Zatman Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 We beat City by one goal and one of those goals shouldn't have stood. Everton beat us by two legitimate goals. I'm not sure how you can compare the two.. city ebat us last year with a 1st goal that shouldnt have stood. were they lucky that day as well? How many top saves did Guzan make vs City this season, cant remember many. we werent lucky we just beat them whether you like it or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 We beat City by one goal and one of those goals shouldn't have stood. Everton beat us by two legitimate goals. I'm not sure how you can compare the two.. city ebat us last year with a 1st goal that shouldnt have stood. were they lucky that day as well? How many top saves did Guzan make vs City this season, cant remember many. we werent lucky we just beat them whether you like it or not And by that logic we weren't unlucky to lose to Chelsea this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 We beat City by one goal and one of those goals shouldn't have stood. Everton beat us by two legitimate goals. I'm not sure how you can compare the two.. city ebat us last year with a 1st goal that shouldnt have stood. were they lucky that day as well? How many top saves did Guzan make vs City this season, cant remember many. we werent lucky we just beat them whether you like it or not And by that logic we weren't unlucky to lose to Chelsea this season. Why by that logic? He says Guzan hardly had a top save to make. When we played Chelsea, Cech did have top saves to make from Weimann. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 We beat City by one goal and one of those goals shouldn't have stood. Everton beat us by two legitimate goals. I'm not sure how you can compare the two.. Question should James McCarthy have been sent off? Would it have changed the game? Yes he should have been but having less players doesn't automatically lose you the game. Westwood could easily have been sent off against Hull. Vlaar should've got a second yellow when we were 2-1 at Arsenal. It changes the game though yes or no? You keep bringing up the City game, that we got a bit of luck, well so did Everton in that case. Slightly different. Having a guy sent off doesn't affect the scoreline. An illigimate goal does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) We beat City by one goal and one of those goals shouldn't have stood. Everton beat us by two legitimate goals. I'm not sure how you can compare the two.. Question should James McCarthy have been sent off? Would it have changed the game? Yes he should have been but having less players doesn't automatically lose you the game. Westwood could easily have been sent off against Hull. Vlaar should've got a second yellow when we were 2-1 at Arsenal. It changes the game though yes or no? You keep bringing up the City game, that we got a bit of luck, well so did Everton in that case. Slightly different. Having a guy sent off doesn't affect the scoreline. An illigimate goal does. Did Man City go and score after that illigitimate goal? So a team who are experts in keeping the ball, possession. Go from winning 2-1 to losing 3-2. Edited October 28, 2013 by SikhInTrinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Did Man City go and score after that illigitimate goal? So a team who are experts in keeping the ball, possession. Go from winning 2-1 to losing 3-2. The way I see it is that morally you deserve victory if you have legitimately outscored your opponents. We didn't vs City and neither did Chelsea vs us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Did Man City go and score after that illigitimate goal? So a team who are experts in keeping the ball, possession. Go from winning 2-1 to losing 3-2. The way I see it is that morally you deserve victory if you have legitimately outscored your opponents. We didn't vs City and neither did Chelsea vs us. Hahahahaha. You talk utter nonsense mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Did Man City go and score after that illigitimate goal? So a team who are experts in keeping the ball, possession. Go from winning 2-1 to losing 3-2. The way I see it is that morally you deserve victory if you have legitimately outscored your opponents. We didn't vs City and neither did Chelsea vs us. Hahahahaha. You talk utter nonsense mate. If you say so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 If we didn't "morally deserve" the Man City win then Everton didn't "morally deserve" their win either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Did Man City go and score after that illigitimate goal? So a team who are experts in keeping the ball, possession. Go from winning 2-1 to losing 3-2. The way I see it is that morally you deserve victory if you have legitimately outscored your opponents. We didn't vs City and neither did Chelsea vs us. im sorry mate but thats a load of rubbish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 If we didn't "morally deserve" the Man City win then Everton didn't "morally deserve" their win either. They beat us by two legitimate goals, so I'd argue they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 If we didn't "morally deserve" the Man City win then Everton didn't "morally deserve" their win either. They beat us by two legitimate goals, so I'd argue they did. But before they did that they got away with a stonewall sending off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 If we didn't "morally deserve" the Man City win then Everton didn't "morally deserve" their win either. They beat us by two legitimate goals, so I'd argue they did. They didn't morally beat us by two goals if we use your above logic as they should have been reduced to 10men. This is pointing out that your logic in itself is screwed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Yes fair enough. I probably tried to make it a bit too black-and-white as is my nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmarsha_926 Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) Our home form has been a problem for a while 2009/2010 our best season under O'Neill. 