ViewFromT2

14 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I know we shouldn’t look at other clubs but it’s so depressing to see how Wolves are doing after being taken over at the same time. They also had a worse first season than us. 

Why couldn’t Fosun group have bought the Villa and let Tony buy the Wolves? 

To make it worse I know so many wolves fans and all I hear is the great things they are doing. 

I watched a documentary on Ronaldo the other day and he see’s Mendez like a brother. I wouldn’t be surprised if I’m a few years down the line he ends up there while we languish in League one. 

I think I’m going to cry myself to sleep. 

Let's see how it pans out at Wolves first.....agreed they struck gold this year, but they employed 2 idiot managers first and got lucky with the 3rd!

Mendes played this game at Valencia and everything was rosy at first....then it all fell apart. Also, they keep getting linked to big money signings....not made any though have they? Gold & Sullivan play that game a lot too don't they?

Reading some tweets by Prof Chadwick the other day, he said no Chinese owned football club in europe is 'safe'.

Fosun are one of 4 huge chinese companies being monitored by the govt over there. They are ok for now, but the govt. could change rules again next week and the whole Fosun/Mendes/Wolves charade could come crashing down. When a company the size of Dalian Wanda has to pull out of their part ownership of  Atletico Madrid, no chinese owned club can be over confident!

4 minutes ago, omariqy said:

These cashflow issues would have been there regardless of being promoted or not. We just would have had more future revenue to leverage against. 

So it's only down to cashflow? sorry if this is the question of a dunderhead....but I'm not business savvy.

What exactly do these resolutions mean? have we issued shares or are we now in a position to do so? Does any of it mean we are now likely to be sold?

2 hours ago, omariqy said:

So it seems Wyness contract was varied the day before the playoff final on the 25th. Jeez. 

If they have removed the restriction that means the expect new investment/buyers to come in?

Something just occurred to me (most likely occurred to others ages ago....forgive me).....but if all of the stuff appearing now on companies house, the resoltions etc were created in May, then clearly it isn't down to us losing the playoff final is it?

I was under the assumption that everything hit the fan because we never got promoted, but is it merely coincidence? Xia signed it on 25 May, presumably after arriving back in the UK for the playoff final, but whatever they entail, it was all agreed ahead of that date....or have I got it totally wrong?

Apparently TalkSport are reporting that the club is now up for sale....not listening, has anyone heard that?

This seems to tie up with Thatcherlovers post on twitter last night

1 hour ago, dukes said:

But who is thatcherlover and why are we suddenly hanging on his every word ? As far as I can tell his first Villa related tweet was 30th May 2018.

he does seem to have been right on a few things since then, but I’m not convinced that any takeover is imminent or logical.

I don't think he's a villa fan, which makes his post all the more intriguing to me. 

6 hours ago, paul1984 said:

So a random twitter user..... ok lol

 

I think this guy has an ear on the inside from some of the things he has come out with. As with all of these ITK's, time will reveal all, but judging by his tweets and conversations with several other seemingly very knowledgeable types, I think he is worth a follow for sure.

Birmingham Mail now running a story that Wyness has now been sacked:

1 minute ago, briny_ear said:

Well if he’s been suspended he is being denied the opportunity to do his job so, without any further action by the club, he has a case for constructive dismissal. 

If the club want to sack him, they must do so and give their reasons. Then he would presumably switch to unfair dismissal.

This one has a long way to run I feel and it’s hard to see how it can be kept out of the public gaze. More damage to Villa’s image I fear.

 

Suspended on full pay presumably, therefore no grounds to sue surely?...It's only been a few days anyway!

12 minutes ago, VillaAlex said:

John Percy has just tweeted that he is suing for constructive dismissal that could cost the club up to £6m. 

Just seen that. Only been suspended according to club statement....obviously a lot more going on isn't there?

Also saw this on Companies House:

ASTON VILLA FOOTBALL CLUB LIMITED

Seems stuff has been happening for certain....

Any legal knowledge here that can shed any light?

Does anybody know who or what  '1874 Developments Ltd' is? - 2 Officers listed (Wyness/Xia), seem to be owned by Recon Group UK Ltd. I saw on Companies House Website that a registration of charge (HSBC Bank) was added on 08 May 2018.  I'm not really sure what all the details mean in the pdf that can be viewed online, but it seems to refer to Land and Property and Mortgage?

