Captain_Townsend

1 minute ago, villa4europe said:

That's a bit harsh, I dont think Chelsea or utd are in a different boat to us, not a clue about Newcastle

Radcliffe will make a lot of noise about utd but the proof will be in the pudding, all he's seemingly done so far is asked for a handout 

You could say we made a lot of noise, got euro 28, and then bottled it utterly. I wonder what we look like on the outside. 

And of them, Wolves expanded in 2011.

7 minutes ago, CHW said:

The Trinity upper is already amongst the Gods.  A tier above that would be crazy when we have the ridiculous 1970s North Stand begging to be bulldozed.  A Trinity extension would also do little to resolve one of the key problems which is lack of corporate hospitality space.  A new North can be as deep as they want and cater for this.

The short-term reduction in capacity is not that bad economically, they are the cheapest seats in the stadium.  I'm amazed we haven't just bitten the bullet and got on with it.

 

Agree with you, it makes no sense to row back. 

The main argument people here make in favour of the decision to cancel is that we are so tight on FFP that we cannot afford to be without the North stand. This mever made sense to me given it is thr smallest, oldest and cheapest stand with badly outdated premium offerings.

If we were sailing that close to the wind the new £5m each club is getting from the cancellation of parachute payments would probably cover it and/or the changing rules being discussed. 

Another option discussed at one point was playing elsewhere for a year! My argument was that surely playing at a 36k capacity Villa Park temporarily while it's done is prefable to moving to say Perry Barr for a year which is even smaller.

Looks to me they want to keep as it is and just add premium everywhere which will kill the atmosphere and drive regulars away.

3 minutes ago, thabucks said:

The current trinity stand wouldn’t need to carry any additional weight as you’d just build behind it with the new tier supporting itself. It’s just a pipe dream as they’ve shown with the cancelled north stand there is little appetite right now to meaningfully expand. 

Ah, got you.

I know right? I grew up with Villa Park as one of the biggest and grandest grounds. Bit by bit it is being overtaken: Spurs, Sunderland, Newcastle, West Ham and soon Everton being five examples to have passed us on capacity since say 2000.

To me it affects us medium- long term financially but more hurtful it also impacts our prestige. I am really gutted they have walked away from redevelopment (if it wasn't obvious!).

@allani the new badge may well be better than the round, I am no expert and I disagree.

But for me now that's beside the point. The entire exercise reflects badly on the club. We have the CEO saying there was inadequate consulting done on the round badge even though it had extensive consultation and an actual vote!! The new badge was just handed to us, there, take it you plebs!

It just soured things.

35 minutes ago, andycv said:

Where's this come from?  Interesting.

That is from the very extensive plans for the new North stand. Now shelved.

On @thabuckspoint, I thought someone said the current Trinity isn't structurally sound enough to take the weight of another tier? Could be wrong.

On the roof, they took the other three sides all had their roofs match the current North stand!

@allani I think the point being made is a much broader one.

We embarked on a rebrand process two years ago, in 2022. Presumably,  we would use this as a jumping off point for a new branding era to some fanfare. We know that the original rebrand under Purslow had pencilled in a big launch at the last home game of 22-23 and a club video. This was all binned at the last minute when Heck was appointed.

We then entered,  eh, the new 'process' and presumably the plan was for a big launch, positive headlines,  more clicks/ more 'engagement' and all the rest. The CEO even said as much, saying it would all be revealed etc. But the result of it leaked out online in January 2024 to a 'mixed' reception. So here we are in summer 2024 after our second rebrand in as many years and there hasn't even been an announcement of the new new badge, just  as others have said, it has been sneaked out with other announcements and a really dishonest interview in a branding magazine.

That can't have been what they envisaged when they started this all off. It's not about the look of one badge or another, it's about the overall way this had all played out being a bit of a let down.

7 minutes ago, DaoDeMings said:

Anyone else feel like this rebrand thing has been massively underwhelming? Why didn't they do the badge/adidas/kit all in one? Or at least follow up the adidas announcement with something else to maintain some momentum. All feels a bit flat now

Deep down they must know they made a balls of it.

33 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

The warehouse plans by the way, might end up being bigger than those that were submitted for planning, they may need a taller structure to accommodate some of the concert stuff - that's part of the reason why work isn't starting this summer.

Hmm. Maybe Villa Live wasn't such a bad idea then?!

As with all else, if Unai wants him that is good enough for me.