27 points at home, 32 away from home, we had the 3rd best away record that season infact 3 of the last 8 seasons we have got more points at home than away, MON's first 2 seasons and the year under Houllier. The problems at home are lot deeper than just Lambert and his team selections. In 2013 we have lost just 3 games away from home out of 13 picking up 20 points (Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal) Edited October 28, 2013 by lmarsha_926 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormandyVillan Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Our home form has been a problem for a while 2009/2010 our best season under O'Neill. 27 points at home, 32 away from home, we had the 3rd best away record that season infact 3 of the last 8 seasons we have got more points at home than away, MON's first 2 seasons and the year under Houllier. The problems at home are lot deeper than just Lambert and his team selections. In 2013 we have lost just 3 games away from home out of 13 picking up 20 points (Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal) Yes, our home form has been a problem for a while, but it was a different sort of problem under O'Neill. In the three years in which we finished 6th, it was a case of our home record not being good enough to take us where we wanted to be: into the top four. It wasn't a dreadful record (we won about twice as many as we lost, and had quite a lot of draws), but it was only what you'd expect of a team finishing about 8th to 10th, and let us down compared to an excellent away record. The above table shows that, after a "transitional" season under McDonald/Houllier, in which our home record stayed the same as under O'Neill but our away results deteriorated, the problem has now become that our home record is not just "not good enough for where we want to be", but is absolutely disastrous. Just a couple of facts: In terms of points per home game (and using any system of adjustment to compare seasons before/after the introduction of three points for a win), the last two seasons have been the worst in our history. Our three worst seasons at home: Worst: 2011-12: P19 W4 D7 L8 Pts19 2nd worst: 2012-13: P19 W5 D5 L9 Pts20 3rd worst: 1966-67: P21 W7 D5 L9 Pts 19 (would have been 26 pts with 3 points for a win). By the time we go into our next home game against Cardiff, our home record for the past two years will read: P37 W7 D10 L20 Pts 31 That's the sort of home record you would expect of a team dropping through the divisions, finishing rock bottom of whatever League they're in. At any rate I think it's safe to say that no team can ever have performed that badly at home over a period of two years without getting relegated at least once in the process. Meanwhile... just to "compare and contrast", our away record over the past 12 months reads: P18 W7 D6 L5 Pts 27 The only teams we have lost to away in the past year are last season's top four: Manchester City, Chelsea (twice), Arsenal and Manchester United. So apart from the Champions League teams, nobody has won a home League game against Villa for over 12 months... Actually, I'm not quite sure which of the two is more amazing: our incredibly bad miles-worse-than-anything-in-our-history home record, or the fact that our away record over the past 12 months would, over a season, have been good enough for 4th place in 6 of the last 10 seasons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walesavfc Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Our home form has been a problem for a while 2009/2010 our best season under O'Neill. 27 points at home, 32 away from home, we had the 3rd best away record that season infact 3 of the last 8 seasons we have got more points at home than away, MON's first 2 seasons and the year under Houllier. The problems at home are lot deeper than just Lambert and his team selections. In 2013 we have lost just 3 games away from home out of 13 picking up 20 points (Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal) After seeing the bbc sport item about pitch sizes and ours being the biggest, maybe that is the problem, it allows teams more space, someone good on the ball with that extra room must love it playing at our place. We should make it 2-3 meters thinner on both sides and condense play more, am sure we are allowed as it is biggest in prem anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share Posted October 29, 2013 Our home form has been a problem for a while 2009/2010 our best season under O'Neill. 27 points at home, 32 away from home, we had the 3rd best away record that season infact 3 of the last 8 seasons we have got more points at home than away, MON's first 2 seasons and the year under Houllier. The problems at home are lot deeper than just Lambert and his team selections. In 2013 we have lost just 3 games away from home out of 13 picking up 20 points (Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal) After seeing the bbc sport item about pitch sizes and ours being the biggest, maybe that is the problem, it allows teams more space, someone good on the ball with that extra room must love it playing at our place. We should make it 2-3 meters thinner on both sides and condense play more, am sure we are allowed as it is biggest in prem anyway Good point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 its not even the pitch size its the quality. the top teams love the surface as can spread the ball around as its the best pitch in the league compared to if they were going to Stoke or West Brom were the pitch is not as good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 its not even the pitch size its the quality. the top teams love the surface as can spread the ball around as its the best pitch in the league compared to if they were going to Stoke or West Brom were the pitch is not as good. I don't know what it is, but to me the whole place is not intimidating, it's too nice. Like if you look at Goodison or Anfield, you get a sense of fear. Even our tunnel, its the biggest tunnel space in the country. On occasions we can get it rocking, but put it this way we won't get a better opportunity to win back to back home games than the next two games at VP IMO, Cardiff and Sunderland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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