andym

Do we know we can shoot when we get in the box?

Waiting too long to pull the trigger

That one shot aside, McGinn has been a passenger and keeps losing the ball

Poor reffing, but Kamara had Moreno wide open before

Just braindead decision making again

Another good chance squandered

Got to score there Ollie

Carlos challenged Maguire as well and he still won the header

Carlos is very poor in the air

Should never have been a corner though

Set piece again

Disgusting defending

Just now, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Good signs from JJ today!

Good running but then messed it up every time

Just careless

Ramsey's passing is awful

How can he not hit Bailey there?

Wtf Luiz you idiot

Another game where the midfield has started shit

Just brainless play

Just sloppy in the middle of the park by Kamara and Ramsey

Exactly what Man U want

1 hour ago, Kuwabatake Sanjuro said:

We need him to produce some magic today, bad sign from an attacking point of view that this thread hasn't been updated in 2024.

Tielemans nearly scored (should have really) from a great routine last week against Sheffield

Nicely taken goal.

The gap between Schar and Burn there though

8 minutes ago, VillaJ100 said:

Forest being completely useless again. How they beat us 2-0 I have no idea. Teams really save their performances for us

Already had two better chances than they had against us and missed them both

Annoying, Brighton probably the better side for last 30 minutes but missed some good chances, then somehow get caught with a man free at the back post in the 96th minute. Pretty naive of them.

Sounds like Brighton all over Spurs but missing good chances

Brighton started the season really well with 4 wins out their first 6. However since we smashed them at the end of September they've only won 4 more games.

They also have a really bad record away at Spurs

We have green cards in field hockey, 2 minute sin bin. Yellow cards are a minimum of 5 minute sin bin. I've always found the green card quite useful in dealing with minor stuff and nipping something in the bud before it escalates, in particular backchat from players.

No idea if it would work in football though, given the propensity of players to mouth off, you'd end up with half a side in the sin bin.

It's just totally different in terms of relationship between official/player- in hockey if you tell the umpire to **** off you know you are getting a red card (and also getting banned for several weeks). In football players know there is zero risk in doing that, because despite the league/PGMOL always talking about clamping down on that stuff, they never actually follow it through properly. A slight increase in yellows for surrounding the ref/backchat when they announce an initiative (and that's team dependent), but then it just reverts back to usual.  

He only came on vs Burnley as Lengelet was feeling ill. We were still 2-1 up when the sub was made (and had been missing great chances to put the game away).

Definitely missing not just his passing, but his ability to direct the team in the build up. It was pretty early on (everton at home i think) where i watching him and realised already he was the leader orchestrating everything - telling players where to stand, where to pass etc

23 minutes ago, DJBOB said:

Yeah the sequence is different than Sheffield, but the instruction remains the same that Cash is definitely more forward than Konsa in the same position.

The resulting change is a net negative.

• Kamara does not use one of his best abilities (carrying the ball forward to break the lines) because he doesn't want to venture forward too much to make sure he covers for Cash.
• As a result of Cash overlapping, Bailey plays slightly infield when he has been at his best as more of a natural winger hugging the sideline this year without an overlap - and in many cases, because he holds the width - there's often an underlap position which is where Watkins was finding joy against Sheffield and Newcastle 2H.
• Without McGinn filling in at CM, then it's up to Tielemans to play both second striker in the first and second phase, but when Cash goes forward, he has to drop back into the CM area that Kamara would usually be in - but that's not what he's doing - TIelemans is playing closer to the box to provide support.
• Then, this in turn drags Luiz all the way over as the lone CM covering between the defending line and the attacking line.
• And then the final nail in the coffin - McGinn and Moreno are all the way forward which means any resulting loss of possession on the left hand side is easy to exploit given Lenglet's weaknesses

This whole change is not too dissimilar to the Gerrard system. Two attacking fullbacks. Forwards playing in the channels. Number 8's in the fullback position and one CM covering the back line. No wonder it was just as disastrous as many matches under Gerrard.

