Chindie Posted January 7, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted January 7, 2011 Bizarre subs and team choices Falling out with an awful lot of people Woefully inadequate performances Constant ability to put his foot in it, began from the moment he started right through to his post match comments the other night. Including his hilarious Ireland turn around that made him look a fool. Off the top of my head, and I'm confident theres more because theres nothing about the fellow that's been good. He's just not very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiDanger Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Perhaps it's time to again look at the stated facts about Houllier: Q1: Were the team performing well under Kevin Mac A1: No. Q2: Were the team performing well pre-season under MON: A2: No. Q3: Did Houliier have chance to put things in order pre-season: A3: No. Q4: Was Houllier involved in the Milner-Ireland switch: A4: No. Q5: Has the team suffered considerable injury problems: A5: Yes. Q6: Until now, has Houllier had chance to make purchases: A6: No. Q7: Has Houllier the right to sort out the lackies in the team: A7: Yes ---------- The only issues against Houllier that I can make out are: 1. Matters re: his alleged allegiance to Liverpool (which I feel fans misunderstand, but perhaps that's me) 2. Failure to sort out the concession of goals in the last 10 minutes (which is perhaps the most serious) 3. His age and length of time out of the Prem (neither of which are his fault, and age is hardly a barrier) Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :| Team in the relegation zone? I have no personal dislike of GH but even if you had no pre-conceptions of him when appointed you must see that we have underperformed this season. I'm undecided on whether to sack him or not as I think long term it could be great for the club but not if we get relegated and I'm not 100% convinced we won't be, I don't see how anyone could be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginko Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 The only things against Houller I think you might have missed John, are the fact that he changed the playing style too quickly, we simply do not have the players who are capable, and also that he seems to be a bit too naive and loose-lipped when concerning the media. I agree he has the right to tell players where to go if they give him grief, and no-one knows the truth behind these bust-ups but it seems he may have unnecessarily burnt a few bridges with some players who could really help us out right about now. Apart from that, I pretty much agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverPeacock Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I might be wrong but has Albrighton started a game since it was alluded to that he and Houllier had an argument after the Mancity game? Only been two games but he was dropped to the bench for both. It was also alluded he had an argument with Lichaj, and now Kyle Walker has signed on loan. Read into it what you will. Echo Villarocker's thoughts on Downing, very good on the left and useless on the right in my opinion. Houllier needs to stop pessisting with Young through the middle too, even if it means losing him in the long term, as it just isn't helping out chances of winning games at all. I voted sacked, guarantee we will be firmly in the drop zone come february, fortunately the fixture list improves from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Most of those issues have come out of rumour and without Houllier's version of the story, am I correct? (Sorry, that was replying to Chindie) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :| Without advocating anything I think you missed the essential point that is driving fans against him. Houllier has been in charge for the majority of our season and performances have been at an all time low. Whether that is all/part or majority his fault is open to debate of course, though most fans who want him out will be attributing most of the problems to Houllier I would guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fran_villa Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Perhaps it's time to again look at the stated facts about Houllier: Q1: Were the team performing well under Kevin Mac A1: No. Q2: Were the team performing well pre-season under MON: A2: No. Q3: Did Houliier have chance to put things in order pre-season: A3: No. Q4: Was Houllier involved in the Milner-Ireland switch: A4: No. Q5: Has the team suffered considerable injury problems: A5: Yes. Q6: Until now, has Houllier had chance to make purchases: A6: No. Q7: Has Houllier the right to sort out the lackies in the team: A7: Yes ---------- The only issues against Houllier that I can make out are: 1. Matters re: his alleged allegiance to Liverpool (which I feel fans misunderstand, but perhaps that's me) 2. Failure to sort out the concession of goals in the last 10 minutes (which is perhaps the most serious) 3. His age and length of time out of the Prem (neither of which are his fault, and age is hardly a barrier) Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :|So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 The only things against Houller I think you might have missed John, are the fact that he changed the playing style too quickly, we simply do not have the players who are capable, and also that he seems to be a bit too naive and loose-lipped when concerning the media. I agree he has the right to tell players where to go if they give him grief, and no-one knows the truth behind these bust-ups but it seems he may have unnecessarily burnt a few bridges with some players who could really help us out right about now. Apart from that, I pretty much agree. Fair points, though I'm not sure which of the fallen-out players would be such a great help, particularly Carew. Ireland's situation is a great pity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted January 7, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted January 7, 2011 Most of those issues have come out of rumour and without Houllier's version of the story, am I correct? (Sorry, that was replying to Chindie) I'm not sure his weird teams and subs have been rumour. Cuellar dropping jumps immediately to mind. Nor have the awful performances - he's actually been making us worse. He's employed to make us better. And all the putting his foot in it is straight from the horses mouth. There are quotes saying that Irelands done here IIRC, and then quotes saying no, wait, he has a future. And then he doesn't give him the opportunity to make that future by not allowing him in the squad. Hes indefensibly bad. And should be counting himself lucky he's employed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that 0-6 at Newcastle? Europa Cup exit? I can't agree with your first para either; that's based on rumour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :| Without advocating anything I think you missed the essential point that is driving fans against him. Houllier has been in charge for the majority of our season and performances have been at an all time low. Whether that is all/part or majority his fault is open to debate of course, though most fans who want him out will be attributing most of the problems to Houllier I would guess. Well, yes Neil, my list was trying to point out that the results come from the real causes, i.m.o. