switters

Regardless of the strength of the squad, the question the media should be throwing at McLeish is 'Have you got the best out of the squad you have had at your disposal?'. I don't think he could answer 'yes' honestly.

We lost good players but McLeish seems to have taken 'transitional season' as meaning that decline is acceptable and expected - and that attitude comes out in the way we've played. Transition implies some plan for progression. This season has given little evidence of one.

I had to laugh at this from the Mail:

“I’m used to, having not been the manager until this year, expecting Villa to be in the upper tiers of the Premier League,” said McLeish.

At least he's realistic enough to drop his expectations once he becomes manager

McLeish: I can't spoon feed players

Alex McLeish has told Aston Villa's players he can't "spoon feed" them during games.

The Villa chief was reacting to his side's 3-0 defeat at Arsenal with some poor defending for the Gunners' first two goals rightly leaving him frustrated.

"At some stage you can't spoon feed them every minute of the game with tactics," he said.

"You've got to let them play and at times express themselves.

"I didn't feel that the Emirates was a place to express ourselves in terms of passing about at the back because that's not a strength of ours.

"That's no disrespect to our players as they have other qualities."

McLeish wants Villa to be more dynamic and insists that is his focus rather than the frustrations for the club's fans.

"That's not in my control," he said when asked about the club's supporters.

"I have to try and get a team that can win football matches.

"We had a very good game against Fulham a couple of weeks ago with a dynamic performance and that's the type of performances we'll need.

"Today we played everything in front of Arsenal in the first half and that's tailor-made for a team with their speed and guile.

"We never asked the players to do that. We asked them to try and play in Arsenal's half and when they've done that in the second half we had a wee bit more joy."

Whenever he talks about tactics, he only ever seems to focus on things he didn't tell the players to do. He doesn't seem to have any coherent strategy of what they should actually do, and that's what shows through every time we play.

Whoever was interviewing him should have demanded he expand on what "other qualities" the players have..

I think the problem he's had since the driving thing is that he only has small chances to impress & regain his spot - and when he's on the pitch he's over-ambitious with his passing in his desperation to try to make his mark.

He was starting to look good when he had a run of games early in season, but I don't think he's had 2 starts in a row since The Incident. I'd have him over Albrighton right now, even if wing is not his natural role. He's got a good delivery and I think he could combine well with Ireland & N'Zogbia given a bit of time together. Would definitely improve our threat from set-pieces also.

Not that it means anything but McLeish is now the favourite to be the next PL manager to go on SkyBet at 3/1. He was at about 20/1 over the weekend, although I'm aware this was partly because AVB was clearly the favourite at that time. That said, I have no idea why he jumped ahead of the likes of Coyle, Redknapp and Kean who were all ahead of him even yesterday.

Sadly it's probably just down to a few people believing those twitter rumours and placing bets..That's all it really takes (e.g. think how many different favourites we had to be new manager after Houllier left).

Gotta say last 2 games, the defence minus Dunne has looked more solid

One of those games was Wigan, who have the worst attack in the league. And Blackburn weren't much cop either. Nullify Yakubu and they have very little.

So cutting costs etc and bringing on someone to steady the ship (McLeish) until a sale is his plan. Everyone knew McLeish's appointment would cause the uproar it did but what's the harm if you're leaving soon right? Plus whoever takes over would just replace him anyway. He would be somebody else's problem.

This is the bit where it still makes no sense, 'cause McLeish was neither the cheapest nor the safest reasonable option. If it was pure cost-cutting and just trying to find a manager to tide us over until a sale, then there were free agents like McClaren and Curbishley who would have surely made more sense. Would have needed no compensation and they would have jumped at the job, whatever wages or long-term prospects were.

Even though it defies belief, I think the most logical reasoning is that Lerner/Faulkner genuinely thought they were making a good choice with McLeish and intended it to be long-term. It doesn't make financial sense otherwise.