I wouldn't say its a new thing in terms of the relationship between RB and Kamara though; Kamara has dropped into the back 3 with Cash pushing forward much more so than Konsa previously this season, and we were fine... 

However, in those instances, admittedly we did generally have different personnel elsewhere e.g. Diaby and Zaniolo in as 10's either side of Watkins, McGinn would tuck into the middle with Luiz etc, keeping it strong in the centre of the pitch. 

Its like we're in a bit of a halfway house with Cash in the side recently, a build up set up on our right side that has worked before, but doesn't mesh with who's currently further forwards, with the issues as you've identified. 

I still think for the first goal conceded last night though that was more of very poor execution in a situation where we should have been the ones taking advantage. I'd have been annoyed if Konsa was playing and hadn't looked for that overlap, because it was on.

12 hours ago, DJBOB said:

The first goal against is emblematic of this Kamara/Cash rotation. 

Yes, Kamara probably could have played a better pass but Cash overlapping is running right into Bailey. Cash should be behind the play here, not running ahead into Bailey’s space. And I don’t mean to blame Cash all too much here because his instruction is to clearly be higher up than Konsa. 
  
Look at the yawning chasm between Kamara and Diego when the ball is lost.

Consider our formation against Sheffield in the same loose ball situation. Konsa is behind the ball with Bailey wide, which allows Kamara to turn forward and find Luiz. Notice too how much less space there is between Diego and Kamara. 
 
Its all tied together. 

To be fair, those loose balls come from slightly different situations, Sheff Utd was a bit of head tennis with Konsa nodding forward to Bailey, who then heads to Kamara who has the option to turn and play forward. We were a bit more set in that situation.

Against Chelsea Carlos has just chased down a long ball (hence him being deeper in that image) and knocked it to Cash who was also running back, who plays it inside to Kamara. In this instance he doesn't really have the chance to turn as there is a Chelsea player incoming; he could play back to Carlos, but a few frames before your image, there is a big gap to release Cash (who was deeper than Kamara at that point) behind the Chelsea player if Kamara is quick enough, and that is why Cash starts to move forward.

I think it was the right initial call by Cash, as its the opportunity to trap 6 Chelsea players in our half and be onto their back 4 with 5 players (6 if Luiz in the middle reacts quick enough). You'd be mad not to take that, and it shouldn't have been hard to do. 

The problem is that Kamara takes an extra touch, which closes that pass down. Even then, there is still a pass on in the image in your post, but Cash needs to realise the initial pass is no longer possible and hold his run more than he does, and also pull out a bit wider to give a better angle. He does that and he's still able to receive the ball either to run it himself, or pass it straight on to Bailey and then go forward to support. Either way, there's still that opportunity to take all those Chelsea players out of the game.

However, he just keeps on the same line, Kamara plays a poor pass and its turned over. Add in some shocking tracking back (Kamara and Cash just jog) and its in the back of our net.

I don't think its 100% a systemic issue;  the whole Kamara dropping into the back 3, Cash pushing higher etc have been done successfully earlier in the season at time. But ultimately if you are going to so cheaply surrender possession and then compound that with not working to recover the ball, you aren't going to win football games. The amount of unforced errors recently have been shocking, and we keep doing some really stupid things - last night Cash was tracking a Chelsea player down the line, the Chelsea players trips and falls over. Does Cash simply take the ball and bring it away with him so we can build? No he just boots the ball back up the pitch to a Chelsea player. At the end, Diego Carlos lets the Chelsea forward bring down a goal kick on his boot unchallenged. Just maddening decision making.

Definite loss if the midfield is going to spend all game passing directly to the opposition.

Caused our own downfall tonight by doing that and springing Chelsea on the transition, and as seen at Old Trafford taking advantage of turnovers is Man U's only real strength.

Can't play for 15 minutes out the 90 and spend the rest of the game passing the ball to the opposition then standing watching as they run past you.

Midfield was atrocious

Why does Bailey keep trying to pass through players?