WakefieldVillan

Goes without saying this will be tougher than it would have been had we played earlier in the season - Didn't they start with SIX defeats and not win their first until 12 games in! 

But they have definitely improved since then and we're unfortunate against Man Utd last time out - Given Deano knows our players better than anyone then it makes it perhaps more difficult than it should/could be.

That said, on paper, we have better players all over the park and not one of their players would dislodge ours IMO - That's not being disrespectful, that's just the truth - So really we should be looking for 3 points tonight for sure.

They will be up for it and see this as a big chance for 3 points also so we need to make sure we match their desire, effort and work rate and if we do that our quality should shine through.

Martinez, Cash, Targett, Konsa, Mings, Luiz, McGinn, Sanson, Buendia, Watkins and El Ghazi (who I think could be suited to tonight's game).

19 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I don't think it's a foul.

I do think it's a penalty. 

In the modern game, those are given consistently, they are understood to be given by players and managers and to an extent by supporters.

Mings makes the mistake of running along a line that lets Salah get in front of him, that's his error, Salah sees that, throws his hip across Mings to put his body between man and ball, slows down as much as he can and waits for Mings momentum to come into him. Mings does nothing but run, but he's made the mistake already in the angle of his run - he's not set out to foul Salah and he's not made any physical effort to try to foul him - for me, he hasn't fouled him - but it's still a definite penalty, because that's how the rule is interpreted and how it's understood by everyone involved.

He knows the mistake is the angle of his run, Salah knows that too and the referee will always blow his whistle once the contact happens - it's a penalty - we can argue the morality of that until the cows come home, but that's the way the rule is interpreted and the way it's consistently interpreted and I guess some sort of consistency is at least nice to have.

 

 

If it isn't a foul (by Mings) then it shouldn't be a pen - Regardless of whether they "usually" get given or not. 

If there is a foul then it is by Salah - he is stepping into Mings - Which our manager agrees with.

At full speed it looks like a pen - and I will reiterate I can see why it was given, but slowed down you can see it is manipulated by Salah and compounded by the theatrical fall.

I think Mings did make the mistake of getting "too close" and giving Salah the chance to go down (he has previous of course) and maybe he at the time thought it was a foul, hence an acceptance in his reaction, but I bet once he's seen it back he would certainly change his mind.

If that was Ollie at the other end I would still maintain that if that was given as a pen then it is extremely soft but as others have alluded to - it wouldn't have been given, I am very confident of that. It's a bigger club decision that happened throughout the weekend.

2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

It's a stonewall penalty to be honest. I honestly don't understand the controversy.

If that happens in the other box we'd be laughing at Liverpool fans if they said it wasn't a pen

I think the fact that there's a few of us on here debating it indicates it isn't really a stonewall one. 

27 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Chelsea and Man City's penalties were extremely soft.

I just don't think Salah's was. Mings clearly fouls him. Salah might have made the most of it, but like I said above Trezeguet has made the most of it in that one vs Brighton. Doesn't mean it isn't a foul.

 

Ultimately if that happened to Ings in their box and we didn't get the penalty, then we'd all be going absolutely mental about it.

The difference is, of course, we probably wouldn't get it. That's the issue really.

That's fair enough, I just think Salah has initiated contact then made the most of it therefore not a pen for me. I agree Trez made the most of the Brighton one too (in fact more so)  

I would like to think that if Ings did the same as Salah had, then I would have had the same opinion and said no pen, but hey ho - It was given, we probably deserved nothing on balance of play but very frustrating nevertheless.

Not liked VAR from day one and still don't. It has it's uses if used right but we still get poor decision after poor decision and it's one of the things that's killing the game (for me).

1 hour ago, Stevo985 said:

The Salah penalty is so obviously a penalty. I really don't understand the debate around it. Even Mings didn't complain.

I don't think it is obvious TBH. At first glance I can see why it was given, that's before you take into account it's at the Kop End and they have had a couple of other ones they appealed from earlier in the game (dives!) so no doubt the pressure was mounting from the home fans. 

But our gaffer as said this after the game:

"Ultimately the game has been decided by a penalty. There were two penalty incidents in the game, Liverpool got theirs – if you look at that one, Salah fouls Mings first"

“We’ve lost to a soft penalty because if you watch it properly, Tyrone’s been fouled first. The disappointing thing is that the referee hasn’t gone to look at it.

