kkr Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 I was going to post a topic in here about this subject but came across the following article on nfl.com. After this past weekend of wild-card action, it's clear the QB Class of 2004 is officially a success. If I told you four years ago that the money spent on the top three quarterbacks in the first round of the 2004 draft would guarantee that all would deliver a playoff win by their fourth season, most would agree it was money well spent. Ben Roethlisberger won a Super Bowl in his second year, Eli Manning made the playoffs three years in a row and got his first postseason win Sunday, and Rivers wrapped it up his first playoff victory in two tries in the late game on Sunday. Big Ben, Manning and Rivers are not finished products by any means, but the teams that drafted them are not afraid of the next contract; the future looks bright for the next 6-8 years for those three guys, barring injury, of course. They have already played in a combined 12 playoff games, and Rivers and Manning are guaranteed at least one more. Fourteen playoff games in four seasons is pretty darn good. Take a look at their numbers over the first four years, including playoffs. They may not be the 1983 draft of Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Kenny O'Brien, but they have a chance to do some great things, and none of them are a bust. Don't forget that Matt Schaub is also a member of the class of 2004. As the draft talks start up in earnest in the coming weeks, keep in mind the NFL is a quarterback-driven league. And if anyone in the draft looks at all like Roethlisberger, Manning or Rivers, a team has to take him and hope he delivers like these guys have so far: 218 touchdown passes in four years and a few postseason appearances before their rookie contract is up. Undoubtedly a great QB class and one that could go down as the greatest of all time, so the obvious question is if you had to pick one of the three for your team who do you take and why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted January 8, 2008 Moderator Share Posted January 8, 2008 Big Ben. Rivers is sh1te and isn't even a consideration. Manning could be the choice in a year or two, but right now it's Roethlisberger for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted January 9, 2008 Author Share Posted January 9, 2008 Ben has the ring but that is no thanks to his own play in that game, coming off with the worst QB rating in a Super Bowl ever. I'm hoping Manning is coming good now after his two fine performances against the PATs and Buccs, two leading Defenses. If he can have a similar effect against Dallas and lead us to victory Sunday then i think that he will have arrived finally and there is no one else id rather have than a talented member of the Manning family calling the shots for my Offense. Having said that Ben has had the biggest impact in the league so far with he most consistent level of play also but i would put that down to smart game planning/play calling for him in his early years that helped him develop gradually whereas Eli has been thrown in from the beginning and expected to be the guy. Rivers spent a year learning the offence as an understudy to Brees which he benefited from and also the ability of Cam Cameron as a O coordinator also. With him gone however he has looked less than stellar this year under Norv Turner and perhaps this is due to a change in philosophy or something but who knows. Rivers and Manning both obtained their first playoff wins the wildcard weekend and i think from here both players look set up to have great success in the future. Both teams run the ball well and have a lot of weapons which will allow both players to grow further. I wonder what the odds are of all these guys finishing their careers with a ring for their own? Ben has his and the other two are still alive this year with a real outside shot at getting theirs this year but i hope Rivers doesn't get it before Manning if at all as that will then Justify the trade the Giants made for Manning which essentially saw them give up Rivers, Merriman and Kaeding all who have been pro bowl selections to get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted January 9, 2008 Author Share Posted January 9, 2008 I am also a massive Giants Homer so i was bound to pick Manning! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted January 9, 2008 VT Supporter Share Posted January 9, 2008 The Chargers have made two great draft-day trades this decade, demonstrating that AJ Smith is one of the top two or three executives in the NFL. In '01, they traded the first pick to the Falcons. The Falcons picked Michael Vick with that selection and the Chargers picked Ladainian Tomlinson. I think we know who got the better of that deal. The other was of course, the Rivers/Manning trade that you mention (though in fairness, the Chargers wouldn't have been able to make that trade had Brees not regressed in his second and third seasons). On that parenthetical point, I think Rivers will still do just fine; this season was simply the sophomore slump that many quarterbacks have (Big Ben and Tom Brady each had lackluster second seasons in the starting role, to name two recent examples, though it should be noted that Manning and Palmer had better second seasons and that Tony Romo was about the same). EDITs to correct and clarify: Rivers' good season was his sophomore season, but he took a massive step back in '03... by Manning I mean Peyton; the maddening thing about Eli, if I was a Giant fan, is that he's still so inconsistent. I also meant to include a bit mentioning that any young athlete who decides to get married before moving to San Diego (as Rivers did) has a screw loose somewhere. I'm sure 3_Penny_Opera can back me up that San Diego has perhaps more hot chicks per capita than probably any other city in America; a twentysomething millionaire should be able to pull top-quality babes seven days a week. At least try being single in San Diego for a year, Phil.