CityInPeace

Well your FFP thread has been locked so I should be posting it on there, unless there's a new one but by rights, if you're on track to fail, or under investigation you should be under a soft embargo right now tbh. I dare say quite a big EFL punishment would be possible if relegated? Don't know why the PL aren't enforcing EFL requests...or maybe they are. I've looked at a few posts on here and FFP does NOT reset, it's rolling, what changes is the loss limit in the PL I believe. It's harmonised to a point. The difference is that instead of rolling £13m x 3, it's £13m x 2 + £35m. @Dave-R should also read up on it. So should one or two others. The question is whether points can be imposed in this League or if it's just fines etc.

No problem with the 2nd bolded bit, but arms' length?? I didn't see any Revaluation Reserve or Revaluation surplus in any of your accounts- whether there will be an upgrade in value, a revaluation or a reversal of impairment in 2018/19 accounts will be very interesting to see...by rights your projected accounts and I guess those of Derby and especially Sheffield Wednesday- no idea when Reading's transaction took place- surely would not have mentioned it so those submitted to the EFL in March 2019 would show a loss in excess of FFP and points as per projected accounts should'be been deducted. Actually, the EFL should publish Projected Accounts and FFP submissions or lat least FFP position of compliance based on these.

Thanks for the response @Sam-AVFC As per your 2017/18 accounts, as part of your listed accounting policies. Historical cost as listed in the accounts minus accumulated depreciation and impairment, no? Am quite aware that Impairment can be reversed, but not in all cases. The interesting thing as I am sure you know is that it was the EFL who opened the loophole themselves, for reasons best known to themselves. Should never have been opened- UEFA ones do not allow it- word of warning on that, if you qualify for Europe within the period that this took place it will be deducted from calculations the profit, as per UEFA FFP regs- surely has to be. Well aware that valuers can get in serious trouble if they fudge that aspect, professional bodies, law etc etc. One site I read just now, briefly though it was, suggested there isn't a lot of difference between the two values ie Existing Use Value and Market Value. if it was for a different use then these would surely differ and diverge though, but same use? The issue of allowable losses in PL v EFL I agree on but PL should move on that one, and transfer market is just a red herring in this context- an issue for debate certainly, but if enforced tightly it'll dampen down the EFL market. Actually gross expenditure was basically flat in summer 2019 from summer 2018 among Championship clubs and overall "Transfer Balance" lower, compare it to 2 or 3 years ago- it's having an effect but could be done so much better. I think the Premier League will whitewash it incidentally in your case, if you were in the EFL still there would be more chance of a thorough investigation- the fact there was a line in the Telegraph article that said that this was never intended to open the door to this practice, or words to that effect suggests that they might go hard on it- and rightly so. UEFA would. I also note that it was sold to an existing company within the group. NSWE Stadium Limited, formerly known as Recon Football, formerly as Aston Villa Limited and finally initially as Vilden- what differentiates this, makes this a sale and leaseback as opposed to say an internal asset transfer, or inter/intra company transfer? Plus, and it's purely a timescale based aspect- listed as an asset of Community Value- is there not a time span where nothing can happen, before such a transaction can occur? On the general issue, having trawled Reading's accounts their value seems in the right ballpark. Derby's seems possibly on point or sharply inflated- all depends on the Revaluation Reserve and Sheffield Wednesday's...well what to say about £60m!? All IMO. Specifically on Derby, until I noticed Revaluation Reserve, based on a 2007 Valuation of £55m for Pride Park, subsequent depreciation and assets I had it somewhere between £50-55m, maybe towards £60m but then again when they brought it back in 2007 as they had to do a sale and leaseback from a third party for financial reasons, it was revalued up to £55m and this addition was about £34m- Revaluation Reserve was about £39m, so it is either RR + upward RV or Upward RV inclusive of RR.

Well I can't edit which is annoying! What one of the bits on the most recent accounts should have said was that the difference was £1,028,000 when it comes to land which has not been depreciated. That land was equal to the net difference between Additions and Disposals for Tangible Fixed Assets in 2017/18, which suggests that the transactions on that, that the movement on that took place on the land which has not been depreciated. Yet your Recon Group accounts for that season do not make reference to the Disposals on Freehold Land and Buildings- whereas your Recon Sports ones do, ie the £1,505,000 with Disposals of Depreciation of £174,000. Anyway regardless yes some more additions perhaps in Recon Group but also more land which was not depreciated- I still don't see how it's the value that transpired in the not so Arms Length Transaction.

As a fan of a club who follows it and makes very big efforts to do so, this debate rather interests me, Villa Park- £56.7m right? Some may seven say undervalued... Well, yes but then again was it not impaired to the tune of £44-45m in 2015/16? Unless it was in the accounts where it was sold and leased back, how does that work- remember in that remaining book value post Impairment was also some- well I'll get the key figures up. Freehold Land and Buildings would represent Villa Park in the accounts I presume. 2014-15 Cost- £106,763,000 Minus Accumulated Depreciation- £18,970,000 Minus Depreciation for the Year- £2,506,000 Net Book Value by 31st May 2015- £85,287,000- INCLUDED within that is land of £7,931,526 which has not been depreciated 2015-16 Cost- £106,763,000 Additions- Presumably enhances value by this- £303,000. Minus Accumulated Depreciation- £21,476,000 Minus Depreciation for the Year- £1,817,000. Minus Cost of Impairment- £44,593,000 Net Book Value by 31st May 2016- £39,180,000- INCLUDED within that is land of £7,931,526 which has not been depreciated. 2016-17 Cost- £107,066,000 Minus Accumulated Depreciation added onto the One Off Impairment £67,866,000 Minus Depreciation for the Year- £1,454,000. Net Book Value by 31st May 2016- £37,726,000- INCLUDED within that is land of £7,931,526 which has not been depreciated. 2017-18 Cost- £107,066,000 Additions- Presumably enhances value by this- £2,533,000 Disposals- Presumably knocks it down a bit again- £1,505,000. Minus Accumulated Depreciation added onto the One Off Impairment- £69,340,000. Minus Depreciation for the Year- £1,446,000. Disposals of Depreciation- £174,000. Net Book Value by 31st May 2016- £37,482,000- INCLUDED within that is land of £8,959,526 which has not been depreciated. Roughly the difference if not exactly the difference between Additions and Disposals for the year. With that in mind, I struggle to see how it is £56.7m- that Impairment was BIG! Unless Plant and Equipment included within it maybe, or some Depreciation added back on. I know Net Book Value and Market Rate certainly aren't the same but that Impairment from 2015/16 has a big downward effect on value does it not? In fairness, there could be a Revaluation Reserve- but I sure have not found it yet!

Afternoon. Am a Bristol City fan in peace, certainly a bit of a rivalry built up arguably in the final 2 seasons but the final season especially. Unless it was social media driven, magnifying it. Some strong views on FFP, an interesting aspect of the modern game.