly served for so long and that damage is no small feat to remedy and has required far more than just a football manager......the whole place needs time to gel. The fans that never wanted Bruce in the first place are not going to be convinced in the early stages of his address.....mainly because the rate of improvement will be at its slowest, that is customary in these types of circumstances When a job like this is taken on,the rate of improvement varies and inevitably the slowest signs are at the beginning,that rate will accelerate on the back of good work and solid foundations and all the staff pulling in the same direction( which wasn't the case, it was toxic, the place was a war zone ) The fans are a Kaleidascope of personalities all tying their emotions to the claret and blue flag......some will see the "shoots of recovery" before others.....others will be less convinced until they see the evidence staring them in the face.....No one is more right than the other. I hear some fans say......what do you see now,that I don't.That is a very difficult question to answer, but I will say this......Something's in this game repeat themselves over and over again.i have seen scenario's like this before at our club, not the same, but similar.It takes a much work from many to change. Only everyone concerned pulling in the same direction, will have the desired affect. I do not possess the powers to convince others.....but I am convinced in my own mind that we are on the road back.....despite the snail like pace at times, its happening. It would be lacking in empathy to ask for patience in light of the last 10 years.....but I would respectfully ask fans on here, to not be so hard on themselves and have more faith in what is being attempted. Enjoy the ride back to respectability, guys......I think it will be fun.

I don't think that has ever been intimated, not in that context anyway. You have to be careful......There is nothing so destructive as some one making an effort to put things right and living with a judgment of expectancy that is unreasonable. It makes you weary.

ditto. good post Pete.

I don't mean this in a nasty way......but you best comeback when we are fixed.....otherwise, its going to be a miserable time.Personally I love watching us getting gradually better from one month to another....there will be some knock backs for sure.....but the good runs will gradually out do the bad ones and then you know is changing.....apart from watching the games. Whether its a government , whether its a business or whether its a household that has got in to dire debt.....It takes time.....It is callow to think otherwise. If,you are somehow not able to grasp that.....You will beat yourself up over this, but no manager was ever going to fix this in the timescale you are seemingly looking for. I too want wins first, but as other posters have written the football is not entirely right yet, so its not eye candy......the defence is better, but the attacking play is no where near right.....first things first, we have to slowly build on it. You cannot even attempt to link Steve Bruce with the shenanigans of the last 6 years.....its brutal to even think it.....so give him a chance. No one is suggesting that 5 wins is a new trend......there is simply still too much work to do, to get in to that......but the work is ongoing and you are talking as if it has finished. you say "the poison needs to be eliminated"......what on earth do you think he is trying to do. That's the road he is on. He has just had 4 wins in 5 and 4 clean sheets and he is talking in terms of only just starting......He himself has said we are only just starting. What this is tantamount to is going up to the site agent when Canary Wharf was being built and asking when can i see something worth looking at, when they were just putting in the footings in .......The response would probably have ended in............OFF

Ditto. but thats what costs us money.

I'd happily accept any player back.....that is good enough. And they HAVE to prove they are.

Hopefully moving forward, we might try looking at the character of the player too.

We have done it so many times over the years.....unsophisticated scouting...... Guy whitingham instead of Paul Walsh Tony Cascarino instead of Teddy Sheringham we buy Curtis Davies for 10 mill and sell Cahill for 5 mill Idrissa Gueye willl probably go for a fortune. We just looks at stats, before looking at the player....However,I think the new lot are more savvy, so the nonsense is hopefully coming to an end.

Didier Six?

I'm with you......I remember Ken McNaught having c20 games of doubters. then he was just formidable....Some do take some time. I think Scott Hogan will be the business for us, when he settles and gets used to his surroundings.

4-3-3 for me. but I thought Conte's formation the other night against Utd was novel......3-4-3. I suppose it depends on the attributes of your players and the strengths and weaknesses of the opposition. but I believe in K.I.S.S.