I agree with him. I don't think ours was either FWIW. 

I thought Chelsea's winning pen, City's pen and Man Utd's pen were all soft and if it was roles reversed none would have been given IMO.

1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

One player id love is Raphinha. Such a quality player but maybe not quite good enough for the top 3 clubs. So it’s case of the likes of United, Spurs, Arsenal, Leicester eventually going in for him.  We need to one day try and compete with these teams for signings. 

Yep great player I agree, he's been linked to Liverpool a fair bit though and personally I could see that one happening.

I think he would fancy himself getting plenty of game time and with Salah (29 yrs) Mane (29) and Firmino (30) they can't go on forever so they will be looking for quality younger replacements to integrate into the side (as with Jota).

3 minutes ago, Reivax_Villa said:

If we finish in the top 8 this season, I can see is going for Kalvin Phillips next summer.

I think if he leaves dirty Leeds then it will probably be for a champs league club, and my money would be on Liverpool.

If Leeds were relegated then we'd possibly have more chance (if there were no ECL suitors), mainly due to the Gerrard factor, as a midfielder who wouldn't want to learn from one of the best premier league midfielders there has been, buuuuuut.... I still think it's VERY unlikely.

Also, maybe if Bielsa leaves - I would love it if it happened though, think he would be an absolute monster for us.

Need to start much better than we did at Leicester - I don't think we really got going until the "goal" that wasn't. If we start as sloppy as we did then the game will be over after 15 mins (maybe earlier!)

Bit early for a team selection but I think guaranteed starters (any fitness concerns aside) are these 7 - Martinez, Cash, Konsa, Mings, McGinn, Nakamba and Watkins.

I personally would add Buendia onto that list because I think he had a good second half on Sunday and I think he can give us that bit of magic. So that's 8 of the 11.

That leaves 3 places up for grabs.

Ashley Young (after a ropey first 15) played pretty well against the Foxes - probably deserves to start, whether that be at LB or further forward but will 3 games in 10 days be too much even for a fit guy like Young (awaits KW gif) ? That's the concern with this one. Will Matt Targett be fit, if so, I would expect (& hope) he comes straight back in at LB. I think he edges AY in that position but whoever plays there is going to be severely tested so need to be bang at it. - I will assume MT is fit and he is selection 9 and that's the defence sorted.

I am assuming Bailey / Traore / Ings / Trez are all either out or not up to speed so I don't think they are in the reckoning which leaves 2 places to be occupied by either Young, Luiz, Ramsey, Sanson, Chuk, El Ghazi, Davis and JPG or if there's a formation change Axel or Hause.

I don't expect a formation change so I think it will probably be Luiz and Ramsey that get the nod. I personally would like to see Sanson start but anyway, whoever starts, tough tough game and a bit like the Man City fixture I would accept a decent performance and a close game - I think we have the tools to hurt their backline but if on song they could destroy ours. Nil nil then  

Just now, Zatman said:

I think the only way we dont play our strongest team is if we are in a relegation battle 

I agree. In the Gerrard interview with Carragher that was shown before the Leicester match he said he wanted European football and to win a (FA) cup in the future, add to that we are playing a team he would love to get the better of then I think it's a given we will go as full strength as possible.

So maybe not the ideal draw in terms of progressing (I still think we have a good chance) but I think it is a tie that will definitely appeal to our fan base, with a decent allocation and no doubt a loud travelling army - I think this will definitely be picked for TV viewing.

It is not as daunting as it would have been in previous seasons and the players can take lots of confidence from the result at OT earlier this season - I think it could be a classic! which we will win  

21 hours ago, villalad21 said:

For what it's worth I thought he was good last season too whenever called upon.

 

6 hours ago, PussEKatt said:

Totally different player to the one under DS

4 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Agreed.

It's about showing consistency now.

 

So which is it ? 

Of course he's playing better, everyone can see that, but he still had good games under Smith just he was often left out regardless because Smith preferred other options (against 'weaker' opponents). 

Don't think he's suddenly become the next Kante but nor was he a Salifou. The truth is he's a capable midfielder that can do a decent job for us when required.

I like him.

He has given the ball away way too much for my liking since he's been here. I think part due to fitness, part confidence and part trying too hard to impress.

Along with settling into a new city, a new club, with new team mates, a new manager (well, 2 new managers) I think he has done ok but will only get better.

