Strong City

[snowychap]

First I want to say that my last post was in response to Snowy's thoughts about why we would bother "defending" ourselves. I wrote it in the "Quick Response" box right under his post, thinking it was self explanatory that it was in response to his post. I'm not real familiar with posting on forums.

That's what I thought and that is why I posted the following:

To whom is this post addressed or is it just a soliloquy?

It certainly can't be my last post as it has sod all to do with what I was querying.

Your post was a tangential response to my question, at best.

Btw,

is Hanifa not an odd choice of name for a christian?

Hanifa means true believer. Is that odd?

It seemed odd that a Christian changing their name to represent who they truly are would choose an arabic and ostensibly muslim name.

[snowychap]

It's a shame a few idiots ruined what was a interesting read of a thread.

Oh well, should be used to it by now.

I am sorry if it is improper to ask this but what are you going on about?

[beth]

So, by your own rules, you have just "murdered" b23avfc.

Your response was sarcastic, which usually reflects an impatient, pent up anger to the person it is directed.

You judge from who you are. You would have judged the same of Jesus when he said,

"Woe to you, scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!"

"You fools, and blind."

"You are like whitewashed graves, that look beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones, and all uncleanness."

"You serpents, you generation of vipers..."

Matt 23

There is a book called The Desire of Ages, about the life of Jesus, that I recall this quote from:

"Tears were in his voice, as he uttered his scathing rebukes."

Unless the love of the Truth has been received into the heart, humanity cannot know this species of Love, but can only attribute their own motives to Its words.

[villab0y]

I love this thread soo much.

[mattster]

How about when he cast the money-changers out of the temple, does that make him guilty of committing sin(s)?

We all live with contradictions in our lives, as long as you are living in peace and not hurting anyone you should be allowed to hold whatever beliefs you like. Trying to justify and explain any religion, especially using the bible, is an endless circular debate.

[snowychap]

A glance or a look toward someone ... is the fruit of your agreement with the thought.

Is there not the possibility that the thought has simply asked the question, and your glance or look is simply an attempt to answer- and the answer could be 'no'?

(this is getting very philosophical)

I think that beth's approach to this question does not allow for people to be multi-dimensional in the same way that BOF's does.

Beth, I am afraid that if something is a thought in your head it is yours however fleeting it may be.

You accept that human beings have free will and from that I infer that you view this free will as an integral part of our humanity. Can you not see that at any time from the birth of the idea up until the actuality of the action which will transform that idea in to deed then a human being can exercise their free will in stopping this process.

If thought is as bad as deed then there is no point in free will and no point in humanity except as an exercise in public backslapping for god.

But that is where you are, isn't it?

You have no need for the kind of free will necessary to make value decisions about things and to make moral judgements. You have 'let god in', have given up all responsibility for morality to his judgement and because of this believe that nothing that comes from you can be bad (even if it appears to be so to others) because it is god's will.

Do you think that anything is bad?

If so, where do you think its origin is?

How can you judge extraneous events or thoughts to be good or bad when you have no concept of good and bad in yourself?

Is it : we are perfectly good because we are part of god ergo you are all perfectly bad because you are not?

[beth]

Your post was a tangential response to my question, at best

I directed my answer to the root of the issue. Perhaps this is what you did not understand.

[beth]

A glance or a look toward someone ...

I've got to go now, will answer this and BOF's comment later when I have time.

[El Zen]

Michelsen, it is not true that you have never heard a word from God. He has spoken to you. He has spoken to everybody, but most don't even realize it, because they are not sensitive to His heart. Your world has done an artful job of ensuring this. Its god has masterminded everything to distract you from God and focus you on yourself.

I don't focus on myself, I focus un humanity. What a strange god anyway, who deliberatly distracts me from him. Because there can only be one god, according to your good self, so don't come here talking about the god of "my world". If the result is me going to hell, according to you, and that god has willingly made it so - then I don't stand a chance, do I? What a crap religion, it doesn't make sense at all.

You said you don't want to hear His voice, either. Then why are you asking us to speak His words to you?

