Gringo

I must admit that even as someone who is roundly pro-EU, from my perspective the union now is looking it might be starting to lurch to it's grave if things go very wrong further, but I do think that the idea is far from it's deathbed and would return in some capacity soon enough. I

I still don't think a USE would ever happen. Too many interests would be squashed and squeezed to let it happen, and too many differing thoughts pulling in too many differing directions for it ever to win out. The current version is effectively just built up of compromises, middle grounds and 'making it up as we go along' for precisely that reason.

You live in the Euro zone don't you Gringo? What are you doing with your savings?

Mostly investing them in fillies at newmarket.

My asset holdings are in property (market still looking at a 20% correction of 5 years stagflation ) and my only equity investments are in ozzie mining shares which could fall 30-50% when the commodity bubble pops, and so are looking for a new home.

So come on LL - I've shown you mine, fair's fair - what's your picks - where are your savings going?

Well the money I have is just sitting in a bank account earning less interest than the rate of inflation so I'm looking for suggestions but everything seems like it could be risky whilst the Greece issue is not sorted.

I'm interested if people in the Eurozone are worried that their currency will take a hit.

[M]y only equity investments are in ozzie mining shares which could fall 30-50% when the commodity bubble pops, and so are looking for a new home.

Which metals?

If it's gold, I don't think we're going to see the gold bubble pop any time soon. While I wouldn't rule out a 50% plus drop in gold prices, I don't see confidence in the central banks of the world increasing to the point that gold comes anywhere near its industrial price (which is probably somewhere on the order of $100 an ounce).

Non-monetized commodities are another story, though.

You live in the Euro zone don't you Gringo? What are you doing with your savings?

Mostly investing them in fillies at newmarket.

My asset holdings are in property (market still looking at a 20% correction of 5 years stagflation ) and my only equity investments are in ozzie mining shares which could fall 30-50% when the commodity bubble pops, and so are looking for a new home.

No I've oversimplified there, mistakes were made by a lot of different people but the reason why Greece is so much more messed up than other Euro zone countries seems to be because the government there have mismanaged their economy more than other places.

And so the ECB and national banks have been buying the bonds off the bankers either directly or via the bailouts.

3 years ago, 90% of this debt was held by corporate bodies - now thanks to the generosity of the EU taxpayers, that is below 50%. So when lending goes well, the bank takes the profit - when lending goes badly, the sovereign funds take the hit.

The politicians screw up and line their pockets, the bankers post profits and collect bonuses and the taxpayers gets to pay for it all. Trebles all around.

You live in the Euro zone don't you Gringo? What are you doing with your savings?

Mostly investing them in fillies at newmarket.

My asset holdings are in property (market still looking at a 20% correction of 5 years stagflation ) and my only equity investments are in ozzie mining shares which could fall 30-50% when the commodity bubble pops, and so are looking for a new home.

Well that's the only place the money could have gone - it's not like the billions have been spent improving the country's infrastructure and helping the economy become more efficient.

But even the politico leaders in the old established economies are not above the odd back hander to ensure the banks continue to thrive.

Because like most govt structures, the place is full of crooks lining their own pockets. Banks know this.

Default isn't an easy option, and they would have to do many other things as well, like tackle taxdodging and other forms of corruption. Whether there is the political will to do that, I have no idea. The crowds on the streets are apparently calling for action on taxdodging, but as usual, it's the rich and well-connected who are both the greatest source of lost tax, and also the ones in the best position to block action

The money that was lent was lent in good faith and was squandered by the Greek government. You don't think the Greek government has any responsibility to pay it back?

The Greek government has let its people down, it is not the fault of the banks who lent them the money.

The banks have let the people down by mispricing the loans, it is not the fault of the people who are offered the choice of tweedle dee or tweedle dum at the elections.

The markets are pricing a haircut of c70% on greek debt, so that's why there won't be a lehman's style "the day after tomorrow" panic where the world was full of unknown unknowns.

There is still a serious settlement issue around the CDS trades and the capitalisation of some banks (french-belgian, german) will take big hits and probably lead to more govt (taxpayer) support. This could well lead to banks having to sell up stocks and shares to shore up their base. The QE fuelled equity bubble may then pop which would see a further hemorrhaging of confidence in the ponzi economy.

The large investment banks are all increasing their trading in commodities as an alternative to the bond and equity markets that have been the staple of their revenues - and as a result, the commodities business is also beginning to show bubble like properties.

