So long and thanks for the beard!

1 hour ago, rodders0223 said:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36648824

With Sherwood, if he wasn't so tactically inept, he might do a decent job. He would struggle to qualify but I can imagine he doing well in the knockout stages if he ever got there. He also knows the like of Kane etc. as well and could actually get the ball to him! And imagine the press having an absolute field day with him? Wouldn't get anywhere but I would probably liken it to when Maradona managed Argentina!*

*Please note, not an endorsement; just merely a suggestion. It would be absolutely horrendous!  

32 minutes ago, Supervillan78 said:

Crespo (remember him) played in the first team and had a significant beard.

Whilst that was a substantial beard, I'm not sure 1 game counts!

And yes he is still technically a Villa player...

6 minutes ago, av1 said:

Yes. 

I've come to expect the football being crap, so my only wishes for this forthcoming season are:

i) Real Ale sold on match days. 

ii) A decent beard or 2 in first 11. 

This! 

We have not had a good beard in the first team for sometime, though Baker gave it a good shout last season.

Though I would be happy with good football too!

26 minutes ago, NeilS said:

Maybe he was the one person who bought and watched the Season Review on Blu Ray?

We sold one?!

seriously if we do sign anyone between now and training camp it will be in positions that either:

1. That player has said they want out for whatever reason and will need to be replaced; or

2. A position that is so deficient that it we need someone there (e.g. Elphick).

And also during discussions between RDM and Xia I am sure RDM would have mentioned who he wants and where he needs to strengthen so it's not beyond the realms of possibility that he would know where we need to strengthen. So talk of a striker, creative midfielder and goalkeeper are pretty obvious. Hell, this was where even Garde was looking to strengthen, it is not rocket science!

1 hour ago, av1 said:

At the next GE, the question won't be 'who's the best', rather 'who's less shit'.

Hasn't that always been the question? I can't actually remember the last time I liked a British politician! 

15 minutes ago, This Could Be Rotterdam said:

There were a lot of reasons, and I can assure you that not one of them was due to not wanting immigrants living next door (which they do already,great people,hard workers and I'd take them in exchange for the druggie who hasn't worked from the day he left school). 

Personally I want to be able to hold the decision makers accountable.i don't think the here any better than those who are in Brussels,but at least we have a vote on the people who make our decisions. 

I can't Say I agree with cap (which takes over 40% of Euro budget iirc), nor the ttip. I don't believe it will affect trade to the extent suggested. Belarus are the only none I state not to have tariff free access and I can't see the wto making any punishment by the Eu easy.

The negotiation that Cameron held was pointless and the lack of movement right up until voting day confirmed it. Remain but with reform wasn't ever going to happen because the knock on effect would be huge. I genuinely see leave as a safer long term option than remain. The Eu will onl get more aggressive in its approach and I would rather not be part of that. Our lack of confidence in doing so is a result of the Eu, we shouldn't doubt ourselves. We should have confidence in making this work, and instead of calling each other bigots, racists and xenophobes should embrace the opportunity we now have.

as I say many reasons, and certainly just as, if not more thought out than remain voters. My gripe is with the suggestions that by voting leave you are a racist without question. 

I don't wholly agree with you, but it's a fair and valid point and this is why democracy is great. It's also the reason why I say we need to reform the House of Lords; I just think we were better trying to sort it in rather than out and working together

Personally I think the majority of leave voters were more inclined to this sort of reason, or more "this is not what we signed up for"; which fits with the demographic of older voters choosing leave. 

The media however probably aren't so interested in hearing from the justifiable arguments, it's much more newsworthy for people to shout "we got our country back" (and unfortunately they tend to be the loudest too).

The swing though was 634,751 votes. That is 3.65% of the leave vote. Whilst as I say above (and in my earlier post) the majority of leave voters will have their justifiable reasons, I struggle to see that less than 3.65% of the leave vote was for either "immigrants out" or "government out/we are sick of austerity". That's why, certainly I am annoyed.

As a leaver, can I ask who do you think is best to sort this out? Ultimately if we are leaving, it needs to be the best for the country and it would be helpful to have a different perspective. 