Anyone with half a footballing brain can see that he has talent, whether it be picking a pass or a bit of trickery, he has shown glimpses of this and his work rate can't be faulted either IMO so I think it really bodes well moving forward with his Villa career. 

Have always liked him and felt he has been harshly judged by a few but he is playing very well at the moment and warrants his place in the side for sure.

It must be such a confidence boost for him to be selected by an ex-midfielder as good as Gerrard in these first few games of his tenure and you can see that with his last few performances.

Though to be fair he had several isolated games under Smith where he performed decent so I do think there has always been a good player in there.

Definitely one I would be keeping in the squad that's for certain.

56 minutes ago, andykeenan said:

The draw 7pm ITV 4

The draw numbers

1 Bournemouth

2 Arsenal

3 Aston Villa

4 Barnsley

5 Birmingham City

6 Blackburn Rovers

7 Blackpool

8 Brentford

9 Brighton & Hove Albion

10 Bristol City

11 Burnley

12 Cardiff City

13 Chelsea

14 Coventry City

15 Crystal Palace

16 Derby County

17 Everton

18 Fulham

19 Huddersfield Town

20 Hull City

21 Leeds United

22 Leicester City

23 Liverpool

24 Luton Town

25 Manchester City

26 Manchester United

27 Middlesbrough

28 Millwall

29 Newcastle United

30 Norwich City

31 Nottingham Forest

32 Peterborough United

33 Preston North End

34 Queens Park Rangers

35 Reading

36 Sheffield United

37 Southampton

38 Stoke City

39 Swansea City

40 Tottenham Hotspur

41 Watford

42 West Bromwich Albion

43 West Ham United

44 Wolverhampton Wanderers

45 Yeovil Town

46 Bristol Rovers

47 Port Vale

48 Morecambe

49 Hartlepool United

50 AFC Wimbledon

51 Wigan Athletic

52 Leyton Orient

53 Cambridge United

54 Mansfield Town

55 Swindon Town

56 Rotherham United

57 Charlton Athletic

58 Boreham Wood or St Albans City

59 Kidderminster Harriers

60 Shrewsbury Town

61 Chesterfield

62 Plymouth Argyle

63 Ipswich Town or Barrow

64 Harrogate Town

It doesn't have to be two hands just in control of the ball... buuuuut...

Freeze framing it with his one hand on the top of the ball tells a complete different picture to watching in real time. He was never in control and that was a goal all day long.

Game has gone.

And if we don't pull our finger out this one will be. We've been dreadful.

I'd take a draw tbh, these are a better side than current league standings and in Maddison and Vardy they have players who can hurt us if we're not up to the challenge. 

Goes without saying I'd love a win but 2-2 for me ! 

17 hours ago, Chine said:

Not sure about the Cash 5 , Sterling was lively and hardwork , I thought Cash did well and was better than that 

You're right Sterling was lively, a big threat all night, I just thought Cash struggled to contain him (though he kept plugging away). Maybe I expect more from him, I would have liked him to leave one on him (easier said than done) but I suppose risking going down to 10 isn't really advisable. We wouldn't have seen the ball again . I was disappointed with the over weighted cross he made that led to their second goal and he had another easy ball to Buendia which he completely didn't see / chose to try an harder ball, that was a real chance of putting us in front. But that said maybe a tad harsh 

My ratings:

Emi 6

Cash 5

Konsa 7

Mings 7

Targett 6.5

Luiz 7.5

McGinn 6

Nakamba 7

Bailey 2

Watkins 8

Buendia 7.5

Young 7.5

Chuk 6

Sanson 6.5

Gerrard 7.5 

We won the second half and probably deserved to as well, on another night we may have got a point. 

Proud of every one of them, lots of positives. Only real negative was Bailey, who had a mare. 

This is the "leaked" City team from their forum:

                      Ederson 
Cancelo    Dias    Ake     Zinchenko
  Fernandinho Rodri Bernardo 
   Mahrez      Jesus       Sterling

It's still a ridiculously good side on paper. 

As in all matches against this lot, I just want us to perform as well as we can (on & off the ball), no stupid mistakes that cost us a goal (let them earn it) and basically, not get battered!

Oh and not being p***** off with the ref or VAR would be nice too!

Hated him as a player, hate(d) Liverpool so hardly surprising as he was one of their greatest ever players - But whenever I have seen any of his interviews at Rangers he always comes across well and my feelings towards him had definitely softened during time.

