Gringo

Well, this thread stared nealy exactly a year ago with the simple premise The average house price in January 2008 was £183,959 The average house price in January 2009 is £156,828 judging for inflation that means the average house price has fallen (in real terms) 20.8% in the past calendar year. So for all those keeping count, anyone who voted "More" -200 points, all those taking the easier option of "Less" get +10 points. Anyone want to start a house price 2010 thread or all too depressing? I'm sure there are some miserable people out there that just want the misery to keep on rolling. So bring it on.

I'm not sure cos so far you've blamed the short sellers, the hedge finds. the 'markets', the banks, the consumers, but not one word of criticism of gordo. As said a few pages previously, this contininutal avoidance of blame is beginning to grate. So go on. Just say the words 'gordo is partially responsible for the shit we are in'. And once you can utter those words and realise the problem can we discuss why his 'solutions' (which haven't shown any sign of working) and his ignorance of the issue ('short and shallow') show that he fails to understand the problem and why his 'solutions' aren't working. A governmenrt that cannot foresee a massive fall in GDP when all around them are telling it will be so, but insist on budgeting for their fantasy land of green shoots and imaginary light at the end of the tunnel are only making things worse. They have no solutions. They are the "do something, do anything" party.

No. WE are not to blame WE did not support the selling off of councils houses The people share the blame (yes - for wanting what they are told they can have), but they are not ultimately to blame. Who is running the show? Who is introducing markets into the NHS against solcialist policy? Who is stripping the post office of it's cash gernerative services so it can be sold off to 'bleeding capitalists'? Who sold off the worlds best nuclear power consultancy the year before the decided to renew the nuclear power base? Joined up govt? My arse. you keep saying ALL to blame, but never gordon. Is he immune?

I find it hard to blame the man on the street when he has been led along on a string of false promises and arrived to find the road paved with turdi instead of gold. Instead of your blame of ALL it never includes the blair/brown combo that under regulated the markets that allowed someone to lend 5,6.7 times lending. Your absolution of the incumbent is followed up by your fatih that his fixes work. In October they restored lending from the banks. But it didn't work. So now a new injection will restore lending from the banks, but still there is no action. But Hah No other govts are doing any better!!! Because they are all following the man who saved the world. I really don't know if the latest tarp scheme will work, but this has been a problem for over 18 months - banks closed their doors to the little man back in 2007 and nothing has changed since. The small companies in the country provide more employment than the big companies but they are ignored time and time again. The govt are elected to run the country. They have falied.

Was the following not what you were after, Ian? :? Was about to post exactly the same, but snowy saved me the trouble. All this forget how we got here, this is where we are and this is what we have to deal with shiite ignores the fact that the people responsible for implementing the errors are now tasked with implementing the solution. They couldn't see what was wrong with what they were doing before, and indeed believe there was nothing wrong what they were doing, but yet we believe they have a solution that will 'save the world', four months after they saved the world before. The housing initiative and the business lending policy (stolen from the do-nothing tories and then watered down) are the only things that show some promise that this govt is actualy thinking itself out of the problem. As posted a good few pages back, (some of) the banks are insolvent and they need to be taken out of the commercial atmosphere, their bad debts repatrioted to other insuitions and a stimkulus of fiscal measures implemented. Such measures could/would include a reversion of VAT to 0%, a wealth tax or funding requirement to shore up the debt (do you want to buy govt bonds or do you want your assets seized?) and a dropping of wasteful expenditure such as ID Cards and the almost univeraslly ridiculed NHS IT program. As snowy poseted a good few pages back, the NEF have many ideas of rebuilding the economy, rebuilding the country - and some of these could be employed to great effect. But hey ho, let's carry on carrying on and see where we end up.

Yup - I'm the isolationist who has has lived and worked in six different countries across three continents, and nag about why the UK hasn't incorporated the schengen agreement of free movement. Apologies to AWOL. But maybe his opinions are also splattered across the early pages of this thread.

Yup - but we expect the yanks to be right wing, but we hope the uk labour govts to be left wing, not cow-tow to the markets. Great question. Under a socialist govt we could have nationalised the lot. But by ignorning the past we repeat the same mistakes in the future.

A point made a few pages back on the new protectionism creeping into all areas, from employment to financial services. Gordo himself spoke about it on Friday. Such activities will inevitably weaken the country as a whole, but no reaction could damage the lifestyles of the resident working class. This is one of Gordo's biggest qunadaries in the near months. Apart from pulling out of the EC there is little he can do on this.

Including the blair/bush/brown axis or do we by pass their blame and move onto easier targets?

Nonsensical. My last post(s) contained nothing post on poster. Play on.

As some bloke said earlier They don't know what they are doing they are making it up as they go along. The only thing they do know is they got it wrong for the last 10-30 years but won't admit it.

Perhaps the banking people might go and get a peerage/a cabinet position/a consultancy role with the treasury/a well paid job with UKFI?Let's hope so. Lord Gringo of Northfield has a great ring to it. And then I can earn fortunes amending legislation on the fly for two days a a week.