23 minutes ago, Rodders said:

Political landscape is atrocious right now, particularly from a leftish view. Can only hope the carnage leads to some positive reassessment but I am distinctly pessimistic. Corbyn will go and some anodyne blu labour chap will get the nod and it will be another scare-case of 'look, this candidate must be preferable to May or Boris. Which whilst true is back to the utterly underwhelming type of politics that people abandoned last year. I think a turnout for a snap GE this year will take a massive dive again in that scenario.

 

I think we're all completely **** and there is next to no outlet for hope or prosperity 8n this country. Unemployment will rise, EU funded jobs (millions) will collapse, the continuation of unchecked neoliberalism will drastically increase the inequality in society and poverty will rise. Maybe I'll be wrong. It would be nice if I was but it's hard to avoid the sense of impending futility and impotence in a world completely ruled by dickheads. Working at a University the mood is pretty dark atm. 

Had a look on Canadas immigration policy too. Seems an unlikely option with my current job for now too.Sigh.

 

 

I agree. Lib Dems collapsed last year. Tories are going to get some idiot in. Labour will put in another Blairite, SNP will try and get Scotland out again. 

All with UKIP waiting in the wings. They had already managed to get the disillusioned Tory vote before, now the referendum has shown that they are very, very close (if not already) to getting the disillusioned Labour vote. 

Politicians need to wake up now or next year we will either have UKIP in a coalition or even worse, a UKIP majority. They were not far enough a number seats last election, it will not take many more votes for them to get the seats in parliament and we should be very, very worried.

22 minutes ago, BigJim said:

But why the complication happened is not relevant to the discussion. My point was that the union transformed itself into a bureaucratic monster that the original voters could never have imagined in their worst nightmare.

See House of Lords. See the cabinet with Boris Johnson there "just cos" and other useless members.  See FIFA. See the olympics. See the democratic and republican parties nomination process (now that is just a farce). See the local councils. These are all other examples on nonsense monsters that have power to make binding decisions over us or their country/sport and eat up a huge amount of money for no benefit to the country/people/sport.

As has said before by others, at least I have voted for someone to sit in the EU parliament, I haven't for the House of Lords. Whilst the Commons can veto, it takes a lot of effort and negotiations to get through the Lords who are appointed when the sitting government need to shore up their numbers. If we want to sort out bureaucratic monsters maybe look closer to home as well?

11 minutes ago, BigJim said:

Have read your post again and I apologise for taking it the wrong way. It's just that I find it very distasteful that so many posters have been questioning the intelligence of Leave voters. 

No worries. I get why you would get irate at that, like when people say that remain voters are bitter and arrogant intellectuals who think they know best   (Not saying you have said that, but people have been certainly saying it all day and it does gripe me as well!)

11 minutes ago, colhint said:

would you not say then cyrusr, given the money, access, establishment, politics etc the remain had in their favour, that the leave campaign were either smarter or more intelligent

They ran a better campaign because they were smarter than the remain and played on people's fears. You had Cameron and Osbourne being exceptionally smug and thought they had it in the bag. Corbyn was acting like a wet fish and clearly couldn't be bothered and the leave politicians shouting them all down. You throw enough mud, it sticks. Don't agree with it in the slightest but that's the way politics has gone because we have to chose between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.

7 minutes ago, BigJim said:

Here we go again: The Leave vote was mainly xenophobic thickos who don't understand the bigger picture. The Remainers clearly thought the issue through like the thoroughly decent, intelligent, cosmopolitan chaps they are.

Apologies cyrusr, it's not just you. But I think you can all do a bit better than that.

Actually I was saying that it was the swing vote that was the caused by immigration, not the majority of the leave vote. I cannot say why people voted leave, but the majority asked on tv, radio, polls etc. Say immigration was a big factor. However even the basic stats say otherwise. The leave campaign misled on the issue, the remain ignored it and as always the facts get mixed in there. I imagine there were remain voters who did it for stupid reasons, but is certainly clear that a number of voters did vote to say "immigrants out" or "I hate politician" as people have said that. 

Heres the important point: not all people vote for the same reason. As I said in the quote you have included in your post, there are people who have considered the issues and come to their own views regardless of the rubbish coming out of the politicians mouth, but you have just taken the defensive action because I said some people have voted for leave because of immigration, not all and actually probably not a majority either. Those are the ones that I feel have focuses on issues which won't be fixed by leaving the EU, as the stats show majority of immigration comes from outside the EU. 