But TBH, I don't care about any of his playing past, other than he should have a great influence on our (young) players, particularly the midfielders so that for one is a good reason for his appointment.

He will get my 100% full support and although he is no Dean Smith whom I wanted to be given longer, that ship as sailed having a Villa Manager / Captain scenario (which I loved about our club) so why not. He's young, he's a winner, he has ambition, he has personal pride - To me it's a bigger risk for him than it is for us and that shows a lot to me about his character as an individual. 

Every management appointment is a risk, this one on paper might be riskier than a lot of other choices we could have made, but who knows what the future holds, as said I didn't want Deano sacked but I am genuinely excited with this move and hope that he proves the doubters wrong UTV 

End of the day whoever we appoint there will be an element of risk attached to it so I think we have to just trust our owners / CEO to make the right choice and when that choice is made we all back the new manager 100% and give him time to stamp his authority.

Of the unlikely "big" name managers, I'd obviously go for the likes of Ten Hag, Favre, Poch, Simeone, Mancini ETC - But realistically I can't see us attracting any of them, possibly Favre but the others are out of our league.  I'd still hope we we're trying for that kind of calibre though.

Of the more likelier names (top of the "betting") I definitely wouldn't want Terry, Lampard, Hassenhuttl, Nuno, Frank or (definitely not) Martinez. I am unsure of the likes of Fonseca, Hjulmand (know little about them) and AVB.

So that leaves Potter and Gerrard who I would be more than happy with - though on paper you could argue that neither are a huge upgrade on Smith. 

I like what Potter has done at Brighton and although they aren't winning lots of football matches (the reason why we are in this manager search now!) he has them playing some very pleasing football on the eye and more often than not they just miss the killer finish (the game where we drew 0-0 at their place was basically them in a nutshell, they bossed us for 90 minutes doing everything but score). But every time I've watched them (whoever the opponent) they have been good to watch. I like Potter as a person, he comes across well, also got the Villa link but that wouldn't be the reason I would want him - He is a good age and I think he would do a decent job here if appointed. He find him and Smith are on a similar par TBH. It's a safer option than Gerrard I feel. 

Gerrard (Stevie G to his friends ) on the other hand, well, when his name was first mentioned I was immediately all for it - which is surprising because I have hated him all the way through his playing days. The slippy G moment was one of my footballing highlights (yes, I'm a child  ) but yes, never liked him one bit as a player, the screamers he scored past us, the dodgy freekick that he won himself, the red card tackle on Boateng, though spoiling his birthday cup final celebrations was one of the nicer moments! Buuuuuuut all that aside....

...I think (not sure why) he would be a good manager here. I think he has done a decent job at Rangers (hard to judge I know - "crAp league" "Celtic implosion" ETC) But there is a huge pressure up there and I think from what I have seen / heard he has handled it all very well, going a whole season unbeaten is a great accolade regardless of what league you are in, he's done coaching at Anfield too so he's progressed the right way. It's definitely a gamble if we were to appoint him, based on his managerial experience but then you look at what he achieved as a player and the winning mentality that he has, the effect he could have on our (young) players and I think it could be immense. Of course as a person he may not win over a lot of our fanbase, I get that, but I never thought Terry would yet he did. I think Gerrard would see Villa as a massive club (bit like Carragher, Neville ETC) I think he would act with respect and dignity, like Terry did and who knows what he would achieve. Maybe we need that bit of nastiness on the sideline, maybe it will help us with the VAR crap and poor refereeing decisions, who knows. Unpopular on here so it seems but I'm for it. But whoever it is will have my full support for at least two matches

First thought was that it will be Nuno, no real reason just a gut feeling. But if the new manager is already employed that rules him out. 

Not convinced with many of the names linked hence why I'd have stuck with Smith.

Echo what 98% of people are saying in here, I'm absolutely gutted. A real nice guy, who is claret and blue through and through. It was fairy tale stuff having Jack as captain and Deano at the helm but it's ended in a sad way. 

I wish him all the best in his future,was he perfect, well no, of course not - is he a good manager? Of course he is, he has done a great job here and can hold his head up high. 

Watching the memory video brought a tear to my eyes! This appointment is absolutely MASSIVE. 

All the best Dean UTV 

ANNOUNCE BIELSA 

@villalad21