December 2022: planning permission granted and renders available. Monster of a new North Stand planned and a Villa Live Structure behind it.

19 July 2023: updated plans unveiled on twitter and a new video on the website. Reveal that the Villa Live will now be replaced by the warehouse. That the club shop will now be located in the new stand rather than Villa Live.

18 December 2023: announced that the new stand is on hold. Subsequently emerges that they intend reconfiguring seats in the current stand and will rebuild the club shop.

End of season 2023-24: seats being taken out of the existing north stand and the reconfiguration will lead to a capacity increase of about 300 seats. And rumours the addidas logo will be spelled out in blue seats In the claret section of the stand.

29 May 2024 we hear that some sort of new fan area structure is going up behind the current North stand in the current player car park and that the players will walk through this area on match day.

Every time we hear a snippet it makes proper redevelopment less likely. 

It's gone so short term from what we were doing, which was ambitious. it's so odd!

2 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Some big stuff in here and much of it positive. 

Rail seating is really welcome in the upper and Lower Holte I think and the club in the meeting have said they're happy to talk to anyone who doesn't feel that they can stand for the whole ninety minutes about moving. The changes to gangways and entrances are about creating extra seats - they aren't going to be massive increases but they'll make a difference. It might mean that if you sat at the end of a row last season, you might not be at the end of a row next season, but again the club are open to a conversation if you're 6'9" or you have a dodgy knee and you need the room.

There will be a slight increase in capacity this summer - and it's important to note that this summer isn't end of the work - there will be an increase next summer too with more work taking place. 

It's important to note that the 1,300 additional hospitality places aren't all new places - some of those will be coming out of the GA seating - so capacity will be up by a few hundred, but the number of GA seats will be reduced by around a thousand. I'm not sure if that's a similar plan to the way things will go next summer, but I suspect the increases next summer will have much less impact as they'll be around changes to the more traditional hospitality areas and more marginal gains in GA (hopefully without the need to move existing ST holders).

Sneaked in there (and in another later question) is what was for me the most exciting little snippet - that Fan Zone building on the players car park could be something quite special - they showed us some preliminary drawings with the idea being a two tier structure with catering, built around a 'tunnel' of sorts, so that the players coach parks at the rear of the North Stand and then the players walk through this building in order to enter the stadium - surrounded by supporters as the do so. Think of it a a giant family friendly pub that the players walk through. It'll add something.

The new store will be good too, more room for more adidas, more money through the tills and a better experience. If you've been in the shop on matchdays, you'll know how much of a squeeze it is - that's very welcome.

The slight delay in the academy building will perhaps put a bit of pressure on things - we're looking at late 2025 for an opening there, it sounds like the plans are changing too, with the emphasis being on it's suitability as a multi-use matchday and concert venue. I've mentioned before but Birmingham is short of mid-sized concert venues - it has big pubs and Arenas and not a lot else in between - if this one works it could be a real bonus for the club and the region - and come the Christmas of 2025 - you'll have the choice of the players car park fan zone area, the academy/warehouse, the Holte pub or one of those GA+ lounges - you could be looking at nine or ten thousand people drinking before a game at Villa Park without any of them being in the concourses of the stands. There will be 4,500 spots to enjoy yourself pre and post match in these two areas - it could change matchdays completely for the better.

I really hope they do, and I really hope they make a big thing about it - what's happening at Villa Park right now represents the biggest developmental changes to the stadium since the Trinity Road Stand was built in 2000. That we only have the notes above to talk about on it at this point tells you plenty about communication.

It is all a damp squib to me. How do we go from planning 50k to, what, planning 44k at most?

59 minutes ago, CarryOnVilla said:

I don’t like any of the badges and I don’t like any of the process to get to any of them. 

What’s going to happen when we snitching to the FA? Our club is forced back to the round badge or worse, another badge to grone about?

 

I no longer care what badge we go forward with. But I want the club to be accountable and to be up front. That puff piece with a Heck in the marketing magazine was off the charts! I mean, claiming the fans weren't consulted on the round badge, that is the definition of gaslighting. And again here to FAB

42 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Always brother we all want the same thing at the end of the day … No excuses for how fumbled this has been handled. He has lead us to believe that there would be a material change in capacity and maybe next summer we will see a further bump but what he meant was we will Rob from the poor and give to the rich in essence which is just poor form. For all those I’ve debated with on this i will hold my hands up and say i was wrong. 