2 minutes ago, blandy said:

Just on this. I've just been through the accounts again, and it's not correct that the accounts show it to be untrue - they can't, they're for last year not this year and also because of the way player purchases are covered in the accounts. For (hypothetical) example. If the club buys Joe Bloggs for 12 million quid and puts him on a 4 year contract, the accounts show outgoings for one year of 3 million quid (amortisation of 12 mill over 4 years). BUT the actual outgoings from the club are (say) 6 million on the day of purchase, and then 6 million after (say)  12 months - so accounts would show - £3million but actual outgoings are different (say) - £6 million for each of 2 years

The accounts show is an overall wage and pensions bill last year of around 61 million and quite a heap of monies owed to other parties within 12 months. It doesn't prove we are running at 5 million a month, but it doesn't disprove it either, and to my untrained in bean counting eyes, it looks entirely feasible that something of that order is right.

(The accounts also show a net cash outflow of £16,851,000 and an increase in borrowing of £48,915,000 for 2016/17.)

I am not an accountant and might be completely missing something technical or whatever, but I'm unable to see how last year's accounts disprove the 5 mill a month thing for this year.

Matt Scott said pretty much the same. The last published accounts were 2016/17.

2017/18 accounts should make interesting reading, perhaps they'll start using examples of our accounts in the AAT exams!

5 minutes ago, hippo said:

https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/06/07/club-statement-hmrc

Club statement.

Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations. 

The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club. 

Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.

Hope and pray this is a sale

Reads like a goodbye to me.....

This 100% for me

2 minutes ago, Wainy316 said:

Hopefully Adama Traore will move this summer as I believe we have a sizeable percentage of transfer fee due our way.

20% - which will most likely bring in around £4m - ie. cover 1 months losses

6 minutes ago, richp999 said:

I still can't decide if Xia's not got any cash to throw at it, or if he's been stopped exporting the cash by the Chinese government.

It sounds like he's been funding the wage bill to the tune of £60m a year for the last two years, and had to suddenly stop.  That's an awful lot of money.  I don't think he can be criticised for supporting the club in that way for the last two years.

It may well be that he had some kind of deal with the Chinese government that allowed him to export the £5m a month until early this year, based on the fact it would stop when we achieved promotion Now we haven't , he can't get the £5m a month out.

 Either way, those kind of losses aren't sustainable with any owner.  We can't pay that wage bill until we are *in* the premier league.

Think I read last night that the chinese govt are only interested when companies are spending in excess of $300m US.

I'm not convinced his money is out of reach at all, far more likely that he has run out of money. 

7 minutes ago, Eastie said:

He is only prolonging the inevitable though for me mate and the sooner he’s out of it the better .

Spot on!

16 minutes ago, richp999 said:

Interesting interview on talksport just now with Simon Jordan.. Always liked him, talks a lot of sense.

Talking about Villa's situation, he clearly knows someone high up at villa but wouldn't reveal sources... Probably wyness or someone similar.

He said Villa won't be going into administration, but will need to sort out the wage bill, as we all know.

Said HMRC can be dealt with, and a threat of a winding up order was quite common and usually the first shot they use to concentrate your mind on paying ; he said they can usually be paid over a longer period once you have done a deal with them.

However he suggested we will *have* to sell at least Grealish and Kodjia - said he knew for a fact from friends within the game that people were already prepared to put in bids for them.

So looks like we will unfortunately lose those two at least, and have to rebuild from there.

Also talked about doing deals with players on large salaries to get them off the wage bill (Richards?) , as if the club did go into administration, their contracts would be voided. Also HMRC wouldn't get any cash.

I would think this is the only 'genuine' information about our current situation, as I suspect he has talked to someone at the club - maybe a way to get out some information to the fans without making a formal statement ? 

I like Simon Jordan. The stick some fans gave him last week when he intimated all was not well at Villa was poor.

However, if we are indeed losing £5m per month then surely the problems run far deeper than players wages?  If we clear all our top earners we might save what, £1m per month?...probably not even that?

Guessing at figures a bit, feel free to change....but:

Terry £60k per week £240k per month

Gabby £30k per week £120k per month

Hutton £25k per week £100k per month

Richards £25k per week £100k per month

McCormack £30k per week £120k per month

Jedinak £30k per week £120k per month

Whelan £25k per week £100k per month

Grealish £25k per week £100k per month

That's £1m saving per month......so now were only losing £4m per month....phew!

1 minute ago, Rob182 said:

I may be a dreamer (I know I'm a dreamer), but I don't think Administration is the only option if Xia stays.

We have assets. As much as it will pain us to sell them, I'd rather we sold players and land in order to keep Aston Villa alive. Our debt issues aren't everlasting. Players contracts will run down, putting us back onto an even footing.

