VillaFaninLondon

Yes, I accept we've won games against teams better than us on paper but there have been an awful lot of games where the result was disappointing: Villa 1-2 Brighton Villa 0-0 Burnley Burnley 3-2 Villa Villa 0-3 Leeds Sheff U 1-0 Villa Newcastle 1-1 Villa (also bear in mind Newcastle had no Almiron, Saint Maximin or Wilson for that game) Villa 2-2 Albion Brighton 0-0 Villa (actually the point wasn't the bad thing, it was the woeful performance and being completely outplayed) Palace 3-2 Villa People go on and say Smith wouldn't get as much criticism if we were on the same amount of points but had been more consistent throughout the season, well of course he wouldn't but it misses the point. The fact is we started really well and were averaging 2 points a game, outperforming expectations. He was rightly praised by most of us (myself included) for doing a fantastic job and winning 8 of our first 14 games. Since January 1st, we have won 6 games out of 22. That is the stat which tells the whole story - it is not good enough. We have also lost 11 of those games which over the course of a season would be 19 defeats - again, nowhere near good enough. Taken over the course of a season would I have been happy with 49 points from 36 games? Of course - I even said at the start of this season our aim should be to finish in the high 40s in terms of points and anything better than that is a great season. But the goalposts were moved I'm afraid after the great start we had. I'm sure most of us wouldn't be on his back if our form had dipped slightly but stayed competitive - e.g. instead of taking 23 points from 22 games in 2021, he'd taken 30. But it's the fact that over a long period of time (4 months) our form is barely more than 1 point per game. Another reason why Smith deserves the criticism coming his way is he appears to be making the same mistakes over and over again. Why do we play so well in the 1st half of games and then play really poorly in the 2nd half? What is Smith saying at half time to make them come out in the second half so lacklustre? Games where we have been much better first half than second half: Man U (h) Liverpool (a) Everton (a) - we actually won this fortunately but our first half performance was much better than our second Burnley (a) Wolves (h) West Ham (h) Palace (a) Brighton (a) - we were poor in both halves in all honesty but even worse in the 2nd and very lucky not to lose Southampton (a) - again, we won the game but we were dire in the 2nd half and again very lucky to take 3 points It's all well and good saying Smith deserves the right to keep managing us - in terms of where he has taken us from and the fact we have improved year on year I can see that argument. But this is not a reaction to a bad run of a few games - this form goes back a long way now and there has been very little sign of it ending.

Yes and I think this is the right model (giving the manager all the power in signing players is what screwed us under O'Neill). I also agree that we've had to sign players based on where we were at any one time - but then as you pointed out Leeds signed two Spain players and a Germany player - and I suspect a key factor in them going there was the manager. This summer will be huge - sign 3 or 4 first team players to fix our issues and there will be absolutely no excuse for starting next season poorly.

Not at all, I agree we need better than those particularly to compete with the teams near the top. I'm advocating another summer of spending, but I've said the spending needs to be on real quality to move us forwards now. I still am sceptical whether top players would come to play for Smith, but as far as I can see it will be Lange and MacKenzie tasked with getting the players to come. However, losing to the likes of Sheff U and Burnley, failing to beat the Boggies at home, even losing to Palace today - I don't believe we didn't win those games because we had inferior players put it that way.

I don't think they have relaxed. We still had a lot to play for in January. Ultimately not getting into Europe isn't what irks me, because I agree with others that that was probably a step too far for us and we need at least another season before that's realistic. What angers and also concerns me is the form since January is very close to relegation form (even the form table has us in 18th if you want to look at that) and this has to improve early next season or Smith is in trouble. And the players not being good enough narrative needs to stop. Whether it's true or not, I've already named other sides who could use the same arguments but don't. This is virtually all of Smith's team now - he signed most of these players. And yet he still relies totally on one player that had been here long before he arrived as manager.

Regardless of Leeds or any other team, the form has been very poor since January and if it had been like that the whole season Smith's job would have been under real scrutiny. He'll get another summer of investment where he has to add real quality and next season will have to be going much better after 10 games than the last 10 games of this season, otherwise we will go backwards and neither the owners or the fans will tolerate that.

They've overachieved because they've got a fantastic manager. I don't know what was said when Leicester won the league, but I recall a lot of teams who missed out on that title (e.g. Spurs) being hacked off because Leicester had had the bottle to keep going whereas their team hadn't. Of course I'll compare my team to another one that is outperforming it, it's natural.

Exactly, and we barely survived relegation in our first season and I recall the fans not willing to criticise the manager saying it was we didn't have proven players at this level. I'm just throwing that argument back in relation to Leeds. One of the Spanish internationals you mention hasn't started a game for ages (Rodrigo) and the other one (Llroente) has been injured most of the season. Koch doesn't really play any more. So those players are not the reason they are where they are. It's players like Dallas, Alioski, Bamford, Harrison all delivering consistently good performances despite having very little PL experience. Raphinha has been a great signing for sure.

Because it's frustrating to see a team that has very few players proven at this level do so well - and disproves the theory that it's solely the players' fault we've fallen off a cliff.

OK, fine. But surely you must be concerned with our form since January? I am not saying replace Smith now, he will get another summer of investment and looking to improve this team, but if things start off badly next season and he's making the same tactical errors it will be time to ask ourselves if we need better.

But I said it's Leeds' first season back here in 16 years, and was responding to those going on about the last decade for us as a club when the actuality was we spent 3 seasons in the Champ and had a few years battling relegation in this league. It was shite but nothing compared to what Leeds went through yet they've been more than fine this season and nowhere near a relegation battle.

