barry'sboots

The thing is, Delph and NRC bashed them around the park (Or so I've heard) on Saturday, so I'd like to see them play, but 442 this season has won us more games, and we all know MON won't drop Petrov again, so it's a tough one really. Delph could come on as a sub at halftime for NRC/Petrov, depending on whether we're winning or not.

With 4-5-1, we are 9 points from 9, including away wins at Plop and Blues. I'm afraid it is impossible to argue statistically that 4-4-2 is superior to 4-5-1 for us this season.

Better to lose 4-3 then 1-0 so no 4 5 1 please

Don't get this. We have played it 3 times this year and beat Plop away 3-1, Fulham and Blues away and this is without DJ allowing Jimmy to be one of the midfield three. As in the Blues game we always have the option of an impact sub, particularly with JC on the bench.

We have been to Blackburn in a 4-4-2, admittedly without Jimmy in the middle, and been very poor and got done by Dunne. NRC in there would neutralise him.

I don't see the 4-5-1 as being negative, particularly if you play two attacking midfielders in Jimmy and Delph? This allows Ash and DJ to play closer to Gab, our full backs to push further forward and masses of interchanging with Ash, DJ, Millie and Delph all slightly freed up with NRC behind them.

I would go for:

----------------- Guzan ------------------

Young--- Carlos --- Dunne --- Warnock

----------------- NRC ---------------------

Ash --- Jimmy ---- Delph --- DJ

------------Gabby------------

Coker and DJ have just bossed them at our place and I wouldn't change this. Stan and JC as subs if we need to make changes.

Guzan every time for me. Not a better keeper just yet, although has the potential.

Guzan - Great pen save, poor mistake for their goal, little else to do.

Beye - Good first half, poor second half. Looks clueless when he has time on the ball and too slow to get forward on the overlap.

Cuellar - Another really solid game. We are now seeing the player that was the best player in Scotland and so strong in Ranger's Uefa Cup run.

Collins - Rock solid and read the game really well.

Warnock - Solid. Passing a bit off as it has been the last few games.

Downing - Okay. Thought Marc should have had the chance today.

NRC - Excellent today. Does what it says on the tin and, IMO, the best partner for Milner or Delph in a 4-4-2 as he gives them licence to play. Looked a bit lost second half when we had more time against ten men.

Delph - Very good and keeps us ticking along. I would love to see a midfield 3 of NRC, Delph and Jimmy.

Ash - Quality crosses caused two goals.

Heskey - Didn't really see much quality there today. Works hard but frustrating and too far away from the goal to be a threat.

Fonz - Okay. Good goal and worked hard. I would love to see get a game alongside Gabby.

Carew - Okay.

Sidwell - Lot of running, little product. Struggling to see the point and would offload with Gardner IF there was a strong replacement available - Scotty Parker anybody?

What worries me is the bit i highlighted, what does this mean for Milner? because he is not a defensive midfielder, so what will happen to him? I'm not his biggest fan unlike the mass majority on here, again i think last night he was poor he seems to have picked up the Ashley Young trick of constantly cutting back to put a ball into the box and losing possession. However, he has improved massively on last year.

I assume it means 4-5-1 with Millie a our Stevie G and the new playmaker as our Alonso (to use Plop's formation of last year).

NRC was my Motm till he came off last night think he proved alot of people wrong, am getting fed up of the pure fickleness of people in the crowd. Slating Gabby for anything saying he's shit always has been etc i just wonder what these people were saying when he scored against United 2 weeks ago, or Blues in the 85th min at the shithole?...its very disappointing..

Agree on both these points. Don't understand why NRC came off in front of Stan and JC??

What was nice to see was MON making subs to try to win the game, whether we agree with his choices or not he went for it last night and made the changes early enough for them to have an effect, it didnt work because of some awful luck...

I agree - good to see subs just wrong ones IMO. Stan, who is not the fittest anyway, plays two full games in three days???

I thought heyesterday's game showed up his main weakness again - an inability to flex the side for game situations.

