Stuartc445

On 26/07/2019 at 05:00, danceoftheshamen said:

Mine arrived yesterday too, yay!

BTW, Anyone know if i can sell/donate my seat if i cannot make a game? If so how it works? Some midweek games i will not be able to book off work most likely and a shame to waste a couple of seats (daughter has one too but she can't go if i can't...& no you can't take her either lol! )

 

Don't go shouting that around because people will kick off that you aren't going to every single game and are stopping them going and demand that season tickets be scrapped

On 09/08/2019 at 21:41, KenjiOgiwara said:

Except I haven't. You need to stop making things up. I have never argued he didn't suit Smith's football. I simply said the argument that he didn't suit Bruceball is a valid one. Like I said horses for courses. 

No you said it was Bruceball that made Hogan shit but as I said when Smith came in and changed that Hogan was the same and when he went to Sheffield United.

The fact is you and the other odd people that will make endless excuses for Hogan use the Bruceball as the main excuse. But Hogan has played under Bruce, Smith and Wilder managers with different styles and nothing has changed which points to 1 conclusion and that it isn't the style of football being played that's making Hogan bad it's the fact Hogan just isn't very good.

As has been said it's just bizarre when you get fans hammering Hourihane after 1 bad game but will make excuse after excuse for Hogan despite him being awful pretty much from the day we signed him. 

8 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

I am not making excuses for him. I am just saying Bruceball obviously did not do him any favours. Anyone half capable of analyzing football can see that. Horses for courses and Bruce never understood that. 

You say you're not making excuses for him then you go on and make an excuse for him.  So "Bruceball" didn't suit him. Bruce got sacked and nothing changed so does that mean Smithball and WilderBall didn't suit him either. i'll do some analysing for you Scott Hogan is a rubbish footballer that has had a few months of form in his whole career and that has blinded some people to what the rest of his career has been like.

On 08/08/2019 at 07:01, KenjiOgiwara said:

Look I don't rate him a whole lot, but I think they were right about that one. Hogan wants it in channels or in the box IMO. He is tenacious and knows where the goal is. Bruceball largely involved hoofball, thus Hogan never looked like he would touch a ball when playing. He obviously isn't a targetman or especially good at hold up play. 

So what's the excuse for Hogan when Smith came in and he was useless and when he went to Sheffield United and was useless. So Bruce's style didn't suit him and neither did Smiths who is the only manager to get him scoring style didn't suit him and Sheffield Uniteds style didn't suit him. So what style actually does suit him. Or was it just that brief spell at Brentford was the anomaly and what we are seeing at Villa and Sheffield United is the true Hogan going by his whole carreer I'd say it's the latter.

1 hour ago, villa4europe said:

you think Newcastle are happy with "just stay up" ? because I think they're not, the appointment of bruce slaps it in their face too, with rafa the belief was there that they could go on to do better things (even if that wasn't his remit) 

spin it to a villa perspective, if we spend the next 2 years finishing 15th with smith, his contract expires and we appoint pulis because our owners just want to stay up would we be happy? of course we wouldn't 

staying up is an achievement that's been drilled in to fans thanks to sky and the TV money, first year and second year you can get away with it, third year and beyond what's the point of your football club and you investing thousands a year in to it if that's all they want? I would be properly disillusioned with football right now if I was a Geordie, much like I was when we appointed Bruce and I gave my season ticket away

Depending on the owner sometimes the fans and the owners want different things, if you have a proper ambitious owner then they will want what the fans want, but a lot of owners these days are like what Lerner was like 17th will do because of the TV Money.

By appointing Bruce Mike Ashley imo comes into the 2nd criteria of owner doesn't matter where they finish as long as it isn't lower than 17th.

On 26/07/2019 at 13:52, Andy81 said:

I don't want to go over it again, because I agree with this bit, and the majority of Wolves fans I believe feel the same.

Twitter is a shithole and Villa fans come across in a similar way.  I don't treat anyone on there as a reflection of the wider fanbases.

