Czarnikjak

13 minutes ago, A'Villan said:

Eze from Crystal Palace?

I've only seen him in the Championship and against us in the Premier League, however based on that I'd say he'd be a good, potentially great, addition to give us balance tactically.

He's an obvious threat and talent. Can only see that being enhanced under Unai and among our team.

25 years old. Got the technical ability  and physicality to compete and excel. Cant speak for his mentality or tactical nous or how teachable he may be.

Anyway dont mind me im sure we are in for other targets.

How?

He is a good player but Palace will demand silly money. There's no value in buying from other Premier League teams

1 minute ago, WallisFrizz said:

Yeah but I’m convinced we would have had more points on the board if he’d never had that injury. He brings something unique to the side. 
 

This is one of my favourite ever squads, I want them all to stay. 

The whole point of this thread is to choose one. He would be the smallest loss to us of the people listed here.

28 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

If I were forced to choose from any of those, it's Martinez or Luiz. ( Not to PL teams either )

I refuse to sell McGinn, JJ, or Ollie ( As if I have any say in the matter )

I actually feel Gauci has potential to be a star.

Has to be JJ. We proved this season we can do without him 

6 hours ago, CVByrne said:

Revised numbers having reviewed the accounts on Companies House

	2022	2023	2024
Match Day	16.1	18.7	26
Broadcast	123.2	152.5	175
Commercial	26.4	30.1	60
Sponsorship	12.7	16.3
Income	178.4	217.6	261
Wages	-137	-194.2	-194.2
Other Costs	-41.9	-66.4	-66.4
Player Amort	-82.5	-92.5	-92.5
Depreceiation	-3.5	-4	0
Non-Recurring income/cost	-9.8	-2.1	0
Gain on player sales	97.4	22	40
Exepenses	-177.3	-337.2	-313.1
Operating Profit/Loss	1.1	-119.6	-52.1
Allowable Deductions	22	26.8	25
PSR Figure	23.1	-92.8	-27.1

So I think the non recurring cost in 2022 was related to the Lerner Payment (I've put the interest paid in here for 2023 accounts). I think the payouts to Deano and Gerrard are probably in with Wages/Other costs as it's paying up their contracts and I think the payment to Villareal in compensation for Emery is in somewhere under "other costs". 

I think this is why we see in the UEFA presentation such a huge increase in total wages over player wages. All the Gerrard/Emery expenses are in there.

*Note Commercial revenue includes the income from players out on Loan (5.7m). I don't have the figure for 2022.

 

One thing to keep in mind, This seasons accounts will cover 13 months. So you need to adjust wages accordingly by adding 1/12th of their total to the final value.

9 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

Boggles the mind that some don't see it. We have our highest earners on £150k p/w. City, Newcastle, and United could double that. Grealish is getting £300k p/w and he's only the third highest earner for City. United has multiple players earning over 300k p/w.  You abolish FFP and the vultures will descend and unless we have the revenue to afford higher wages there won't be a thing we can do about it. 

This is our problem, With FFP or without we are going to be disadvantaged either way.

With FFP, we can't financially compete with teams with high revenues ( liverpool, arsenal etc). without ffp, we won't be able to compete with state owned clubs

4 minutes ago, Follyfoot said:

@Brentfordnylons on another thread has said PL are having a meeting in June to announce new rules on FFP which will suit clubs with Billionaire owners.

Apparently the top 6 and a few other clubs outside will be free to spend as much as they like as long as the spend is backed up with guarantees a type of escrow account will be up for the vote.

UEFA are in agreement apparently. 

Sounds like bullshit to me.

If uefa are in agreement why their own new rules prohibit spending by owners and are more stringent than current Premier League rules?

3 minutes ago, omariqy said:

£56m due to Covid losses?

No. Poster either didn't read or understood the article. It talks about covid losses in previous years.

6 minutes ago, wishywashy said:

Always promising when you have a huge article about announcing your financial accounts and there's no mention of the losses for the year until the very last sentence...

If I made the biggest loss of all clubs in Europe I would also leave it to the last sentence

3 hours ago, CVByrne said:

 

I said, this June stuff is a red herring. We do not need to sell players to get under PSR - the Premier League rules.

