Redman

It's either: brinksmanship - not playing Barry would only encourage Liverpool. Or O'Neill is assuming no acceptable bid is forthcoming and is exercising his right to use a contracted player as he wishes.

No court in the land would order Villa to pay Barry his contract settlement after the NOWT interview. Official or not, his transfer request was made weeks ago.

Legally, Barry's NOWT interview probably amounts to a transfer request anyway and gives Villa the right to withhold any payout that might be due if they so wish.. Still, if any of you want to use Barry's greed as a excuse for his desire to leave, don't let me stop you.

Xabi Alonso can pass the ball better than anybody in football... ...as long as he is allowed an age to pick it first.

I'd consider Alonso and either £2m or Finnan. Not sure Alonso would be up for it though. He rejected advances from Spurs a few months back, apparently.

No point. he wants to go to LIVERPOOL No he doesn't, he just wants CL football and a pay-rise. wanna bet ? I don't know whether that is the case or not but I would wager Benitez would be more anxious to finalise the deal if he thought there was a chance Barry could be tempted elsewhere.

You might as well lock it anyway John. Everybody keeps missing the point.

But, if Parry has been tasked by Benitez to secure the transfers of Barry and Keane within the constraints of that budget, wouldn't this be the tactics he would employ? I'm sorry - I'm not sure what you are getting at. Please clarify. You said that the reason for Liverpool's bids being below Villa's price is a question of differing valuations; that if Benitez felt that Barry was worth £18 million he would, in effect, order Parry to pay it and get the deal done. My point was that, given the budget that you say has been set by Hicks and Gillette, and the apparent twin targets of Keane and Barry, would Benitez have said to Parry "use that budget to get me these 2 players"? And would Parry have tried his best to get the price down, regardless of Benitez's opinions on the players value? The budget isn't that rigid though with players coming in and going out for various amounts. There are other targets that need to be budgeted for besides Barry and Keane. We've just spent £3m on a reserve keeper - we could have economised on the likes of Antti Niemi and allocated that money to the Barry deal. Redman you could have economised further by keeping a keeper you wanted to sell to us for £10m but let go for £3.5 to the Boggies That's right. The point is it doesn't ring true that Liverpool are down to their last £15m and scrabbling around down the back of the sofa for enough change to buy Gareth Barry. As for Carson, the £10m valuation was set around the time Craig Gordon moved for a similar fee. Clearly Benitez was trying it on but then again, you did pay £2.5m for a year-long loan at the time.

But, if Parry has been tasked by Benitez to secure the transfers of Barry and Keane within the constraints of that budget, wouldn't this be the tactics he would employ? I'm sorry - I'm not sure what you are getting at. Please clarify. You said that the reason for Liverpool's bids being below Villa's price is a question of differing valuations; that if Benitez felt that Barry was worth £18 million he would, in effect, order Parry to pay it and get the deal done. My point was that, given the budget that you say has been set by Hicks and Gillette, and the apparent twin targets of Keane and Barry, would Benitez have said to Parry "use that budget to get me these 2 players"? And would Parry have tried his best to get the price down, regardless of Benitez's opinions on the players value? The budget isn't that rigid though with players coming in and going out for various amounts. There are other targets that need to be budgeted for besides Barry and Keane. We've just spent £3m on a reserve keeper - we could have economised on the likes of Antti Niemi and allocated that money to the Barry deal.

But, if Parry has been tasked by Benitez to secure the transfers of Barry and Keane within the constraints of that budget, wouldn't this be the tactics he would employ? I'm sorry - I'm not sure what you are getting at. Please clarify.

I don't disagree with that Redman. But I think that Messrs Parry, Gillette and Hicks are of differing priorities.. Well the budget has already been allocated so Hicks and Gillett aren't directly involved at this stage and while Parry is as tight as a duck's arse, I doubt whether he has the authority to over-rule Rafa anymore. He's a bit of lame duck is Rick.