I have no hatred towards Wolves tbh. It might sound strange but we've had to put up with the north west clubs battling for honours and also London teams and as I said to my Wolves supporting boss that it' would actually be good if the two of us went and represented the Midlands and started challenging for honours every season.

On 19/07/2019 at 06:18, Stevo985 said:

Yep. Smith has shown a few times that if you have the shirt and you’re playing well he’s unlikely to drop you. 

Steer was performing so he kept his place. I don’t think it was a case of Kalinic not getting a chance. 

This, Kalinic got injured then Steer made it impossible for Smith to drop him.

9 hours ago, kurtsimonw said:

I don't know, we were essentially losing the tie (on away goals) with our first XI from the first leg. We'd have done well to get through CSKA.

Not suggesting I agree with throwing in the towel, that's as bad a decision any Villa manager will ever make.

It was the Zilina and Hamburg games where he screwed things up once again by playing the reserves had we taken those games seriously then we would have avoided CSKA and played someone either  nec nijmegen or another team i can't remember the name of. 

On 17/07/2019 at 14:12, villa4europe said:

im sure they've changed the handball rule to if it results in a goal then its handball automatically, intentional or not, not abiding by the rule above either, if your hand is by your side and it hits it and goes in its getting ruled out

baggies goal vs us last year would be ruled out

The baggies goal would have been disallowed with any variation of the handball rule since the day Football was created. 

2 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

So basically you are saying that he did well here? Perhaps you should go to the Newcastle forum and tell them how good he is and how well he did here and help reassure them that this is not a bad appointment. 

Let us know how you get on.

Different situation Bruce is a championship manager and we appointed him when we was a championship team unlike Newcastle. He did well for us because he managed to stop the slide and got us competitive again which we hadn't been for years, I agree with @kurtsimonw if we had gone up i still would have changed managers because he isn't a premier league manager. 

32 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said:

His first winter transfer window we had a net spend of £5m. We were then 21st in net spend in his full season, then we had a net spend of £3m last summer. He wasn't able to reinvest all sales in to signings. I don't think anyone is suggested we were the poorest, least spending team on the planet, but this idea that we were even remotely competing with our outlay under Bruces tenure (Not RDMs) is completely false.

This idea that "He had more to spend than most Championship clubs!" (which is debatable given the above), the fact is he did finish above those clubs. People are acting like he didn't finish 4th and that we spent more than Rotherham and finished below them.

Given that we're the biggest spending club in the country right now, what exactly are people's expectations for Smith? Genuinely interested given people seem so fixated by how much Bruce supposedly spent?

This 100% this. It's madness an outsider reading this would believe that Bruce had us fighting relegation all the time he was here.  The way some are going on and on making out Bruce was the worst manager we've had are making themselves look a bit stupid when you actually look at what he did here by stopping a 6 year slide and then getting us to 1 game away from the premier league in his 1 full season. 

Yes he failed, yes he should have been sacked after the playoff final but we couldn't afford to. When the new owners came in imo he was never going to last the season he was kept on whilst they sorted the finances out and got advice so his replacement would be the correct one (which it was). The fact they kept him instead of sacking him and getting someone like Henry in says to me we have decent owners now.

10 hours ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

Walk into this thread expecting more capers from Tyneside and we're back to arguing over Potato Head's time here!  Who gives a shit anymore?

He's about to make a laughing stock of Newcastle Utd. Let's enjoy it and breathe a sigh of relief he has been here and gone.

What do you mean Make them a laughing stock, that would imply that they weren't already which isn't true as they have always been a laughing stock.

11 hours ago, TheStagMan said:

NOBODY has said that. 

What people have disagreed with is the hyperbolic narrative that he was forced to wheel and deal and had no money to spend. We had some valuable assets that we turned into cash - from which he spent plenty and was backed financially to the point where the club basically went bankrupt. The money he had available to him here will seem like a kings randsome compared to what he is likely to be able to spend at the toon.