How are you so certain about it?
 

Looking at the numbers I'm pretty sure we will need to generate some profit in June.
 

In 2022 season we generated £24m ffp surplus.
 

In 2023 season we made a loss of £118m. minus £25m ffp allowable expenses that gives £93m ffp loss for last season.

93-24 = 69m ffp loss, which leaves us with  36m allowable loss to play with this season.

To get to 36 from 93 we need to reduce our losses this season by £57m in comparison to last season.

Have we done it so far? I know our revenue have went up but so our expenses (diaby and Co ain't cheap). I really feel we are short and we will see someone sold in June. I hope I'm wrong and we can somehow scrape through, but the numbers are not encouraging.

4 minutes ago, allani said:

If that is true then why would anyone buy any of our players for £50m in June?  It makes more sense for them to wait and sign them in July knowing that that also means that we start next season on -10 points (or maybe -6 if we can come up with a good enough story as to why we were unlucky to miss our numbers) or to make offers at massively below market value knowing that we'd have to accept them.

I don't know when the Castore / Adidas deal switches over (I assume at the end of the season)?  Might that not be a reason - especially as it looks like the new deal is significantly higher and so would be a big jump in revenue.

If you have 2 interested parties they will bid against each other and you still gonna get decent money for a player in June.

Not as much as later on perhaps, but this is the mistake Forest made. They didn't want to sell Johnson in June for £40m, sold him in August for £50m and now face consequences.

Not sure when Adidas deal comes in, but anyway it wouldn't be anywhere near to cover £50m gap.

18 minutes ago, allani said:

The key word in all of this is "need".  I don't think we need to sell any of our core players to comply with FFP.  We might "choose" to sell a player because it allows us to cover FFP and fund other purchases.

Looking at publicly available figures, it appears to me that we need to generate around £50m profit on player sales in June to stay complaint with FFP this season. 

This would also explain why we extended our accounting period till the end of June this year.

10 minutes ago, allani said:

There is going to be a lot of noise about FFP in the next few weeks and almost all of it will be complete bull****.  I noticed today that we are going to have to sell one or two star players - probably either Ramsey or Luiz to Newcastle or Ollie to Arsenal.  And then the very same person says 5 minutes later that Newcastle are going to have to sell Isak or Bruno Guimaraes and that Arsenal need to sell players too.  Basically, the media will get more people reading their **** if they link key players to rumours and will then spend ages saying "we told you so" for the one player that does move (even if it has nothing to do with FFP) whilst ignoring the 20 that they got wrong.  Saying that we need to sell Ramsey will just get more interest than saying that we need to sell Coutinho.  The media will also have no idea (or interest) in anything else that we might be doing to address any shortfall - this also gives them another "exclusive" to run later in the window - "ah Villa now don't need to sell player x because they've just signed deal z for £20m".

The cynic in me also thinks that some of the member will be deliberately trying to cause unrest or raise suspicions within the team in the hope that it causes a drop off in form and allows a certain team from Manchester to claim a CL place. 

There will only be a handful of people who actually know what we need to do and they seem to run a pretty closed shop in terms of both player signings and commercial deals.  My gut feel is that we will hit our PL and UEFA FFP commitments with maybe the departure of 1 or 2 squad players (probably already out on loan).  It then becomes about who we need to sell in order to strengthen the rest of the squad - which is a completely different matter - and we'll also have more idea on what extra revenue we can expect next season to do that.

I'm not sure you fully understand how ffp works. You can actually have 2 teams sell a player to each other and both benefit from FFP perspective.

For example we sell JJ to Newcastle for £50m they sell Miley for £50m, both on 5 year contracts, both teams benefit £40m for their FFP for this financial period.

So yes, all teams might have to sell, and that won't stop them from buying from each other.

6 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I guess there are two different things happening - filling the gap through sales, but more importantly, closing the gap through increasing income - it's the latter that will dictate how we do over the next few years.

Problem is that our wages and amortisation are going up as fast (if not faster) than our revenue. This can be seen looking at our operating losses not reducing since we were promoted. So for a foreseeable future we are stuck with having to sell for profit.