Absolutely. It's just nice that you've been forced to compromise up from a mish-mash of reserve team players to a minimum of £17m, and we've only had to compromise by £1m. :winkold: Well it's only fair - he is your captain. :winkold:

That's a myth. It's no secret that Liverpool are having to manage their finances carefully but the toing-and-froing is more about the valuation itself than the ability to match it. If Benitez thought Barry was worth £18m, he would have paid it by now even if it mean't compromising another transfer.

Who's pissing about? It's not us. We've got our valuation and we're sticking to it. Liverpool knows the price. All they've had to do is pay it. Finnan is a quality player, but his best days are behind him and he's knocking on a bit now so I'd say that he's worth £1.5m max. It depends on your point-of-view who's pissing about. If Barry wasn't so adamant about leaving, there would no reason why Villa couldn't hold out for the full £18m. But as it stands, it isn't in anybody's interests for him to stay so a compromise is the only solution.

The other thing is that everybody needs to get perceived value from the deal. £16m + Finnan allows Villa to say they got the full £18m and allows Liverpool to say they paid less than the full £18m cash.

Yes. It's in everybody's best interests now. If Villa insist Barry is worth £18m, Liverpool have the right to insist Finnan is worth £2m. In fact, I think that's pretty generous. You can dispute it if you like but I reckon £16m + Finnan matches Villa's valuation or is at least close enough to stop pissing about and get the deal done.

Or the fright of your life if you see unpleasnt things? Yes that's true if one has the wrong focus in their life; I believe if one is an ethical agent all will be well. I think that's true but I also think the experience can depend how you are feeling at that particular moment. Some years ago, my mates got a load of Es in for my 21st. By that time, I was finished with them and really not into them anymore at all but I tried to convince myself that it'd be a laugh like always. I failed. The fact that they were cut with something unexpected (I suspect ketamine) and the fact that my mates had coerced me into it compounded what was the worst experience of my life - paranoid, isolated, freezing cold and terrified. Thankfully the worst of it was over after a couple of hours which I spent sitting alone in the bathroom looking in the mirror to check if I still looked as bad as I felt. The point is, everybody else was up for it so they weren't too bad and after the worst had passed, some even headed back into town to pick up some cleaner ones.

I knew a kid at Uni who did and he was away with fairies and demons for about 8 hours. He thought he could see through our skin and look at our sculls and plenty of other very weird shit. I've seen some freaky stuff but I was scared for him. He was a different bloke afterwards and although I'm not in touch with him anymore I hear it's twisted his head permanently. Never ever touch this drug. It seems to be a drug that if you do dare to take it, it should be the correct dose, only in certain conditions and with certain people on hand to assist. And you should have some idea what to expect so you can prepare yourself as best as possible.

does it make you delusional by any chance? does it come as part of the water package in scouseland? Ha bloody ha.

Anybody ever tried dimethyltryptamine (DMT)? I haven't but I know it is a fairly obscure psychedelic that is supposed to induce an experience that can be best described as literally being transported into another **** dimension of impossibly vivid colours, patterns and geometrical shapes of intricate detail far, far beyond normal human comprehension. The chemical itself is actually produced naturally in your pineal gland right in the centre of your brain. Nobody is sure of it's purpose but there are theories that it is secreted during REM sleep and is what causes dreaming. It also offers a possible explanation for alien abduction and near-death astral projection. The DMT experience is apparently intolerably intense but because it is endogenous, you can take a hit, feel yourself being propelled through time-and-space, communicate with alien beings, find yourself spiritually, come round and be drinking a cup of tea, completely back-to-normal, within 15 minutes. There have been scientific studies leading to theories about the role DMT plays in human consciousness such as it being the conduit that delivers the soul into the body. As the pineal gland develops from the 49th day of gestation, this is said to be the time that consciousness first enters the foetus, tying in nicely with the Buddhist idea that there are 49 days between incarnations. Now that's a proper drug. Mindblowing, huh?