 

Plus he benefited from RDMs spend as some of the players RDM signed were crucial to Steve Bruce's Aston Villa, just as some of the players Bruce signed were critical to Smith's promotion team. 

Nobody has said that, then you go on to basically say the thing you just said nobody has said.... Love it please don't stop this is quality entertainment

1 hour ago, kurtsimonw said:

RDMs signings weren't that great? Why should Bruce be held accountable for them? 

In his 1 full season here, we had the 4th lowest net spend and the 7th lowest overall spend. Again, RDMs spend has nothing to do with Bruce. To suggest Bruce was spending as much as other clubs is just factually untrue. 

Come On Now Stop It, don't you know where you are this is the Steve Bruce thread Facts are not allowed here. 

3 hours ago, Keyblade said:

Every team bar maybe a handful in world football has some sort of financial restriction. Nobody is saying he had a blank cheque to go out and sign every player he could possibly think of. It's all relative. We were a Championship club. FFP has been something that every EFL side has had to work around. We had no disadvantage to any Championship team in that regard. In fact, like I highlighted above, when it comes to wages, we had significantly more leeway and breathing space than any other team. At the end of his second season, 14/28 players on the book were signed by Bruce and our wage bill completely dwarfed the rest of the league.

When it comes to net spend, we are third in the Championship table for net spend over the last 5 years. We were only in the league for 3 of those 5 years, yet are only 5 million per season and 20 million as a whole off leaders Stoke and West Brom who were relegated after the gigantic TV deal. At the end of 2017/18 we were also top of the squad cost table.

Apart from if you read what's been put in here that is pretty much what is being said.  

2 hours ago, Zatman said:

But we lost both games. One didn't nearly kill the club

Though no idea how losing to United is worse than losing to Fulham without us making an attack all game

It wasn't that game that nearly killed the club going by what has happened with Dr Tony getting promoted would have more than likely just delayed what happened as it's clear Dr Tony hasn't got the money he claimed he had.

Again it's scale we had a team in 2010 more than capable to beat United just like we had a team more than capable to beat Fulham in the playoff final. 

It's not as simple as 1 was United and 1 was Fulham you have to factor in the level of where we were competing at the time. In 2010 we were competing around Uniteds level and in 2018 we were competing around the level of Fulham so if you take that into consideration it's the same.

29 minutes ago, Zatman said:

I dont remember Evra, Vidic, Rooney, Berbatov, Carrick, Valencia, Park, Fletcher turning out for the reserves so much

It's also about scale we had a team that should have been more than capable of beating the the United side that played that day. You mention the 2nd teir Playoff final we lost well guess what we were a 2nd teir team playing another 2nd teir team so it was a 50:50 chance just like in the other finals we have lost since 1996.

50 minutes ago, Zatman said:

we lost them finals to Chelsea, Manchester United and Arsenal. Not a 2nd tier play off final when we barely took a shot

You mean Man Utds reserves and our side that day were miles better that day 

7 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

You know what you are saying makes no sense right? I mean literally no sense.

For a start I don't think any one poster has said he should resign and then been critical of him for doing so.

Secondly, in what world could he hold out for compo? What on earth are you talking about.

You say it makes no sense in a place where people are making him out to be the worst manager we've ever had, not a manager that got us to win 24 games in a season and lost a playoff final which again is used to beat him with even though since 1996 plenty of our managers have lost finals with better players than Bruce had.

^^^^ now that doesn't make sense but as I said keep this going as it's brilliant entertainment my lunch breaks would be dull without reading comedy like this

Love this thread though it's comedy gold.

Comments so far:

If Bruce had any class he'd quit and not hold out for compo.

2 days later Bruce resigns

Bruce is classless for resigning should have waited so wednesday got money he's a word removed.

So people say if he had class he'd resign but then when he resigns say he's classless.