Rhetorical question, really. I don't believe in god, because there is no evidence of his existance. Yet I live a moral life as a good person. If god has willingly made me an unbeliever, how can he then send me to hell for being one?

You claim you have never murdered, raped, etc. But have you ever shot an impatient or irritated look to someone? If so, you murdered them. That's what I mean by not sensitive to God's heart. People don't even know what they do.

I don't even know what's that supposed to mean. If I tell someone to hurry up, I murder them? Guilty as charged, then, should I bring sunblock to hell?

[snowychap]

Your post was a tangential response to my question, at best

I directed my answer to the root of the issue. Perhaps this is what you did not understand.

No, you did not.

You used the opportunity of responding to a question asked to trot out your mantra about the judgement of the character of god, the marriage of the lamb, &c. and not as an opportunity to address the question(s) and the particular(s) at hand.

Have you thought about a career in politics?

[Clarry]

So, by your own rules, you have just "murdered" b23avfc.

Your response was sarcastic, which usually reflects an impatient, pent up anger to the person it is directed.

You judge from who you are. You would have judged the same of Jesus when he said,

"Woe to you, scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!"

"You fools, and blind."

"You are like whitewashed graves, that look beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones, and all uncleanness."

"You serpents, you generation of vipers..."

Matt 23

There is a book called The Desire of Ages, about the life of Jesus, that I recall this quote from:

"Tears were in his voice, as he uttered his scathing rebukes."

Unless the love of the Truth has been received into the heart, humanity cannot know this species of Love, but can only attribute their own motives to Its words.

I knew the response would be like this. I knew it.

So!

You being sarcastic is okay? But any other response from anyone is wrong?

Girl! And I am calling you a girl here. You are not a woman for you do not have free will to think. You are a child. I asked you a simple question which you could not answer. You had to run away and use scriptures rather than your own brain to answer what i asked.

The clue in this, is that you took hours to reply to me, but minutes to other people's questions.

I'm not judging you. I'm throwing back in your face the judgement you make on others.

I have no faith in any religion. If I did or not, I do not judge anybody. I don't know why, maybe I believe we all get what is coming to us.

We do good, we do bad, or more like me we do a bit of both and feel guilty about it!

Listen to me gorgeous (you may be male for all I know and a big wind-up to all of us on this website); and answer me this.....

Why is you being sarcastic "O Bible... whatever..." different to us being sarcastic at your beliefs? Why are you allowed to deride us, but to deride you is a sin?

For what it's worth, I find it boring. I don't care what you believe. I care when I ask a logical question I'm given scriptures as a reply.

It's a very secular thing...Confuse and divide.

[Clarry]

You judge from who you are. You would have judged the same of Jesus when he said,

"Woe to you, scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!"

"You fools, and blind."

"You are like whitewashed graves, that look beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones, and all uncleanness."

"You serpents, you generation of vipers..."

How dare you! How bloody dare you tell me how I would have judged Jesus!

How dare you have the arrogance to say how I would look on such a man?

Along with the extremely insulting line in an earlier message to another poster, "You CLAIM not to have raped and murdered" I believe that you are just on the wind-up, you are not part of these people.That comment alone would have had me banning you on here. It's an absolute insult.

Don't you dare tell me how I would have judged Jesus or anybody.

[hanifa]

It seemed odd that a Christian changing their name to represent who they truly are would choose an arabic and ostensibly muslim name.

Although you are not a Bible man, there is a promise in there, repeated a number of times and in different places, that each of His children would receive a new name. The new name is not about just changing the letters that identify a person but reflect a profound and fundamental change in the person's character.

Here are but two of the places where He says it:

And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the Lord shall name.

Isaiah 62:2

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

Revelation 2:17

Over the years, and at specific times, I have been given a few different names. Beautiful Ashes is one that came after a prolonged period of personal suffering. Father was speaking of the beauty that results from holy fire and was ascribing that to me.