Removing him now would make some sense because we've got two very winnable home games coming up - calculation could be that removing McLeish would lift mood of players and fans, leading us to get a win or two and guarantee safety. Whereas if he stays and we don't win at least one of them, we're then into a horrible run of fixtures and it'll be hard to see where next win is coming from.

Unfortunately the rumours sound paper-thin. Someone's wishful thinking magnified by the twitter echo chamber.

“I don’t tell the players not to attack. You’ve really got to trust the individuals to go and do that for you.

“Is it a mental block? Who knows? But there is possibly enough experience in the squad in certain games to steer us through those difficult moments.

“People talk about a negative style of play. It’s a myth. I don’t ask the players not to express themselves."

He's such a negative manager, he expresses his management philosophy in double negatives.

I wonder if he also doesn't tell them not to not keep a clean sheet..

No wonder they look like they don't have a clue what they're doing. It can't be easy having to second guess what the manager has not told them to not do and infer from that what he actually wants them to do.

Didn't realise there was a 2 week gap after Fulham

If we lose at Blackburn and at home to Fulham, this will be perfect timing to fire McLeish and find a replacement

Then we will have the upturn in results to save our bacon.

Even if it's just Sid and KMac taking the job on

Yep Bolton match moved as they still in FA Cup. Not a very nice time for a replacement to come in though - first 5 fixtures would be Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Stoke, Man Utd!

The next 2 weeks will decide whether or not we're in the mix for relegation.

If we lose at Blackburn, they will be 5 pts behind and will start to see us as a catchable target. QPR, Wigan and Wolves all have potentially winnable games that weekend too.

Then the following weekend, the Bolton v QPR and Wolves v Blackburn fixtures guarantee that teams below us will pick up points. If we haven't beaten Blackburn, there will be huge pressure to get a win vs Fulham before we have a 2 week gap and the start of our nasty run-in.

Basically, less than 3 points from the next two and I think we will definitely be in a relegation battle.

Looking at the fixtures, in the calm light of day, I think we'll manage another 14 points, so a total of 42

Would that be our worst PL points tally ever ?

Does this help (start at 1992/193 season):

Aston Villa 74/57/48/63/61/57/55/58/54/50/45/56/47/42/50/60/62/64/48

Cheers, thats useful data

Please remember that the first 3 seasons were based on points total after a 42 game season when there were 22 clubs in the division.

By my reckoning that gives us Points per game as follows:

1.76

1.36

1.14

1.66

1.61

1.50

1.45

1.53

1.42

1.32

1.18

1.47

1.24

1.11

1.32

1.58

1.63

1.68

1.26

This season we stand at 1.12 after 25 games. Which is worse than all seasons bar one (I think that is DOL's last season). Obviously he has a chance to improve on that, or indeed set a new low..

Nope. I see no hope of progress with McLeish in charge. The board should apologise to the fans for inflicting this season on us.

As it's not a good time to be hiring, I'd rather just have Kevin MacDonald managing for the remainder of the season and see how he does - I think at the least he would lift morale of the players & the fans would be more willing to get behind the team, which should be enough to see us safe. Then either keep him on, if successful, or find a proper replacement in the summer.

I think McLeish got half the job right yesterday, it was just a shame that he didn't get the whole thing right.

Let's be fair, all you people who are saying that you wouldn't mind losing if we at least had a go, if he had sent the team out to attack City and lost 4 or 5 you would still be screaming blue murder at him.

Everton and Sunderland won by employing a very similar game plan to what we did, the only difference was that they concentrated in defence for 90+ minutes, and that they committed a few more bodies to their counter attacks. That was all that disappointed me, I don't mind playing counter attacking football against superior teams if we're going to commit bodies to our counters. We just didn't do that yesterday.

He didn't get half the job right. If the plan was to win 1-0 like Everton and Sunderland, half the job is to keep a clean sheet, the other half is to score on the break. We did neither.

I think we have a team that is capable of going on a long run of games without winning, so we could certainly get sucked in. And the teams that get sucked in late in the season are often the ones that end up going down (as McLeish knows all too well) because they have the downward momentum.