The way you dismiss Leeds achievements is the way you dismiss fans on here criticising the manager. Leeds have played very good attacking football all the way through whilst simultaneously adjusting their methods when they couldn't defend properly to become more consistent, and they'll finish top half and only a few points off the European places in their first season back in this league for 16 years. That's no small achievement, even if 'great' is a slight exaggeration. Particularly when you look at who plays week in week out for them - players who've played most their careers at a lower level. If Smith has done a great job by your standards for us then what Bielsa has achieved is a God damn miracle.

You can't keep going on about the last decade, it's getting boring now. Leeds spent 16 years out the Prem including dropping off to League 1 for a couple of seasons, similarly with Wolves and Leicester. Hasn't stopped them achieving great things at this level.

If we're in a relegation battle next season after spending another c. £100m in the summer no way will Smith survive.

Well then I think that's us done for the season as Smith has never proven he can get results without Jack in the team.

I can't be arsed to get into Smith in or out, but the form of the team since January is effing awful. Can't beat the better teams, can't beat the lesser teams, can't defend, mostly boring to watch, even when we go in front we end up losing or at best drawing most of the time. Shambles. Everyone blames the players but Leeds have a team mostly of Championship players and are flying, plus they've fixed their defensive issues from earlier on in the season. I said Smith could be up for manager of the year at Christmas, he'll be nowhere near that honour now. And if this continues into next season he'll also be the first to be sacked if he's not careful.

He said he'll make bench at best tomorrow and is concentrating on getting himself fit rather than making the Euros. Didn't sound very convincing at all.

Smith still being very vague about him coming back. We don't have too much to play for except finishing above Leeds and/or Arse and finishing in the top half, but it's been so weird this injury it really has. I don't quite understand how he's not fit enough to start the game tomorrow night when he was out for the same amount of time in the Champ with a similar injury and came straight back into the first 11 for his first game back against Derby. Anyway, I don't see Jack going to the Euros. Might be good for us as it will mean the vile media won't be able to market him to other clubs at every opportunity and if he put in some sparkling performances on the biggest stage it would obviously attract other clubs, but I'm gutted for Jack as he obviously wanted to go and it will mean players like Foden and Mount have the opportunity to cement their place in the England team over him. Big shame.

It's been said in many interviews with Dean that he said he'd get Ross back in the England set-up. To be fair that's not on Dean at all - Ross's attitude and lack of application have been the reasons he's not pushed on from his promising start (and possible COVID implications, if indeed he was one of the players that caught it).

He'd certainly be a marquee signing. Remember there was a lot of hype about him going into the World Cup a few years ago, though he didn't quite live up to expectations. He'd certainly transform our team - think he's a box to box midfielder so would be useful at both ends of the pitch.

That's the worry, he's yet to really bring in a wow signing and obviously has a lower profile to the likes of Bielsa and Ancelotti. Having said that, Barkley on loan was quite a coup last summer - one that has of course not worked out the way we wanted - though I think Jack played a major part in getting Barkley to sign. Dean will be all too aware that the players he's bringing in now have to be at a higher level. I think the main influences will be Lange and MacKenzie but of course players will want to play for the manager too. We finished 17th last summer so it was harder to bring in that higher, more proven profile of player, even though the likes of Ollie and Emi have beenreally good signings for us. This summer will be different given that we're finishing midtable and we've been right up there for over half the season - that's why I'm intrigued with who we bring in.

Absolutely, wouldn't sell either. I'd just get in a more specialist player in that position to play alongside one of them and rotate Luiz and McGinn based on form and opposition.

Age is just a number, I really like the fact we have a young team because it means the majority of them will get better over the years but if the right player is available that is older than our usual profile then they would be very welcome. Even if just to come off the bench and make an impact. I still think decent European players would be interested, we beat Liverpool 7-2 this season, we played some awesome football earlier on in the season and players will look at that too when they consider a move. We're also ambitious and I'm sure the owners would be more than happy to pull out their 5 year plan to sell the project to potential signings who want to be sure the club matches their ambition.

I'm with you on the DM, we definitely lack an imposing midfielder in front of that back four. Having said that, I think we need more pace and creativity further forward too so we'll need 2-3 players at least to solve our midfield issues imo.

Whilst I've been critical of Dean, this is exactly the right sort of attitude. Wise spending really is what is going to propel us up the table and into Europe. That means clever scouting and being able to sell the club to top players (the new performance centre is very impressive and will be a pull for the club I believe). And as much as I love VP, I think the next step is improving the stadium by expanding it and we'll be able to do that if we keep improving as demand will fuel supply. We want to be a club that talks big and delivers. If the owners match what they say then we clearly have an exciting future ahead of us, but it will take continous investment and ambition to achieve this. We're certainly moving in the right direction.

I think it's this summer we need to be looking at those types of targets really. Leicester signed Soyuncu, Evans and Pereira after finishing 9th on 47 points, we've already got more points than that with 4 games left to play and whilst we may finish lower than their 9th (most likely 11th as things stand) we're still basically both midtable with no Europe. They signed Tielemans also after finishing 9th. Leicester signed Evans after Wet Bum got relegated IIRC, so I wouldn't be surprised if we considered someone like Anguissa or Berge from the relegated sides as they probably won't stick around in the Champ, but to find the quality of someone like Pereira, Tielemans or Soyuncu we have to scout well this summer and be prepared to spend a bit (Pereira was £25m, Tielemans was £40m).