44 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

I predict we’re a little bit f***** 

We are not ****, we've been in situation for many years now. Basically our wages and amortisation are too high for the revenue we generate. 

You fill the gap by selling stuff for big profit. We kept being complaint in the championship by selling the stadium and in last few years by selling grealish. We will stay complaint by selling somebody else. Nothing new really.

Just now, OutByEaster? said:

It will. We've moved our accounting date to 30th June.

I don't think that makes any difference to last seasons accounts that we are waiting for.

17 minutes ago, picicata said:

Or, there's lots of people waiting to see what the actual figures are rather than worrying about something based on half truths, guesses and estimates.

I would argue that there's enough officially released information out there already to draw conclusions (Google latest uefa report about clubs finances).

Either way, we will find out all the details soon, last year the accounts were published on the 3rd of March funnily enough, so it won't be much longer.

On 02/03/2024 at 12:01, RichW said:

With clubs starting to announce their accounts expect this thread to be lively next week. 

Quiet before the storm...still a lot of people here burying their heads in the sand.

35 minutes ago, theboyangel said:

Anyone think Doughty from Luton is worth a punt if Digne gets sold in the summer?

still only 24, can whip a mean ball in from the left and one of Luton’s better performers this season. 
 

No. And we already bought in a left back that will be integrated into the squad in the summer.

On 01/03/2024 at 09:36, Tomaszk said:

Presume we could submit to PL, but not publish them. Wouldn't be much point though as we basically couldn't touch them again having already sent to PL.

Some numbers are out in public domain already and they don't make for a good reading.

Latest Uefa club financial report has us posting £118m loss for last season and our wages up to £191m which is 92% of £214m revenue  (wages alone, without amortisation!). We can add profit on player sales to that £214m but it won't be huge amount for last season.

23 minutes ago, ender4 said:

2022/23 - £214m

2023/24 - £214m + £30m Conference League + £10m matchday + £6m extras = £250m

2024/25 - £250m + £30m CL (on top of the £30m in 2023/24) + £10m matchday + £20m Adidas = £310m.   Wages and amortisation in Europe capped at 80% for this season - max of £248m.  

Someone else will need to work out whether that gives us enough revenue to be able to add players this summer!

I just read that Uefa report you mentioned and it scared me.

Our wages jumped by 38% last season from £139m to £191m. We had extremely high ratio of wages to revenue. Based on that, I would expect player sales for big profit ( someone with zero or low net book value) before we can bring someone in.

And apparently we made a loss of £118m! Doesn't bode well for this summer. All this rumours about selling JJ might have to come true.

8 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

Unlikely. That kind of information is locked behind regulatory secret walls.

PwC are our auditors so not like they'd have got it through their work either,  and accidentally revealed it. Maybe some educated guess work on their side

Edit: realised you probably already know this so actually wondering now why you think they might have?

I don't know. Perhaps they have some agreement with UEFA to provide them with high level figures for all clubs.

Our accounts would have been signed off for a while now as we had to share them with premier league and uefa for FFP calculations.

Anyway £214m is good...I was expecting something much closer to £200m

Latest Deloitte Money League has our revenue for last season at £214m.

I wonder how they know, our accounts have not been published yet,  unless they have early access…

28 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

Most of that increase is broadcasting,  which we should also see quite a big increase in. 

Not sure why there are two commercial lines, but the ~30m they got there will no doubt be heavily weighted towards the self sponsorship they got, for which we won't ever be catching up with them. But we will get closer with Adidas.

How the hell they managed to increase the Match day revenue by £10m without ticket price increase? Their hospitality/corporate must be well ahead of ours if they can essentially generate double the match day revenue of ours with only extra 10k seats...

Talking about increasing revenue, look at just published Newcastle figures for last season (that's before they got any CL money). 

£70m revenue increase....this train is departing quickly and we ain't catching it.

4 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

I think the Castore deal was £10m per year and we're hopefully getting 25-30m per year now with Adidas 

No, all sources I've seen agree on £3m per year. Perhaps £10m in total for 3 years.
 

From Adidas more realistic would be around £10m going upto £15m if we qualify for CL. No chance in hell we will getting anywhere near £30m. Spurs are getting £30m currently after years of qualifying for Europe and much larger world wide following than us.