10 points will likely see us safe and we should get that in 13 matches, but we're averaging little over 1 point per game so far, so it only takes a slight decline in form for us to be struggling to get 10 points..

Furthermore, I'm not convinced we have players who will have the right attitude to escape should we be drawn into the battle. Body language already looks pretty low - esp in home games - and should we have a couple of defeats to teams below us, it would be really damaging to morale.

Post-match interview said everything about McLeish's attitude. He doesn't seek to cause damage to the opposition, merely to minimize the damage they do to us. To only lose 1-0 is seen by him as a successful result because he sees it as a result that isn't bad enough for people to get on his back too much.

It's really disappointing that he constantly blames luck for us conceding/not scoring - it's precisely the opposite of luck, it's exactly what you expect from the way the game was contested. They had most of the possession in our half of the pitch and won the vast majority of the set pieces, so a goal against was always likely. We had very little attacking possession and created almost nothing, so a goal for us was always unlikely. There was no luck involved in either our 0 or their 1. If anything, we were lucky to only concede 1. If Aguero had his shooting boots on, it might've been a heavier defeat.

At this point, I think it would be better for long-term of the club if the run-in is bad enough that the owners are forced to sack McLeish, because I've yet to see anything that convinces me that he will take us anywhere positive in the future.

We need a new manager who would bring back optimism to the fans - and this summer there should be more opportunity with funds to change things around, I do accept that McLeish's hands were somewhat tied by the wagebill. Heskey's wages alone should easily cover wages for 2 or 3 positive signings - find some players who are keen to prove themselves at top level, stop limiting ourselves to 'proven' (read: overpaid & complacent) Premier League stalwarts - same goes for managers. Please no more mediocrities who are 'proven' by finishing midtable elsewhere (i.e. NOT Bruce/Curbishley) but someone with some fresh ideas who has the drive to prove themselves in the Premier League with Villa.

Other than the time of conceding, that game was very reminiscent of the home game against Man Utd. At no point did we look competitive, or look like anything other than a team waiting to lose. Zero attacking impetus, a near-total lack speed or movement. There was just nothing. Notably, 5 of the 10 outfield players were different to those in the Man Utd game, but the performance was identical - showing this is clearly down to McLeish and not the players we have.

The central midfield were either over-run when they had the ball (most of the time) or by-passed when we had it. Defence was mostly fairly resiliant - Given didn't have to make many saves - but likes of Silva and Aguero found space at will. Bent and Keane weren't in the game (I'd be interested to see how many touches each had - bet they both struggled to get 20), while the wingers McLeish picked were wrong and he took way too long to correct it - should have been pro-active substitutions at half time rather than reactive substitutions when we (inevitably) go behind.

I'd almost rather we were thrashed today, as at least it would put more pressure on the manager. There is no positivity in the club with him in charge and the 'silent majority' he was talking about in the press must be referring to the majority of people going to Villa Park who are numbed to silence by the sheer lack of anything good on offer from the home side.

Next few games against the teams below us will determine if we are in a relegation battle or just lower-mid-table obscurity. Either way this season has been a total waste.

Really hope we bring on Ireland & Zog for Albrighton & Heskey. Ireland can play narrow to help out the midfield two & hopefully use the ball better, while Zog would give us a bit of pace as an outlet.

Sadly, I expect McLeish is perfectly content with that first half and would love the same again.

I think either Lichaj or Baker should get a go.

It was pretty obvious from McLeish interview last week that Stevens is not going to be getting anywhere near first team this year, but either of the above 2 should be worth a run of games, see if they are good enough. We already know Warnock isn't.

Given 6 - perhaps could've come out to claim the cross for 1st goal. Could do nothing for 2nd.

Hutton 5 - both goals came from crosses from his wing, he also conceded possession which led to the 1st.

Warnock 4 - bad, just bad.