Like i said comedy gold

22 hours ago, villa4europe said:

well it kind of is...

not sure what you do but I doubt a teacher starting a new role gets that luxury, neither would construction workers in most instances, sure there are other examples

he took off the xmas period and January so skipped 6 league games and 3 cup matches and the entire January transfer window

do agree that Wednesday cant complain about it though because its them who signed up to it in the first place, they more or less wrote last season off by doing it, that's their choice / fault not his and if he was appointed at the end of the season not the start then yeah I would say its normal for him to start after his holiday, but mid season? its another thing in the last year that I don't think there is a precedent for, cant think of any other manager delaying the start to a mid season appointment

Doesn't matter what job you do if you start a job and have a pre booked holiday that they have to honour it, obviously you can cancel it but they can't stop you taking it.

24 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

For someone who doesnt care about Bruce you sure spend a lot of time defending him.

 

So let me get this right... you are still saying that Bruce did a great job of recruitment, despite after two seasons (sorry, sorry, lets be fair 1 3/4 seasons), four transfer windows, funding that most championship clubs can only dream of, we started last season with one CB and a team full of loans and requiring a full rebuild regardless of what happened (promotion or otherwise). You think that is the mark of decent recruitment.????

Brentford has decent recruitment, Bruce is shit at it.

 

 

Apart from McGinn, McGinn is great and he gets credit for that. As for the others, they played well under Smith, not under Bruce. Part of recruiting well means buying players that you can get a tune out of. If you cant get a tune out of them then you haven't bought well.

 

Honestly, some people just cannot admit they were wrong supporting him.

Let's put in black and white shall we before Bruce came in we had won what something like 7 in around 52 games, spent a fortune when we got relegated (more than Bruce spent in the time he was here but you don't mention that i wonder why). He managed to stabilise the slide we was on then in the 2nd season got to the play off final which despite Brentford's awesome God like recruitment they have never managed. That doesn't match the picture you paint which seems to be one of relegation scraps.

Yes this season he went insane and Smith managed to turn it around but he hardly came into the same situation as Bruce did it was only 11 games before Smith came in we were consistently winning unlike 6 or so years prior to Bruce's arrival.

That is the last i will say on the matter as i think it's about time we all moved on.

4 hours ago, TheStagMan said:

Seriously? SERIOUSLY? Like the 8 players we just released, like the complete lack of a central defence, like ruining Chester's career because of it, like nearly going bankrupt due to the short term planning from our manager (admittedly piled on top of years of recklessness - but completely fecking up the opportunity to sort things properly)? Many of the players that got us up whilst also not being Smith signings were also not Bruce signings either.

He didn't do a good job recruiting, he really did not - otherwise we would not be needing to rebuild to the extent we are now. Hit and hope merchant. How anyone can defend his recruitment is utterly bewildering. 

 

John McGinn, El Ghazi, Conor Hourihane, Glen Whelan, Tammy Abraham, Elmo, Axel Tuanzebe.  You're right how terrible Bruce's recruitment was wish he hadn't lumbered us with McGinn.

Tbh I don't care about Bruce anymore as he's gone i just find it ridiculous how people talk about him. Honestly if you were an outsider reading some of these comments you'd think he had us scrapping for survival in the championship all the time he was here.  I also find the people mocking him for saying he was never accepted here are usually the people that never accepted him.

We are in the Premier League with Smith as manager surely it's time people move on from Bruce and stop going over the same old tired ground. 

On 13/07/2019 at 09:36, TheStagMan said:

Seriously?? You have seen the mess that Bruce leaves with player recruitment. 

By mess you mean the players that have just got us promoted, the playoff final team only Mings was a Smith addition in the starting lineup and the other one was Hause on the bench so in the squad only 2 were Smith's. Bruce did a good job recruiting but just couldn't set them up. 

14 hours ago, useless said:

He actually let a bunch of their players go who had come to the end of their contracts, including George Boyd and Gary Hooper, players that another manager might have wanted to keep, he's also signed three players, again money thant another manager might have preferred to use differently.

But the next manager will have those players and money to add new ones because of the compensation they will get, but hey why let that get in the way with a good old Bruce bashing.