We have played Plop and Arsenal (Big 4 sides that play 4-5-1/4-3-3) four times away in the last couple of seasons and got murdered in the two where we played 4-4-2 and won the two comfortably where we match up to their formation. Not hard to understand IMO.

So from now on MON should look at results 2 years ago and play the exact formation if we won the game regardless of new players he has purchased or new players the opposition have purchased, yes i'm sure that will work all the time for us.

Or are you just picking out 2 games out of 2 seasons worth of football to support your view?

Sorry, you must be right. That Plop game away in September was two years ago and the Arsenal game that was last December I think was also two years ago.

I would intuitively say 4th spot as CL allows you to build, but a lot depends upon Randy's agenda. If he has the money to build and get in a couple of quality players with CL promised then I would stick with this view but if, as Everton did, we couldn't take that next step due to lack of funding then maybe a cup would be better.

I want a win after two losses.

------------------ Guzan ------------------

Beye --- Collins --- Cuellar --- Warnock

Ash ----- NRC ----- Milner ----- Downing

----------------- Delph --------------------

----------------- Gabby -------------------

HONESTLY?

If we had Fabregas & Torres in our team we'd be challenging for the title.

Friedel - Nothin Wrong

Young - Solid

Warnock - Fooked up but still solid

Dunne - Brick

Cueller - Shakey

Milner - 110%

Downing - Looked lost

Petrov - He played?

NRC - Why subbed?

Carew - Standard

Gabby - 110%

I seriously think Petrov & Carlos need breaks. Bring in Collins & NRC we'll be back to winning ways.

Didn't think Carlos or DJ were that bad.

Thought MON's subs were very poor again. For me, it should have been Stan and Carew off for Delph and Albrighton with half an hour left and switch to 4-3-3.

Makes me really annoyed how MON talks about tiredness and rotation BUT will not sub a poor Stan, who has played nearly every minute of the season and looked whacked, but has no hesitation to take of a fresh NRC.

I thought heyesterday's game showed up his main weakness again - an inability to flex the side for game situations.

We have played Plop and Arsenal (Big 4 sides that play 4-5-1/4-3-3) four times away in the last couple of seasons and got murdered in the two where we played 4-4-2 and won the two comfortably where we match up to their formation. Not hard to understand IMO.

No doubt if we'd played 4-5-1 and lost people would be on here complaining about the fact that we changed from 4-4-2, which had won us the past 4 games including the one at Old Trafford. Everyone's a wannabe football manager

We may well have lost - Arsenal are a decent side and we could always have played poorly - but at least we would have tried something. As it was we were lucky to have only lost 3-0 as they were carving us open down the centre almost at will. The second and third goals both came from intricate play through our CM.

Be tempted to go 4-5-1 in this one.

Don't think Heskey is 100% and just don't like Carew in the team at the moment, rather he be an impact sub if we need a goal.

Perhaps...

Usual back 4.

------Petrov------

---Coker--Delph-

Milner--------Downing

--------Gabby---------

and let's really get stuck into them, confidence isn't high, let's match them in the middle and get stuck into them early, don't let them settle.

This for me. The Plop games in the second half of last season and earlier this season and the Arsenal game shows that we are not good enough to play Sky 4 teams that play 4-3-3 with a 4-4-2 and that we need to match up to their formation to give ourselves a chance. Whilst this Plop team, particularly without Mascherano, are nowhere near as slick as the Arsenal CM they would overrun a Petrov + 1.

The only change I might make is to drop Stan, who IMO had a very poor game against Arsenal and looked tired (but MON will never do this), and bring in Albrighton to keep Jimmy in the middle.

JC as the impact sub and big Emile to get a rest before the Blackburn FA Cup game.

Please God a 2-0 victory!

For a great piece of hindsight.....

4 - 5 - 1 was the right formation for today....

This, this and this. Said it in the pre match thread so its not hindsight. We beat them last year at the Emirates with 4-5-1 and we beat Plop earlier this year with a 4-5-1 - both Sky 4 teams that set themselves up in a 4-5-1. Both teams are too good in the centre of the park for Petrov + 1 to keep them under wraps. They were having a field day and taking the pi**. Don't understand why MON can't see that sometimes he needs to change the shape slightly to play against certain good teams. I blame MON for today.