"Hanifa" is one of those new names. At a time when I felt as low (discouraged) as a soul can get, Father spoke it into me, somewhat like He spoke Messiah into Wayne (which is much of what this thread 's premise is based on).

I did not know what the name meant initially but after I found out and although I did not "feel" like a "true believer", Father was gifting it to me and I received it. I was no longer who I had been in identity or character and He, Himself, told me who I had become. It all sounds very mysterious, I presume, to those who do not know Him but such is the case when trying to communicate with others while coming from different planets with different languages.

[Clarry]

I did think that the "Hanifa" jibe was just a jibe.

People just using anything to attack.

Grow up my secular brethren!

[beth]

The clue in this, is that you took hours to reply to me, but minutes to other people's questions.

Is it okay with you that I had to go and do laundry?

[snowychap]

It sounds like we're due to receive ONE new name. Not be renamed over and over depending upon the blowing of the wind.

I may not be a 'bible man' but perhaps if you raised your head out of the thing you might be able to read what other people say, too.

Do you not see that some might see a little irony in one of the few (48 or so) 'true' christians being given a new name which is a muslim name.

To Clarry, this is not a jibe. It is a genuine question.

[hanifa]

Do you not see that some might see a little irony in one of the few (48 or so) 'true' christians being given a new name which is a muslim name.

To Clarry, this is not a jibe. It is a genuine question.

I'm still not sure what your problem or your question is. God gave me a new name and I received it.

[snowychap]

Do you not see that some might see a little irony in one of the few (48 or so) 'true' christians being given a new name which is a muslim name.

To Clarry, this is not a jibe. It is a genuine question.

I'm still not sure what your problem or your question is. God gave me a new name and I received it.

The question was about the muslim origin and its subsequent use in the context of 'the elite christian group' as per the first line quoted above.

I have no problem with the name; it is a lovely name.

Also, are we going to be renamed over and over according to the bible? Or just once?

[hanifa]

The question was about the muslim origin and its subsequent use in the context of 'the elite christian group' as per the first line quoted above.

I have no problem with the name; it is a lovely name.

Also, are we going to be renamed over and over according to the bible? Or just once?

Well, Snowychap, what is it to me if God chose an arabic name for me? Like, what's the big deal? I'm not stuck in any kind of ethnic box or superstitious hesitation about using something because it's "supposed to" belong to another group. That seems weird to me.

And, as to the "elite christian group", if you are referring to strong city, I can say that, yes, we were chosen to play a specific part in the celestial drama but not because we are "elite". Father chose us because we were the worst off. We needed the most help in coming to the reality of the Christ Life. We were chosen, yes, but not for the reason you imply.

As for the number of times a new name will be given, how could I possibly know that? I have received a few already and there may be more, depending upon my experience.

Think of it this way. I see that your name on this forum is Snowychap. I assume that is not your birth name. It is also very likely that you have numerous other names that identify you to other people depending on your relationship to them, nicknames and the like. How many more new names will you receive? How could you know?

The new name that Father gives is not like those earth names but I thought the illustration might help you understand.

[snowychap]

.. chose an arabic name for me? Like, what's the big deal? I'm not stuck in any kind of ethnic box ..

It was nothing to do with ethnicity rather to do with religious association.

And, as to the "elite christian group", if you are referring to strong city, I can say that, yes, we were chosen to play a specific part in the celestial drama but not because we are "elite". Father chose us because we were the worst off. We needed the most help in coming to the reality of the Christ Life. We were chosen, yes, but not for the reason you imply.

I did not imply that you were chosen for any reason. I certainly did not imply that you were chosen because you were elite; it is rather that you viewed yourselves as an elite group because you thought you had been chosen.

As for the number of times a new name will be given, how could I possibly know that?

Should it not say it in your book? That is where you referred when originally explaining the significance of the 'renaming'.

The new name that Father gives is not like those earth names but I thought the illustration might help you understand.

Please can you (and others in your group) refrain from this kind of patronizing approach to your responses (at least to me).

We may disagree, discuss,debate and question but unless someone actually says that they do not understand then don't come out with the schoolteacher approach.