Indeed, we all want the same and I have loved every minute of the NSWE journey. I just haven't been impressed with off the field over the past year and of the things that concerned me, the stadium concerned me the most. I don't see how we sustain our push mid- to long- term without major investment in Villa Park. A lick of paint here and there and a few more posh seats at the expense of ordinary seats won't cut it beyond a year or two. Also, I never accepted that it was an either/or. Surely you can do the North and get more posh seats in the Trinity/ Witton at the same time?! It didn't have to be one or the other.

Ironically, I reckon some of the financial rule changes being discussed at the moment would mean we actually could have had the financial wriggle room to bite the bullet as planned.

12 minutes ago, CarryOnVilla said:

We changed a shit badge to a shit boring badge back to a shit remix of the first shit badge

but because we wasn’t consulted about if we happy about the remix we snitching our club to the FA?

The whole badge process has been a total botch from day one, but snitching to the FA is petty AF

 

Risso would not be writing to the FA if his own club hadn't tried to gaslight him about what he saw unfold with his own eyes.

It's above and beyond the aesthetic of a badge, it is the principle of it.

34 minutes ago, thabucks said:

This has been handled very clumsily by the club and the use of language when referring to additional capacity has been murky. We are seen as $$$ to the club and fan loyalty is going to be a thing of the past - sad that football has gone this way but it’s the modern corrupt game whereby fans are just consumers to make money from only. Sickening but inevitable given the state of the game and how clubs like ours are hindered by the rules to entrench the bigger clubs. Our traditional home is gunna become a place only for the rich if they aren’t careful. Sad days indeed 

Holy crap, I agree with you! Has peace broken out?!

Just now, Hank Scorpio said:

The mythical 1500 extra seats hasn't appeared that they promised

So rather than the longterm greater revenue of a new stand they are removing season tickets. 2k less this season. Being turned to corporate ga+. Memberships are going to be tiered it seems.

Expect the same year on year. They will kill season tickets completely and you will just get any random seat a game with no discounts. That's how they are justifying no new stand as they are getting as much money out of what they have now with minimum cost.

Or am I wrong?

100% correct. Obvious for months except for that brief interlude where it looked like maybe they were going bigger than originally on redevelopment but nah.

1 hour ago, Talldarkandransome said:

And I'm sure the overhaul of memberships will have a similar financial hit too, top level may have reserved seating and access to a bar... if you stick with your current level you'll be lucky to get a non restricted leg room / view ticket at all.

Heck wants to make money during his tenure, which is why I'm certain the original North Stand plans were scrapped, in favour of this short term non plan

Careful now mate, one or two will be here in a minute to ridicule and tell you you simply don't understand what geniuses we have in the top posts at Villa!

@Risso mate thank you for taking the time on this. Honestly,  as far as I am concerned,  you have won the Internet for today.

I have written a lot on here about my feelings over the past year - I have never posted actively until this past year as it happens- and have been so disillusioned with off the pitch happenings.

Gaslighting is the only accurate way to describe club- supporter interactions over the past 12 months.it is all there in black and white,  stuff them and their BS.

Very forensic Risso, appreciate it. I am so utterly sick to my stomach of being gaslighted on this issue and others when I know myself what I remember happening.

What a damp squib re Villa Park.

And thank you for your excellent work and FAB more broadly.

18 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Much prefer the new badge to the round badge. Just waiting for the usual posters to say it’s shit for the thousandth time … 

Don't worry, you won't be hearing it from me anymore.

12 hours ago, thabucks said:

But but but the previous nice CEO said we’d be getting a new one and I got my hopes up and they made a nice shiny fly view video and everything … then this evil American man came along with an ego the size of Texas and cancelled it without giving me the in-depth blow by blow explanation I wanted and feel I deserved … 

Why don't you just put me on some sort of mute list if you detest me so much.

It isn't my style to punch down on fans of the club, it is my style to call out B.S when it comes from people in power.

You assume people like me don't know what we are talking about. Well, we all know our club needs to earn more money medium term and we aren't allowed to question why they have decided against having a new stand in two years time capable of bringing in tens of millions more a every single year than it does currently?  

Instead we are spending a few bob here and there changing the seats,  squeezing more corporate in, squeezing more premium in just thinking short term.

Just now, GingerCollins29 said:

If Unai wants him then i'm all for it, same with every incoming and outgoing that unai signs off on. 

Never in my lifetime have I trusted a manager as much as him

100% this.

Brilliant Dan Bardell, love this.