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted January 9, 2008 Moderator Share Posted January 9, 2008 I'd wonder whether the Chargers still regret letting Brees go. OK politics, pride & money probably meant they couldn't keep him, but if it was a straight choice now I'd say they'd have him. I certainly would. Brees is one of the top passers in the league whereas Rivers is carried by LT and anything he does achieve in the air is due in a large part to the opposition keeping their safeties as backup linebackers against LT. Take LT out of that offence and Rivers and the Chargers would fall apart. It's a house of cards and (here comes the bias) I hope and pray Manning knocks three shades of sh1te out of them at the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerniesElbow Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I went with the pedigree and took Manning. No way I could a take goofball who grew up in Ohio and says he always rooted for the Squealers. Overrated frontrunner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Even as a Giants fan, I had to say Big Ben for this one. Rivers is slightly above average at best, and will never be a top QB in my opinion. Roethlisberger, this season at least, is clearly the best of the class, but he was dreadful last year. Eli is a weird one, he can be untouchable at times, but then have a shocker the next week. I believe he will become the best of the class, well, hopefully.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted February 9, 2008 Author Share Posted February 9, 2008 Got to be Eli now surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 10, 2008 Moderator Share Posted February 10, 2008 Why ? Your defence won that superbowl despite the ridiculous MVP decision. If Roethlisberger was in that position he'd have won it too. The discussion is not who has the most rings. The discussion is who is the best QB (without supporting cast), and at the moment Big Ben is the best of the bunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted February 10, 2008 VT Supporter Share Posted February 10, 2008 And Big Ben won his ring by handing off the ball... 9/21, 123 yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 10, 2008 Moderator Share Posted February 10, 2008 This discussion is nothing to do with how a ring was won or even whether a ring was won. It is purely how good the QB is and of the 3 who you'd like as your starter. If we're talking rings and how the acquisition of them is meaningless then I give you Dan Marino & Trent Dilfer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted February 10, 2008 Author Share Posted February 10, 2008 Two QB's have throw for 2TD's in the fourth quarter of a Super Bowl, one of them is Joe Montana. While the defence was the deciding factor i would still go with Manning as MVP because of those two drives, especially the last one. Down four points, Super Bowl on the line against potentially the greatest team of all time and Eli took us 83 yards in two minutes for the score and made THAT play (which i think has been trademarked by the tyree family as "the miracle in the desert"!) as well as some other clutch throws on third down. The Steelers won the SB off of Willie Parker's breakaway speed and Bettis up the middle, Big Ben is the lowest rated QB in Super Bowl history. Id choose Manning because this post season he has proven that he can manage the game and as he has done before (notably against denver :winkold: and others!) he excels at the fourth quarter drive to win the game, that is when he is in his element and at his best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tegis Posted February 2, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted February 2, 2009 Well, Two rings for Big Ben now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted February 2, 2009 Author Share Posted February 2, 2009 Ben Eli Rivers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 Still not convinced with Ben, I'd even argue he's the worst of the 3. He's been helped out an awful lot by his defense, something with Eli and Rivers haven't had throughout their whole career. Winning games, he's the the best, though it's more a case of him not losing games than winning them. Credit to him today he had a good game, but I felt his receivers, particularly Holmes, made him look an awful lot better than he is! In terms of what they've acheived, the teams they've been on, etc. I'd say they're all pretty much still level as of now, maybe Eli and Ben slightly ahead as they have the rings and Rivers has a tendancy to McNabb the big games. Still an awesome, awesome class of QBs whatever way you look at it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 2, 2009 Moderator Share Posted February 2, 2009 Ben Eli Rivers So no change then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkr Posted February 2, 2009 Author Share Posted February 2, 2009 Precisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 The first meeting of Eli and Rivers today. Ben and Eli are 1-1 against each other. Ben leads Rivers 3-1 (including 1-0 in post-season). We have the 5th best offense and 3rd best defense in the league. In theory we should win this, but we should have won the last 2 as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Big Ben. Rivers is sh1te and isn't even a consideration. Manning could be the choice in a year or two, but right now it's Roethlisberger for me. Rivers is shite as a person, but hardly shite as a QB.....that said, I picked Ben. But I'm a Pats fan, so I have the best one of all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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