momo

Just now, sne said:

On 28/12/2020 at 18:36, sne said:

I mean Joelinton was signed 1 month after Benitez left but sure, great point. It's almost as good as the 44 points Bruce got is more than the 45 Benitez got...

he left because Rondon was being replaced with a striker he didn't deem good enough!!!! 

On 28/12/2020 at 18:35, Zatman said:

no but should take them up the table on the squad Rafa left. struggling at home to Fulham, beaten by Brentford in the cup and slaughtered by Leeds is not really a sign of progression 

Which 40 million striker did Rafa get? Rafa left on 30th June and Joelinton joined late July

Tell me about that squad he left? No striker, no Ayoze Perez, and he left because Rondon was being replaced with a striker he didn't deem good enough!!!!   What shit squad was that?

1 minute ago, Zatman said:

not sure what Smith has to do with Bruce and Benitez argument which discredits your argument

Sure it does. If you use the spending argument as a point, I can point to several clubs that have spent more than Newcastle and done worse. I don't understand the hate towards Bruce. You guys are trying to use every little argument in the world to prove your point. And my point is, he has done his job. Do you really think buying Callum Wilson and Jamal Lewis is going to make them challenge for trophies? Oooh, he spent more than Benitez?? hahahah, Benitez got a £40m striker. And left.

1 minute ago, avfcDJ said:

If only Bruce didn’t waste so much money at Villa that he had to rely on loans which then meant we had to buy a new team, eh!?

Jeez. Benitez spent a lot of money too. The strongest team to get up from the Championship in the entire history of English football. Yet, his only achievements with Newcastle was avoiding the drop two seasons in a row.

4 hours ago, Zatman said:

Rafa Benitez spent 89 million as Newcastle manager in the Premier League and build a system

Steve Bruce has spent 90 million more to that team and hasnt improved them including less goals, more conceded and similar points

 

If you want to attribute player transfers on managers:

Newcastle spent, including Joelinton, substracting for sales, under Bruce: £70m. Smith, in that exact same period of time spent £230m. I am not going to do the math for Benitez, but bear in mind the inflation in prices the last few years.

If you guys want to bash a manager, then get the facts straight. I never disliked Bruce as a man, even if I find his football boring. Yet the man is getting results, and he should be acknowledged for that.

12 hours ago, Keyblade said:

That looks like sound judgement to me.

And, that's my point. Bruce took over a team that was not as good as the one Benitez ended the season with, yet still managed middle table safety all season.

1 minute ago, TrentVilla said:

Bruce has in circa 14 months a net spend in excess of £100m which has been predominately spent on attacking players. In the three years Rafa was there their net spend was -£11m.

Bruce has enjoyed financial backing that is on an entirely different level to that Rafa worked with.

And Smith was backed with £130m, yet was a ghost goal from being relegated with Villa. And the backing last summer was for Benitez. But he left because he didn't get Rondon. Stop going i cirkles.

6 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

You really need to read your own posts back. You said they played the same under Benitez as they do under Bruce, they don't and any Newcastle fan would tell you that. You claimed Bruce was doing a better job than Benitez, he isn't. You claimed Benitez got them relegated despite taking over in the March and almost saving them, he certainly wasn't responsible for relegating them. You suggested that Bruce rather than Benitez was the greater tactically which frankily ranks as one of the daftest opinions I've seen on here.

And I'm the one talking rubbish? Good luck finding anyone who agrees with you on this lot.

Bruce took over a stable PL side from Rafa and has been backed financially in a way that Rafa wasn't, their football is far worse, their tactics non existent and their fans are calling for his head yet loved Rafa. But what would they know? They must all be wrong and you must be right.

I don't have a personal vendetta against Bruce I just think he is a poor manager not remotely in the same class as Benitez and I think you are talking absolute drivel. 

Talking of drivel, Joelinton wasn't a good enough replacement for Rondon so I'd say Rafa was right on that. But that isn't why he quit, he quit because he wanted total control over transfers and the club wouldn't give him that.