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Perhaps it's time to again look at the stated facts about Houllier: Q1: Were the team performing well under Kevin Mac A1: No. Q2: Were the team performing well pre-season under MON: A2: No. Q3: Did Houliier have chance to put things in order pre-season: A3: No. Q4: Was Houllier involved in the Milner-Ireland switch: A4: No. Q5: Has the team suffered considerable injury problems: A5: Yes. Q6: Until now, has Houllier had chance to make purchases: A6: No. Q7: Has Houllier the right to sort out the lackies in the team: A7: Yes ---------- The only issues against Houllier that I can make out are: 1. Matters re: his alleged allegiance to Liverpool (which I feel fans misunderstand, but perhaps that's me) 2. Failure to sort out the concession of goals in the last 10 minutes (which is perhaps the most serious) 3. His age and length of time out of the Prem (neither of which are his fault, and age is hardly a barrier) Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :|So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that Maybe the players should "man up" if they cant handle a bit of over hyped press talk...The media ask Houllier why players are not selected and he tells it like it is..Its up to the players to have Houllier reporting good stuff(which he does)by putting in good performances.. I can remember some of the stuff Brian Clough used to call his players in the press too..Houllier is very mild compared to Cloughie.. Ron Atkinson is another thats talked to the press about players under form,mis behaving etc.. Your just nit picking mate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conorm Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :| Without advocating anything I think you missed the essential point that is driving fans against him. Houllier has been in charge for the majority of our season and performances have been at an all time low. Whether that is all/part or majority his fault is open to debate of course, though most fans who want him out will be attributing most of the problems to Houllier I would guess. Don't think anyone is debating whether we are playing well or not. The debate is how it has come about. John's list is the argument against the motion that Houlllier is mostly to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fran_villa Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that 0-6 at Newcastle? Europa Cup exit? I can't agree with your first para either; that's based on rumour.what so he didn't go to the press and knock Ireland??.6-0 to Newcastle yes, but we have shipped more goals to games under GH than K Mac, atleast the players wanted to play for K Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fran_villa Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Perhaps it's time to again look at the stated facts about Houllier: Q1: Were the team performing well under Kevin Mac A1: No. Q2: Were the team performing well pre-season under MON: A2: No. Q3: Did Houliier have chance to put things in order pre-season: A3: No. Q4: Was Houllier involved in the Milner-Ireland switch: A4: No. Q5: Has the team suffered considerable injury problems: A5: Yes. Q6: Until now, has Houllier had chance to make purchases: A6: No. Q7: Has Houllier the right to sort out the lackies in the team: A7: Yes ---------- The only issues against Houllier that I can make out are: 1. Matters re: his alleged allegiance to Liverpool (which I feel fans misunderstand, but perhaps that's me) 2. Failure to sort out the concession of goals in the last 10 minutes (which is perhaps the most serious) 3. His age and length of time out of the Prem (neither of which are his fault, and age is hardly a barrier) Anything I've missed apart from personal dislikes? :|So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that Maybe the players should "man up" if they cant handle a bit of over hyped press talk...The media ask Houllier why players are not selected and he tells it like it is..Its up to the players to have Houllier reporting good stuff(which he does)by putting in good performances.. I can remember some of the stuff Brian Clough used to call his players in the press too..Houllier is very mild compared to Cloughie.. Ron Atkinson is another thats talked to the press about players under form,mis behaving etc.. Your just nit picking mate!Well if thats the case fans shouldn't be pissing there pants over Pires saying stuff to the media either. GH has always been a media whore anyway soi'm not surprised at that, I'm more surprised that he has dragged the life and soul out of this club since he got here.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that 0-6 at Newcastle? Europa Cup exit? I can't agree with your first para either; that's based on rumour.what so he didn't go to the press and knock Ireland??.6-0 to Newcastle yes, but we have shipped more goals to games under GH than K Mac, atleast the players wanted to play for K Mac. OK, yes, he "went to the press" ... but he's certainly not the first manager to do that. My feeling is that some of the most successful managers have done that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 So, nothing about him running to the press to bash his players and knocking every bit of confidance out of the team. the man is a disaster The team where performing better under K Mac than they are now, wins to games ratio shows that 0-6 at Newcastle? Europa Cup exit? I can't agree with your first para either; that's based on rumour.what so he didn't go to the press and knock Ireland??.6-0 to Newcastle yes, but we have shipped more goals to games under GH than K Mac, atleast the players wanted to play for K Mac. Im glad he went to the press and knocked Ireland...Im also glad he isnt held to ransom over these big egotistic players...Ive found Houllier very fair,if you work hard in training and perform in the match you get picked..If you arse about,dont take the club serious,you get dropped,reguardless of how big ya name is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fran_villa Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 And tbh, if he was in any way a decent manager why aren't players coming out and backing him up?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beasley14 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Well if we have signed Walker, Bridge and Makoun by next weekend i will be a bit impressed. Gives competition/improves the team in areas we have been very poor this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Lerwill Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 And tbh, if he was in any way a decent manager why aren't players coming out and backing him up?. Perhaps they think too much of themselves and/or they had too much of an easy time under MON? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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