It's not the hanging on that makes it worse, it's the fact that during that period you have the IMF forcing the greeks to flog the family silver to the IMF's mates (banks, corporates) and then default anyway - so you have less family silver left with which to rebuild. It's a nasty con job by the IMF and political elites.

How can they all lessen their exposure - they can only shuffle it around - like the plan to accept bondholders due for repayment in a fortnight to roll over their bonds for another 3 or 5 or 7 years.

Of course they can't force them - but they can coerce them - banks are used to buying the occassional dog off a dealer to keep him happy in order to keep the good profitable stuff flowing - so the RBS of this world will have their arms twisted in order to save the belgian banks.

The only strategy the EU and IMF have is to force them to privatise their water supply as pubishment for doing what the EU and IMF wanted (join the EURO) and let inflation take care of the debt. And we've seen how well that worked for Japan.

that's the same scare stories that were parlayed a few years back during the last lot of bank bailouts. Banks & Bankers screwed up; banks & bankers should pay.

The collusion of people like goldman sachs in the falsification of budgets for the greek entry into the euro directly implicates them.

Default is inevitable. It's all about the timing now.

Yes, but also about whether default follows another couple of rounds of "bailouts" ...

the franco german pact seem desperate to hang on til 2013.

Default is inevitable. It's all about the timing now.

Economic commentator on R$ today this morning saying how much worse the crisis would have been if europe had had to deal with 17 differenet currencies during the crisis and that the euro had actually enhanced economic management capabilities.

It's amazing that in these difficult times such fools can still find employment.

I'll hopefully be at the funeral, work permitting. I doubt he'd have wanted flowers though...not his type of thing at all

Mike's view on appropriate use of flowers.

Sending flowers must cost at least £50 these days surely? Just head up to a massage parlour, slap your money down and you'll get a blowjob anyway. At least that way there's no gamble involved

I've only bought flowers for a female twice in my life, once I got **** all other than "you only bought them because I complained that you never bought me flowers" and the other time I'd played a pretty nasty joke on a bird I was supposed to be spending the weekend with and she went spastic about it so I bought flowers to smooth things over before I arrived.

I bought flowers for my mother tons of times though, but she doesn't count, for obvious reasons.

Instead of flowers. howabout a nice online petition to get one of the stands renamed after Witton Lane, and maybe invite Joe CalSlappy to do the opening.

RIP WL HITS

Clearly the BBC, Sky et al are under orders not to get the masses fired up by the 'radical' example of euro neighbours...

Was Roy Aitken sacked with DOL in April - well there's half of 'ecks backroom staff available for no compo.

This morning I had forgotten they had been relegated. It's like christmas all over again.

So it wasn't Gordon Brown nor Gordon Gekko, it was Bin Laden (or maybe Hu Jintao)

Daily Heil"]Did China or Jihadists try to bankrupt America? Pentagon report reveals financial terrorists may have triggered economic crash

Two mystery investors 'were number one traders in all financial companies that collapsed or are now financially supported by the U.S. government'

Terrorists and other 'financial enemies' were likely responsible for the near collapse of the U.S. financial system in 2008, a new Pentagon report has concluded.

The 2009 report, Economic Warfare: Risks and Responses, said financial terrorism by Jihadists or countries such as China may have cost the global economy $50 trillion in a series of co-ordinated strikes against the U.S. economy.

In an astonishing conclusion, the report claims two unidentified traders deliberately devalued trillions of dollars' worth of stocks at the height of the crisis.

The first phase was the deliberate inflation of oil prices in 2007 that generated as much as $2 trillion of excess wealth for oil-producing nations, 'filling the coffers of Sovereign Wealth Funds, especially those that follow Shariah Compliant Finance.'

In the second phase, untraceable investors attacked financial institutions such as Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers in a 'bear raid'

Following this, the 'third phase' has seen the massive U.S. public debt now threatening the primacy of the dollar as a global currency.

What a surprise that Hughes agent is Kia Joorabchian, that slimy scumbag will be up to something to get them both shit loads of cash.

I would have thought that very fact alone would have put Randy Lerner off hiring Hughes.

As I recall Risso has pointed out (and been ignored) several times that a serious crack down on tax evasion has already taken place. I don't buy into this idea that if we just tax the 'rich' a little bit more then everything will be dandy.

Pal we don't want your **** cast offs

if he was that good why did you sack him

I presume the forum would prefer you spoke for yourself and not on their behalf.

I could answer your question but there's no point, is there? You don't want to hear it.

And what have they said?

The only people I'll be believing are Mr Kendrick and Mr Abraham.