As for what was better under Benitez, the tactics, their organisation, the mentality of the team and their approach to games, the football they played, the results relative to resources (Bruce has had far more investment in players than Rafa). You could ask any Newcastle fan and they would tell you the same. 

How has Bruce been backed more than Benitez? If the players bought last summer wasn't good enough for Benitez to progress with, yet Bruce managed to get them the to the same level point wise (giver or take ONE point), then I believe Bruce did a good job or in fact better. Somehow, the tactics Bruce employs work. Is it ugly? Sure. Yet it works for his teams. If you don't like his playing style, fine enough. If you don't like his media persona, then fine enough.

14 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

You can, and over the last couple of pages you've been talking absolute rubbish.

On the above post, nobody is saying the football under Benitez was good so not quite sure why you are countering a point nobody is making. On Newcastle's owner, nobody is absolving him of blame so again an irrelevant response but the merits or otherwise of their owner doesn't negate the failings of Bruce, his woeful tactics or dire football. Comparison's to Benitez and suggestions Bruce is doing a better job or is on a par or even better tactically is absolutely ridiculous.

You are talking absolutely rubbish. What was better under Benitez? Please enlighten me. The guy quit his job like a little b**** over Rondon not getting a contract. He even deemed Joelinton not good enough replacement for Rondon. Yet Bruce had the team comfortably mid table before the lock down. You have a personal vendetta against Bruce, and that just comes across as bitterness.

13 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

I'm paraphrasing. To summarise your actual points though

 

I don't need you paraphrasing anything. I can speak for myself, man.

Selective memory is an issue on VillaTalk. The football under Benitez was absolutely not good. Newcastle are where they are because of the owner, not because of the manager.

Just now, TrentVilla said:

Ok.... you are right... Bruce is a better manager than Rafa 

Oooh.... I never said that. But if that's how you do discussions, you're not worthy of my time. The constant bashing of people is unreal and childish, frankly.

2 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

Tough one...

I'd probably say the manager who has won 2 La Liga titles,1 UEFA Cup, 1 FA Cup, 1 CL, 1 Super Cup, 2 Italian Super Cup, a FIFA Club World Cup, the Europa League, a Coppa Italia and the Championship. It suggests to me he is tactically superior to a guy who has won 2 play off finals. 

Sure, but he did nothing more with Newcastle than Bruce. He even relegated Newcastle.

Just now, sne said:

Actually Benitez got 44 and then 45 in his last season and Bruce got 44 last season so not more but almost as many.

With players Benitez didn't want to manage, because he deemed them not good enough to be bought

8 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

No, they didn't this isn't true.

Under Benitez the players were well drilled, they were organised and they played in a highly structured way. Yes it was primarily defensive but it was not the same as the way Bruce has them playing.

And Bruce is getting more points on board, so who's the genius?

Wow. Exaggerations!! He didn't play badly. He played as good as the rest of them.

They played the same under Benitez. He was a genius.

47 minutes ago, PaulC said:

Who is capable of turning this club around. All the top managers are in jobs apart from Pochettino

Pochettino it is then

Watkins needs a year or two. Maybe.

1 minute ago, LondonVillian said:

Grealish rightly livid at the end

He missed his fair share as well

How is Jack and Tyrone playing?

Just now, Hobbit Feet said:

When are people going to start admitting this guy is good and apologise for the abuse he got last year 

If he was English and/or white, everyone would have admitted it by now. Being a foreigner, the threshold is a bit higher.

16 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Have to factor in lack of pre season. Look at amount of muscle injuries happening in premier league already this season. We've been pretty lucky so far with injuries but they will come (hopefully not as serious as the ones we got last season) so we need to be careful managing minutes for players.

Probably one of the few on here that would've continued with the 5 sub rule.

But Smith only uses 1-2 in each game anyway.

Just now, TrentVilla said:

Sorry, we were at cross purposes.

Don't worry. It's my English that needs practice. haha.