WTF he thought JC was going to add, on the evidence of the season so far, was beyond me and I think it was completely the wrong game to give Delph 20 minutes unless it was with a 3 man CM.

Our style will definitely suit Arsenal who will come at us but I think Liverpool would consider a point at VP a good one these days.

Our style didn't suit them very much last year when we were arguably a poorer side (without the back 4 we currently have, DJ or the bulked up Gabby) - 4 points and it probably should have been 6 given the domination at VP. I think this was with the 4-5-1 though so I'd like to see us playing that against the Arsenal and matching their formation.

Plop came to VP last year for a point as well with Rafa playing Robbie Keane on the LW in a defensive 4-5-1.

My heart says six points is available BUT my head is confused. I think we are better than last year BUT all good runs come to an end at some point.

I think he has been great when played alongside an experienced Premier League CB in Laursen - he looks really strong, good in the air, quick and no nonsense. I am not sure where all of the "bad attitude" comments have come from?

He struggled alongside Carlos when Carlos was finding his feet in the Premier League. Now Carlos has found those feet, I think Curtis could play alongside any of the other three CBs and do well. I think this is quite often the case with young CBs though and Dawson at Spurs has had the same problem - looks great alongside Woodgate or King but struggles with a less experienced partner. This is about maturing as a player in probably one of the most difficult positions (alongside a keeper) as mistakes often mean goals.

Great position to have - 4 quality CBs - but we will need a European run and good cup runs to keep them all happy next year and I'm not sure rotating CBs is the best idea as they need to build partnerships. The other challenge is to make sure that Baker and Clark are given a chance to prove themselves and then integrated into the squad if they are good enough. Much better problem to have than not though!!

As for NRC he'll get his chance and he has to take it!

I thought he had taken it - every chance he has had this season. Doesn't seem to make a lot of difference to MON.

Mine wasn't a "whinge". I, like any Villa supporter, am thrilled that we are in fourth spot. Just discussing, on a discussion forum, what I would have done differently. Pretty much the purpose of this site for me and think it would be pretty boring site if every one just posted "Wow isn't this great. MON is a god."

A bit OTT Straker, although I agree with some of your sentiment. I do also think we could have quite easily ended up with a draw or, in a worst case, a loss against Stoke.

We had candidates for MOTM but they all, IMO, came from the back 4 - Cuellar, Dunne and Young. This tells you a lot about the game and is really quite disappointing when you consider the quality of the opposition and the fact that we were at home.

I am a bit fed up with the tired comments and the three games in a week argument when we do have a squad and yet we seem not to want to use it even to make substitutions. I do think that NRC should have played against Stoke. Like Wigan, Blackburn and Burnley they are a strong, aggressive and fairly direct side that are not renowned for their footballing capabilities in CM and I do think we struggle against such teams and that MON hasn't really worked out a plan B to knock them off their stride. In this respect I think we are not disimilar to Arsenal.

I like that we can play scruffily and win, I just think we would do it better with a bit more aggression/athleticsm in midfield to match these teams and this means NRC for me from our squad. Even if it is the last half hour or so when everyone, and particularly Stan after three games in a week, is tiring.

Well Albrighton is obviously a no. Although I'd like to see him at some point this season, showed so much promise!

Delph, he's played him in a couple of games this season which shows he isn't scared, I'd be suprised to see him in the team. I just worry 4-4-2 with JC upfront away from home, doesn't really do the same job Emile is doing at the minute of linking the play and providing an easy option for the ball, where as possible an extra advanced midfielder would do this? If Heskey weren't fit and we lined up with Milner behind Gabby, Downing and Young on flanks, I'd be really pleased but I just worry of Downing's fitness playing so many games in a short period of time.

I'm sure we'll end up going 4-4-2 with Carew up top, winning and showing me I know sweet FA. (again)

I'm with you AVFC PoB. I would like to see 4-5-1 irrespective of whether Heskey is fit or not, or else we will get overrun by a very good Arsenal 3 man CM. I realy think we need NRC's energy/athleticism to plug the gap between CM and the CBs with Fabregas in there and Arshavin's clever play.