8 minutes ago, BigJim said:

More complicated now than then, but that's part of the reason why many of those that voted in originally have voted out now: the system was never supposed to get so inflated and complicated.

Now this point, whilst I don't agree with, is a valid point and can understand concern. Very much in agreement with @Chindie though on the point of why the complication has happened.

55 minutes ago, CastleBromVilla said:

It will give us far greater control and allows us to decide who enters the country. We'll be able ensure those we do allow to come here, add value and will stop those that won't be able to support themselves and are just using the EU as a passage way into the country.

And how about the immigration from other countries? They do account for more immigrants than EU as shown in the latest figures:

This is my problem, the misrepresentation of the issues. Don't get me wrong I agree the remain camp did it as well; but to the extent that even Farage finally admitted the £350 million figure was wrong today is just infuriating. 

There are people who voted remain that clearly wanted it, having considered the information and felt they wanted out. I have no issues with that, they are entitled to, but the ones that have done it as a "protest vote" or to "get the immigrants out"; those who I am afraid are ignorant of the bigger picture and what seems to be coming through is that there were enough of these voters to swing it. That's the frustration with it.

2 minutes ago, Xela said:

Our new potential leader

To be fair, no worse than Hutton's tackles.

9 minutes ago, Chindie said:

The smug UKIP word removed on the Beeb just was very keen to let everyone know that that agreement is separate to the EU and nothing to worry about. 

I'm completely sure the French will be delighted to keep our border for us when we just told them and the rest of Europe to shove it.

Having looked at the "Agreement Article 25 paragraph 2 is as follows (Click here for full treaty):

Quote

This Treaty is concluded for an unlimited duration, and each of the Contracting Parties may terminate it at any time by written notification addressed through diplomatic channels to the other Party. The termination shall come into effect two years after the date of this notification. 

So they have to give 2 years notice on it... I have a funny feeling if we try and screw over France, they are likely to screw over us. 

Its this sort of stuff that makes the negotiations and the whole in/out vote exceptionally complicated and really shouldn't have been done by referendum. Thanks David, you've really done well there giving into your Right Wing! 

34 minutes ago, hippo said:

I think its taken even Brexit by surprise. Johnson is now saying there is no rush to quit the EU. Amazingly I saw John Redwood saying we should say with access to the single market - But not accept free movement of labour (good luck with those negotiations). There doesn't seem any plan as to what we do now 

I think a lot people who voted Leave - aren't so convinced less than 24 hours later .....I have heard people say 'i voted leave but didn't think we would'  - its seems like protest vote gone wrong....

28 minutes ago, krisagg75 said:

i wonder how much of the leave vote was an anti government vote.

This. I really think that the whole of the UK is completely disenfranchised with the current political system. Look at the General Election and how the SNP and UKIP scored massive votes. Even Greens did better than previous years. Then you look at  Corbyn being voted in, a clear indication for the Labour party that they were utterly unhappy with the Blair clones that kept on being presented to them. 

Then this vote where you had the "establishment" on 1 side and the "outsiders" on the other with the majority of "outers" being from poor, disillusioned backgrounds. To me there are definite people on both sides; but a large part of the middle ground are sick of what has happened over the last 8/9 years and want change and this is "change". 

33 minutes ago, av1 said:

Looking back to David Cameron's renegotiation talks with the EU, with the rather arrogant 'like it or lump it attitude' that seemed to come across.  I wonder if:

1) A better deal may have swayed a few more voters to remain.

2) The EU leaders are regretting the stance. 

It seems to me that no one really took brexit seriously, almost as if remain was certainty. 

If there was a 3rd option of "Go back and get a better deal" I think that would have probably got 80-90%. Most people appear to say that "it's not right at the moment" and that needs tinkering with. When given the options of "like it or lump it", well it forces the hands and as said above, people are sick of the status quo and want change. When it actually has got through, I really do not think people appreciated how annoying politicians are. 

29 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

The problem is, the senior figures on the Leave campaigns have no relevant power. Gove is a minister, for something completely irrelevant, the rest have no influence at all. So they were free to promise the world, knowing they didn't have to actually deliver anything. Redwood is still in that position hence his ridiculous 'plan'.