Dunne 5 - not good enough today

Cuellar 5 - also not very good. Not the answer at CB, Collins is better.

Ireland 6 - played some good passes - wait and see what the story is with the substitution

Petrov 7 - pretty decent

Clark 5 - wasteful with the ball on several occasions, think it's time to start Gardner ahead of him

N'Zogbia 6 - got the assist, decision making & crossing both poor at times

Keane 8 - best player easily. surpassed my expectations by a long way

Bent 5 - didn't take his chances & looked lazy at times

Bannan 6 - a couple of good crosses, but didn't get into game enough

Heskey 6 - reasonable but no significant impact

Gardner - promising cameo, should've been on for Clark at HT

I was talking to the guy in front of me yesterday and he reckons it's certainly feasible that McLeish was appointed merely to ship out the deadwood and keep us up then when the summer comes Randy will send him away and get someone else in to do the rebuilding. Thoughts?

Doesn't make much sense. Why wouldn't you just get the person you wanted to do the rebuilding in the first place? Why would you spend millions to get an interim appointment? And why would you hire a man who's just got relegated in order to keep you up?

If the season ends badly (a flirt with relegation, perhaps), it's conceivable that they will change things in the summer, but I don't think that is their intention at all. They want stability.

I take it nobody wanted to have to shift all that deadwood.

Perhaps, but I'm still dubious. If they'd really wanted an interim manager to do a difficult task, surely promoting from within would be the sensible way. Kevin MacDonald would have jumped at the opportunity, however unappealing the circumstances, it would have been considerably cheaper, considerably less upsetting to fans (esp. if it was made clear from the outset what the plan was for the season) and not that much more of a risk - he'd have limited experience, but McLeish's experience is hardly that of someone you could call a safe pair of hands in this league.

It makes the least sense of all on financial grounds - if you need to have a cost-cutting season, you wouldn't give a 3 year contract to someone you intend to sack after 1 year, having paid several million to release him from his previous contract.

I was talking to the guy in front of me yesterday and he reckons it's certainly feasible that McLeish was appointed merely to ship out the deadwood and keep us up then when the summer comes Randy will send him away and get someone else in to do the rebuilding. Thoughts?

Doesn't make much sense. Why wouldn't you just get the person you wanted to do the rebuilding in the first place? Why would you spend millions to get an interim appointment? And why would you hire a man who's just got relegated in order to keep you up?

If the season ends badly (a flirt with relegation, perhaps), it's conceivable that they will change things in the summer, but I don't think that is their intention at all. They want stability.

Our home record must be one of the worst in the league

But we also have the third best away record in the league :winkold:

Joint 7th. Only one team has lost fewer away games (Man Utd), but we've drawn a lot.

With neat symmetry, we are joint 7th worst at home.

The real annoying thing is that just when we're finally getting to the end of Beye's absurd contract, we've now got another substandard RB eating up wages for the next 3.5 years, who no other club is likely to want to buy.

I thought it was an underwhelming and pointless signing at the time (we had a limited transfer/wage budget and Lichaj, Herd, Cuellar, Beye as options who all could've been worth trying in that position), but I thought at least he'd be average, not too much of a step down on L.Young. Alas, no. He dreams of being good enough to be called average. I did think he was looking slightly better the last few weeks, but it's probably just that Warnock has been worse. Yesterday both were liabilities.

20 good minutes when Ireland came into the game, otherwise pretty uninspiring. Gave Given MOTM for looking sharp on his return and saving us on several occasions in the first half.

Gabby was only in the game sporadically, Albrighton's delivery was poor and Petrov/Clark offered little going forward so we rarely looked threatening outside that one spell. Full backs are very poor, Warnock the worst example today. Unfortunately it's hard to see much changing. I think we need to get Bannan and Ireland in the team together as they might both appreciate playing alongside someone who can think quickly & make first-time passes.

There's a general lack of confidence in the side - only when we took the lead did the players seem to relax and start playing a bit of football - think we've more chance of getting points away than at home right now.