Nope - again your post is very pointed (again) in it's condemnation with little or no reference to other economies - but hay mantra and all thatSo the posts on the previous pages referring to greece and france are invisible. Fair enough. what an interesting comment. So every post has to refer only and singly to something someone here says and then you claim post on poster when anyone challenges you. Or is it basically no one can question you? You contradict yourself in your statement, but I suspect that is a round and around argument. Maybe what you are advocating is a change of EVERY government, and maybe a change of EVERY financial body?Nope. I said nothing of the sort. Your response is nonsensical. When I posted a few pages back I quoted pages from commentators who were of that opinion. You merely say some rabid right wing commentator said something sometime. links are nice. And I doubt it was I who started the 'post on poster' game. My post which commented on one persons changing views whilst yours centred on personal attacks on a consistently held position. My views on the failure of the bush/blair/brown dogma was well publicised before the advent of the crush/crash times. Maybe what I have been saying for a few years of the failure of the govt to implement a socialist agenda is being emphasised in the current environemnt. Because I started on this thread with an anti-brown agenda that didn't suit the I'm alright jack brigade who thought the crash woudln't affect them and maintained such a stance is surely a strong point. If you want to post some of my previous quotes back to me that contradict such a poistion, feel free. The PM has said a lott of things * No boom and bust * short and shallow * not my fault All wrong, 10 years presiding over a failure of regulation? Becuase he was too scared to regulate. Just what you need in a strong leader to bring you out of this mess What is this nonsense? You posted the same claptrap on the obama thread, when I was posting more positive stuff about obama than the labourites who were still pushing for hilary. Maybe the comments aren't connected, or maybe just becoming a theme. Some people just like being unhappy for no reason. Maybe there isn't a recession after all and it's just people moaning for the sake of it. and good luck to you on that project.Thanks, they need all the help they can get.

Apologies to AWOL for replying on his behalf, but on page 1 of this thread: Keeping up with the jones' is not the best motive for directing policy. The question should be is if it is a good thing or not, not whether everyone else is doing it.

Post on poster surely? I'm sure I've referenced "global" conditions quite a few times, but hey ho doesn't suit the mantra. As referenced on the previous pages myself - obviously ignorant to the global impact? Nope. As referred to myself on the previous pages, people are are getting fed up with those claiiming no responsibility for the issue. I quoted reasonably respected political and economic commentators and you posted.......? Please point to any post on this board or any political / economic commentator who has express such an opinion. I believe all people understand this is a global concern, but also the majority of people hold individual countries' leaders and failure of those countries leaders to regulate responsible. You can't have global collective responsiblity of failure if no one ultimately is to blame. They all are. Post on poster again surely. As someone currently consulting for two investment banks on their risk strategy, lets hope so.

All 19,745 of us? With all the bickering we'd never have time to review the legislation. Oh wait, they never do that anyway. Roll on BIAD_EVT

Which basically sums up the view of those that this happens to be a do something, do anything approach to govt. They don't know if it's going to work, but as long as they're doing something they hope people will buy it. Of course you have to do something. Are they doing the right things? Recent history would cast doubts on that. * Many experts predicted the housing collapse would echo across other sectors - even some fools here on VT made the same point, but the govt ignored the issue and pushed forwards with spending plans * Some commentators said this was going to be a serious downturn - even some fools on VT said the same, but the govt continued with short and shallow, failing to address what was coming up * In retrospect. or hindsight as some prefer, many have talked about the failure to regulate as a cornerstone of this collapse - even some fools on VT have said the same, but the govt denies any responsibility for what has happened. The house is falling down. It is too late to repair the roof. What to do? Do something, Do anything.

With a recession in progress it's up to all of us to tighten our belts and cut down on the wasteful unproductive spending. Nah. Manchester may trial large-scale ID card rollout Because of course at the moment it is impossible to open a bank account or buy alcohol. Unfortunately the industries don't seem to be on-message..... Banks: ID cards 'have been stripped of useful features' But not to worry, it all helps to keep your identity and your data secure - after all, if you can't trust the state to look after your data, who can you? Home Office guilty of data breach Hey ho. I'm sure a review of procedures and policies will ensure the falied procedures and policies will be rigorously adhered to in future.

You're not allowed to quote other people's posts now? leave the modding to the mods.

A night out for two at trim's bus shelter

this guy would not be a right winger would he typical right wing response in a recession do **** all never mind it is right wing free market deregulated markets that caused this 'price worth paying' © Norman Lamont And the Friday afternoon quiz is: Which poster would like a card?, LV

Clarkson predicts the 'end days' Unusual greek riots Usual french riots British jobs for british workers strikes Globalisation is being killed by: * the advance of employment protectionism. * Global funding is collapsing as financial protectionism takes hold and banks repatriate their loans from foreign parts and begin again to look at country credit quality and not just counterparty standing. * Import tariffs will be next - and I would expect obama to be one of the first to start that ball rolling. The I'm alright Jack mentality as referenced above has been rolling for three decades now - it will not turn around easily.

But this collective responsibility, which so evaded political comment during the boom years when it was all down to domestic financial prudence, means that all to blame so we absolve everyone? Or all to blame and we'll just target those sections we don't like? All to blame, but anyone who apportions any of that blame on the govt is met with ALL TO BLAME (apart from gordo, who was just a victim of circumstance). As said on the previous page, the public at large and the media have tired of the excuses and the failing solutions. Do anything, do something - as long as we can keep the blame in the florida trailer parks.

:bonk:

Britain to suffer worst recession of any advanced nation, says IMF 20 years to pay back debt