Now we have a pro EU PM and Chancellor, who know they'll be gone in a few months and probably have no intention of actually getting the ball rolling, so who is supposed to be dealing with it? I can only assume things are essentially on hold until a new Conservative leader is elected?

Nothing will probably happen now unitl the new PM is elected and even then if they call a snap General Election it could be even longer before it even gets started. When it apparently took Greenland 3 years to leave I cannot imagine how long it would take to untangle everything in order to leave. 

And the lack of a "plan" was, for me, one of the massive flaws in the Leave campaign. They couldn't give a real answer as to what would happen if we did vote and right now you've got a mixture of "call it now" or "enact own legislation" or "wait for a short while". None of the "outers" are saying the same thing and right now it is a complete mess. 

This is why I am worried about it all. It is a complete gamble and nobody has a damn clue of what to do. Even bloody Farage can only talk about creating a bloody Bank Holiday for "Independance Day". It has been a shambles from beginning to end, with damn lying politicians (on both sides) and it does not surprise me that people are so anti government/politics. 

I do wonder if a poll was done in a month's time to see what people's views are; I wouldn't be surprised at all if "Remain" would win that time.

1 minute ago, MessiWillSignForVilla said:

The one positive for me from this shit show is at least Farage and UKIP can **** off now, they literally have no reason for existing anymore.

They won't. When the General Election happens next year (because it will) they will argue that they are the only true voice to negotiate the terms of the leave. Given that its clear that the Labour vote has gone to Leave and consequentially UKIP; I can see that there will be a hung parliament again and Tories will probably have to use UKIP to keep them in power. 

So that "Straight Outta Europe" poster and any comparison to the future cabinet may be closer to the truth than you think... 

3 minutes ago, jon_c said:

S**t no one tell Dr Xia.

This is what he has put up on weibo... (Poorly translated via Google)

Quote

英国宣布正式脱欧。昨日和英国大使Woodward、公使沟通，称RECON如今是在英国知名度最高的中国企业，脱欧后对中国企业投资英国的影响：1、食品业机会巨大；2、英国足球消费和品牌技术输出将会有更大潜力；3、英镑贬值给投资带来更多机会。虽然长远角度不赞成脱欧，总之对中国大多数企业而言却得多于失。

Quote

Britain announced officially off Europe . Yesterday and British Ambassador Woodward, minister of communication , said RECON is now in the UK most famous Chinese enterprises, investment British influence in Europe after the removal of the Chinese Enterprise: 1 , tremendous opportunities for the food industry ; 2 , the British soccer brand and consumer technology export will there is greater potential ; 3 , the depreciation of the pound to bring more investment opportunities . Although long-term perspective in favor of removal in Europe, in short, but much to lose for most Chinese enterprises .

I think he knows...

I cannot believe that fear of immigrants has won...

Never really understood why a referendum was necessary. Clear majority of MPs (450 I think) were remain. The whole issue is damn well massive and complicated. The arguments got completely lost in "they took are jobs" which is wrong anyway!

What bugs more me is that leave now saying "shouldn't do it by the EU regs way" do it our own way so we can argue better agreements. Well surely if our ones at the moment so so bad wouldn't you want to just get the **** out?! 

 Will be interesting to see what the EU now say and whether they will renegotiate the terms for Britain to stay and make the referendum void as "we weren't voting for THAT union". 

All this is going to do is cause utter chaos, and the majority of people AGREED with Farage and ******* UKIP!!!

But Birmingham has the biggest electorate (approx 700,000 I think BBC just said). If we use our wonderful villa talk poll of 85% remain that's around 595,000 votes for remain so should be fine  

Seriously wouldn't mind a big remain vote to be announced just to settle the nerves...

I think we will unlikely see any signings until RDM has had a proper look at the squad in training.

RDM will be clear of some major deficits last season (hence Elphick) and I wouldn't be surprised if he is looking at Pantilimon/Morrison/Bamfors as these are areas with clear deficits in the team from last season, a blind monkey could tell you that! 

Othewise I think he will be looking at the squad and seeing who he can use/who needs to go. Those that have told him they want out (I remember reading that he has already spoken to each player) he will be lining up replacements in readiness. 