Sorry, I was just using the comparison of waiting for something to come good.....as I believe it was a good analogy. but yes, I do accept not everyone will agree, so I am with you.

Blimey, you are unlucky......villa fan and remoaner. just kidding mate.....I wished I hadn't mentioned it

I would prefer a Carbone to a Gil.

I don't see the current style of football that we are witnessing as reflective of what the manager wants.i see it as a means to an end to build resilience to restore confidence to secure wins. Its all about priority. I read Terry's(tini) posts with interest and he is beside himself with the style of play.....if it was the finished article so would I be. This team will develop in to something credible and worth watching, but not just yet......culture takes time to change as does belief. it is clear Steve has focussed on the lack of physical attribute in the team, we have been a soft touch for years.....that had to be addressed......but while you are trying to hone those elements it's difficult to concentrate on the finer points at the same time.....its called development......I.e gradual improvement. What Terry sees is not good and we all know that. My salvation is I am absolutely sure this regime will deliver a watchable team that wins. just like Brexit.......we have to wait patiently

Wins.........they make Transition so much more civilised.

Its like the old saying....." you must have seen a different game to me"........ironically, we probably have. ...... because we are watching the game through our own eyes not someone elses and we all have different views in the main. We all have different interpretations of what has been on display.....for me that is the spice of it all, not the frustration. I guess if a 1,000 of us looked at the Mona Lisa there would be 1,000 different versions. Thats Football.

Terry I am not telling you Steve Bruce is anything other than WIP.......Its my defence of that situation, is maybe making you believe I am. Please do not misconstrue what I am saying here. I just happen to believe he is working his way through a car crash and that the things to be put right may take longer than we all thought.....I maybe wrong, but I am convinced I am right. I see what you see on match day and I admit it is not pretty.....but if it was the finished article I would be worried, but its not, far from it. This thing was never going to be fixed quickly by any manager. I accept you want to see better football and I suspect Steve Bruce does too......but he can't fix everything at once. No one can tell you the football is good, if you don't think it is, its your opinion and I respect that......my point is give him time to fix a mammoth task. I repeat myself ......This what we are watching, is far from the finished article (if in fact, there is such a thing, but you know what I mean) Ps No one can convince you Terry, you have to go with your own thoughts. I am comfortable we will have a good side in the not too distant future.....the problem is no one can put a time to that.

..........I'll second that emotion.

He hasn't got the physicality this league requires. sad but its true......slightly built playmakers get taken out very easily, unless they are atuned to it( like last night Chelsea v Man U).....you have to be able to impose yourself phyiscally to give yourself the space to play.

And then he became unlucky and now he is lucky again.

In all of those games, different problems we have had ,have undone us.There are so many, due to the state of the team. its almost folly to try and appraise this season.....its WIP for example. we never had the resilience we have now against Blues.....this team would have beaten them. We had so many new faces in Jan, I can't take the games seriously, honestly.....its so hard to form any reasonable opinion, such was the disruption. Kodjia is a special talent and we need to blend him more in to team play, I think that will happen. but there are plenty of examples of top strikers carrying teams....Suarez,Henry,Shearer. its a plus not a minus. as a part of the rebuild we will get more players scoring. .......don't criticise, as if we are the finished article.....we are far from it.

I have never been so confident as in the last 20 years that we have the right set up and are on the right lines I have witnessed, rebuilds with Ron Saunders, Graham Taylor, Brian Little and John Gregory.....Martin O'Neill to a degree. We are on our way back.....how long it will take, I have no idea, but I will not be put off by a slow build. sometimes ,when it's too quick it's less sustainable.

I don't think you are setting the bar too high.....I think you are setting it too soon. This team will be all what you want to be in due course, we are in transition. you will only see bits and pieces if improvement and it will gradually become more evident like a jig saw puzzle takes shape. some fans want the picture complete before some of the pieces have been picked up. GH I feel your passion and it's commendable, but give the guy a chance and more importantly give him time to do the job, he knows what's required and it's not there yet, we all know that.