Selling Grealish should bring in £20-£30m, plus the saving on his 20-30k wages. Selling Chester should bring in £10m, plus the saving on his 30k wages. Selling Elphick should bring in £500k, saving 30k p/w wages. Maybe we'll try to sell Elmo for £1m, Lansbury for £1m, Gardner for £300k, Tshibola for £300k or even Kodjia for £5-8m. Saving wages along the way.

Terry cut his contract short by a month, so we're not paying his wages anymore. At the end of June, we'll no longer be paying Bunn (£20k?), Samba (15k?), Hutton (30k?) and Gabby (30k?), as their contracts will have officially ended.

We'll still be lumbered with some high-paid players that we'll unlikely be able to shift (Jedinak, Whelan, McCormack, Richards), but then we do have a number of players capable of keeping a team in the Championship that will be on relatively low, or 'manageable', wages (Steer, Bree, Green, Davis, Hourihane, Bjarnason, Adomah).

If we can plug the holes in the short-term, then by the end of next season, we'll be another year into paying off the remaining transfer fees that we owe, and then at the end of next season we can finally bid farewell to Richards, Jedinak and Whelan, who are probably on more than £100k p/w combined. That's one year away. By which point, I would hope that we have a much more respectable set of accounts.

Well that's a far more positive outlook than I can envisage and cannot argue with your thought process. Good stuff!

My only concern would be that if we are losing £5m per month, the problems have to run deeper than players wages?

Also, I fear we won't get close to a fair market value for the likes of Grealish because the buying club hold all the cards. That's why I mentioned Blues, look at the players they have had to sell down the years due to their circumstance, Demarai Gray, Redmond, Butland were all worth at least double what they actually got for them at the time.

I fear we won't get more than £15m for Grealish, whereas he is worth closer to £30m. Chester will go for around £5m at best and I doubt we'll get more than £5m for Kodija either.

I can see someone taking a chance on McCormack for £2-£3m, maybe in Scotland? His wages should put everyone off off but as we know, there is no sense in football!

We are fortunate to have enough young 'uns there to hopefully keep us competitive but unfortunately we have a manager that will ultimately ruin them!

2 minutes ago, hippo said:

Can the administrators force Xia to sell though ? 

I think so yeah.....would it be a way of rescuing the company?

1 minute ago, villa89 said:

Sadly adminstration might be the best thing for us given our current plight. 

I actually cannot see anything but administration. I'm no expert but even someone handing us £100m doesn't cure the problem does it?

One of 2 possible scenarios:

Scenario 1:

• Xia swallows his pride and sells the club in order to save it

Scenario 2:

• Go into forced administration (by the bank probably) at some point over the summer, most likely next month.
• Club is sold for £1 and debts cleared....hopefully
• Most valuable players sold for peanuts (see Blues for numerous examples)
• Start next season on -12pts with a team consisting of u23 players and the tripe we can't sell over the summer
• Hope and pray they can pick up around 62-66pts which will be needed to stay up, but clearly relegation to league one is very likely if the above comes to pass

So Xia has managed to scramble together some money (in effect, a payday loan) to pay some of the £4.2m tax bill.....great!.....what about the next one? what about repaying this loan?...what about the £11m we owe clubs in transfers due this summer? what about the apparent £42m we still owe creditors?

We've already cashed in transfer fees due to us. We've already cashed in the parachute payment due to us. The monthly supply of cash from China that has clearly been keeping us solvent for months has now has dried up. He is looking to sell property and land the club has accrued over it's 140 odd years of existence. 

Have I missed anything?

Just sell the club and do one for christ's sake!

4 minutes ago, Daweii said:

It's depressing how quick this shit happens to Aston Villa. Earlier this year when news picked up on West Brom's financial issues I recall telling a fan on Facebook not to gloat too much; I think my words were something to the effect of, "don't laugh too much because Villa tend to fail bigger and better than any other team in football these days".. When I posted that there was part of it meant more as a joke, but here we are doing financial problems the Aston Villa way. 

I think this kind of situation will be happening at west brom too. their chief exec highlighted a lack of cash whilst still in the premier league!

don't expect them to be making too many signings this summer, only offloading whatever players they can get money...only Rondon and Rodriguez arguably.

Fosun are one of the companies that Chinese authorities have been looking into last year, along with Dalian Wanda amongst others. Let's see how many of these high value transfer rumours actually come to fruition!

2 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

On about selling some land aren't we? Brookvake or something. 

Staff Car Park on Witton Road.

In fairness, we won't need it as they'll all be redundant soon anyway!