Thats what I would do anyway  

And FWIW if RDM wanted Morrison, he reckons he can get his head back on straight and actually play football; which if he can would be brilliant! 

Absolutely delighted with this. Could be an excellent character in the dressing room. This gives RDM and team a real opportunity to see what his fitness is at. Real win-win situation IMO. FWIW here's the 

BBC Article:

Quote

Stiliyan Petrov: Ex-Aston Villa captain to resume training with relegated club

 

 

• 1 hour ago
• From the sectionFootball

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Stiliyan Petrov made the most recent of his 218 Villa appearances on 24 March 2012

Former Aston Villa captain Stiliyan Petrov is to resume training with the first team, after more than four years away from football.

Petrov, 36, has been recovering from an acute form of leukaemia, which was first diagnosed in 2012.

But he has now been invited to join up with Villa for their pre-season training camp in Austria on 7 July.

The 105-times capped Bulgaria international is still hopeful of making a return to football.

And, although it is now three years since he officially retired from professional football,Villa have always kept the door open for him.

He is now looking to improve his fitness ahead of the new season, as he needs group training at a level higher than that at which he has been playing.

He has initially been invited to train for a month on a non-contract basis with Villa, who start life in the Championship with a trip to face Sheffield Wednesday at Hillsborough on 7 August, having been relegated to the second tier for the first time since 1987.

Petrov's battle with leukaemia 

Petrov was then Villa boss Martin O'Neill's first signing when he arrived from Celtic for £6.5m in August 2006.

He first showed symptoms of leukaemia after developing a fever following a 3-0 defeat at Arsenal in March 2012 and was diagnosed with the disease a few days later after making 218 appearances for Villa and more than 500 in British football. 

He had four months of chemotherapy before it was announced in August of the same year that the disease was in remission.

Fuelled by the love and support of the Villa fans, he has since set up a foundation to help leukaemia sufferers.

BBC WM's Mark Regan on Petrov

"For both sides this makes a lot of sense.

"Petrov can continue to get fitter and fitter in an environment he's familiar with around people that respect him.

"For Villa, if he proves to be fit enough to make a return to the game then they'll surely have first refusal on his services. 

"He'll learn a lot about how his body is when he joins up with Villa in Austria and flies into his first 50-50 challenge.

"But the very fact that he's at this stage is nothing short of remarkable and says an awful lot about the man himself."

7 minutes ago, Wainy316 said:

Very pleased with Heineken, a nice 5% lager.  Anything but the dreaded trio of Carling, Fosters and Carlsberg (Export not included).

I would normally agree with you but hated it when we had Heineken a few years back, tasted rubbish and gave me a headache. It is much better in Holland though, they do send the crap stuff over to us muppets who will put up with it!

Ah well hopefully they will have Johns Smiths/Tetleys/some random bitter still, at least it's palatable! Would wish for a decent ale though, even a speckled hen would do!!! 

1 hour ago, VillaChris said:

Does seeded mean we're at home?

I think it means we don't play another seeded team, that's all.

52 minutes ago, jackbauer24 said:

How do they work out North and South?

I've always wanted to watch Villa play Shrewsbury, but we're in different parts of the draw! Where's the cut?! Cambridge is also in North despite being further south than Brum...

40 minutes ago, It's Your Round said:

No idea how it works but I bet southerners are to blame. They always get confused about anything north of Watford gap.

This, the Twitter profile suggests they do it by area and hence some anomalies. Of course they are based in London so do struggle with "North"...

3 hours ago, Villan_of_oz said:

While I agree with you wholeheartedly from a making a stand and paving the way for a new beginning surely we can find someone to take him on if we pay part wages...... no point throwing away good money remember we are saving up so we can be the best team in the world (we're going to need lors and lots of money $$$$$$)

3 hours ago, El-Reacho said:

We're bound to be able to knock a few quid off that sum given that he's not been able to do his job for us because he's not fit? Offer him £3m and then agree somewhere in the middle.

Agree with you both but was thinking if he was to do an N'Zogbia and just do nothing for 2 years rather than take a pay cut elsewhere. Could be a real negative influence in the dressing room and honestly think it could be money well spent.