I can see the logic for Delph but I think he will stick with DJ, Milly and Ash and, after 8 days rest I won't be unhappy with this. Plop will be without Mascherano (I think - after his straight red yesterday) so would rather see us rest players against them?

But you are right, we will probably see MON's 4-4-2!

Thought Cuellar was immense. Looks a different player with Dunne alongside him.

We were hopeless in CM against a quality CM of Whelan and Salif Diao!!! Thought we should have had NRC in there with 30 minutes to go to lend a hand, possibly taking off DJ and shifting Gabby to the right.

Tuncay was the sharpest player on the pitch. I so wished MON had bought him in in the summer. Gabby playing off Tuncay would have been ace and would have given us a real option to what we currently have. He is the sort of link player that we need but there aren't many around like him.

Sit back tactics and conceding late goals Feb to May last season. We just stopped playing. Stoke from 2-0 to 2-2, disaster ... that never seemed to stop.

Ridiculous.

I agree that there were times when we could be accused of sitting back but the Stoke game isn't one of them.

We were 2-0 up and absolutely cruising, it was one of the most one-sided matches I've ever seen at VP, Stoke were never in it. Gabby had a great chance to make it 3 but missed, Stoke then scored from a set-piece(?) and a 25 yard half volley, in the space of 3 minutes, how you or anyone else can call that a mistake by MoN is beyond me and illustrates to me that you cannot have played the game yourself, sometimes shit like that just happens and there isn't a lot you can do about it.

Agree to some extent in that I don't think it was sitting back but we were clearly tiring and getting pushed back. FWIW Stoke looked much better in the second half once they had bought on Fuller and tried to join in with the game!

IMO, MON should have used his bench to freshen things up and push Stoke back. I would either have taken Stan off for NRC or gone 4-5-1 and bought NRC on to bring us some energy into the centre of the park where we were starting to lose the battle. Ditto this for the Chelski, Citeh and Spuds home games this season.

Stoke probably most hated lower team in the league. There performance at VP, not only was the worst and most emberassing for a so called football team but also a major moment in the season

They were the worst team I saw at Villa Park last season, and that includes the part-timers we played in the Uefa Cup!!!

You must have left at half time then because they looked pretty decent second half after Fuller came on and they tried to join in the game.

They haven't been great away from home so I would hope, with our recent run of success and the way we have been playing we should have far too much for them. I just hope we either steam roller them 5-0 or, if we get ahead and have a slender lead but start dropping back, that MON will use his bench to freshen things up and push back at them.

I would think we will win by 2+ goals though.

Yeah i am actually. Why play heskey in midfield when you have to CM on the bench who cost 8mill each??? its idiotic

Heskey offers a better option going forward when we get the ball, to help us retain it?

NRC DID come on against United, when he got the ball he just ran it downfield and lost it, he can't hold the ball up like Heskey or Carew.

I'm with you Stevenjos, I would rather see NRC play than Emile play out of position as a 3rd CM'er/part time striker. I think if Nigel plays then Jimmy could push further forward and link up more with Gabby.

I am not saying we couldn't play a second striker that links up play and also drops in to CM when they have the ball, I just don't think that Emile or JC are the right players to do this - not mobile enough or young enough now to get up and down. Luke Moore did it brilliantly a couple of seasons ago at VP when we beat Chelski though. Not sure we have the player that can do this unless Nathan can?

Don't think anyone could argue that Emile works his socks off and JC is a lazy f***er. If only we could merge the two it would be fantastic - JC's talent with Emile's work rate??

As it is I don't think either are right for what we want to do. JC because he is one game in 20, Emile because he would ideally play where Gabby tends to play - up against the CBs to hold the ball up and play in the runners - as opposed to the third CM'er?

Cuellar was excellent. Did get caught out of position a couple of times but Dunne was their to cover - how it should be with a CB pairing.

Maybe Stan didn't make an unsuccessful tackle because every time he couldn't get it he gave away a free kick??