Dave-R

I am absolutely mad at that referee the two players who should of been sent off now involved in scoring against us wtf is that all about.

Discusted in this I am because if it were pur players we'd of been sent off.

1 minute ago, TrentVilla said:

Sick of this BS narrative that “we were better when the fans weren’t there” is absolute rubbish.

We were better when we had Grealish, when we didn’t we were largely shit even without the fans.

The biggest problem we have is that for three years we have been good with Grealish and shit without him despite spend £300m. People really need to wake up to that because it is just a fact.

Villa Park could be empty and we would still be struggling without Grealish because that has been the pattern for 3 years.

It isn’t the fans attendance or absence that is the problem. People need to start waking up to what the actual issue is.

I Don agree because Grealish falling over now or being hacked wouldn't help us now the rule change of play on more.

Is a pointless discussion now and argument because if one of our players tried it so much they'd just be booked or ref would wave play on.

1 minute ago, May-Z said:

This is McGinn though. Great reverse pass tos et up Buendia for the assist, but then loads of chipped shitty passes forward. 

He doesn't have full games of being great and then poor, just goes between the two in each match.

I'd agree on this and it's becoming more noticeable as the season goes on.

For me it's obvious we need a top talent midfielder next who can pass and is capable of getting the ball to his team mates and January is the spot to do it even if it costs us bigger than the summer.

1 minute ago, Kuwabatake Sanjuro said:

We might need to spend less time on elaborate set piece routines and more on playing through the lines. I also don't understand why we decided to drop 10 yards deeper as soon as we equalised. The 1st 10 minutes were a disgrace too but there were times when we got the ball down and showed glimpses of being a decent football team again. 

West ham are tough to play through when we play forward passes, I ain't kidding the female pundit has got it spot on when she said we need to play side to side. We started to with pressure, score and start playing forward passes again and we go another down from playing it out the back as well.

I just think there's obvious play which we aren't doing in phases and it's costing us.

We put west hame under pressure or most clubs when we just take it to the opposition and don't let them breath but the moment we sit off or become to passive we let errors slip in.

Half time thoughtt- still some lapses in concentration but much much better and Warkins is doing what hes supposed to be doing.

Cash is working well

Mcginn is working well

Our back line has settled abit despite going a couple down from what I would call two very beaut goals in the same part of the net really.

Bailey needs to be unleashed and Buendia and I've a feeling if Smith can find tune the play when we come out we may need to see what we should be season first half.

The female pundit (name please if anyone knows) has got it spot on so far. She even said we need to get Cash on the ball and abit later we did from his work and his starting point of him getting the ball. She's called it good so far.

More of this please and if we lose then we've lost giving a good game to westham first half.

12 minutes ago, GingerCollins29 said:

You are surprised that the clubs vice captain has been named captain, because our usual captaon is on the bench?

Also, mcginn msking a cock up of things - he's been our player of the season so far!

I'm not so sure Mcginn has been our player of the season so far, that's very debatable. 

I'd say Bailey has been better given the time he's had on the pitch which says alot I think.

Tells me something and it should each and everyone of us that for a while now we've been playing half assed, which I do hope picks up now.

4 minutes ago, WallisFrizz said:

Plenty haven’t been slagging him and given that he has survived worse performances in the past, it does suggest that something has gone on behind the scenes. Although I’ve just seen Ashley Preece say he’s been removed from the firing line…maybe he’s been struggling with all the online abuse? 

He may of been getting abuse, it shouldn't be happening that simple but it won't be stopped. This is the world now and if your going to consistently tell fans that we will get it right on social media expect a few horrible people to come out of the wood work and be nasty. Also if your the one making some of those errors it's only going to make matters worse did some of our players not learn from the ghazi situation last season?? There is hate in the world and they have a platform to do it on and if your a player putting yourself on that platform those hateful users are on then it's not going to end well.

I can't stand it myself it should be abolished all this hate but if your making yourself a target then expect to be hit, that's how bully's work as well as extremists. 

Seem to remember a certain dc character (A Butler) saying to Batman "some people just want to see the world burn" those words are true!!

Putting all that to the side I believe mostly it's right to drop Mings because he's not been playing very good at times. Mings should also be dropped because as Pete the Canadian says Smith should not be scared to drop those who fear not being dropped because they know we have no one that can really take there place, not yet at least.

I believe you can drop players regardless for the right reason without all this hateful talk being brought into it. If its happening it should not be period, but let's not make excuses about it all shall we the real reason is simply a couple of players are dropping the ball lately.

I personally don't agree on Mcginn being captain, I think he's been losing to much balls in the midfield and it's been costing us dearly. Trouble has  been starting their further up field and giving balls away so easy, so rewarding him with captaincy seems not right to me.

Do need to get back to basics as Pete the Canadian stressed by having Watkins as the presser which he's so good at.

Bold move and some balls showing from Smith dropping Mings for this game. Making Mcginn captain is also a move I didn't expect. Something has to be done because Mings isn't the captain Villa needs. Someone with knowledge needs to be brought into Villa in January I think. I'm unsure Mcginn is also C material as both of them are making a cock up of things at the moment.

We will see how thins goes.

One thing I'm glad for is Bailey being on finally but will west ham throw two or three players at him all game if so it's going to tire Bailey out. Unsure about making him the man who's the go to guy with the ball all game because in late stages he could be what we need.

It's one of them I can say all the things I'm worried about like the rest but we just have to let it unfold and play out.

Come on Villa beat West ham today you got what it takes.

As much as people want to crap on Mcginn for it all there are a few players doing it not just Mcginn, Minus and Luis are two more that are being totally ridiculous and crap.

Watkins and Ings are ghosts as well.

Next summer I'd like a serious upgrade in our midfield and a new cdm because if its one thing that's apparant its that we have a few players who are clueless.

I'd also like an upgrade on a CB position because I'm feeling there is better out there that we can get that will keep things calmer at the back that Mings.

Mcginn has to be upgraded, I just don't think he's got it at this level, then there's the CDM, we need a serious player in this position who can do the job excellent.

It would be unfair I think to even put Bailey on in this game and expect a mountain of work from him and if he doesn't do what's required him becoming a bad guy tonight I can see happening.

Do not even know where Watkins and Ings are, what are these two upto because this who Watkins everywhere shutting down opposition like he did last season so far is extinct this one.

Our players are going to have to start doing something because so far they are looking like relegation fodder.

Just now, OutByEaster? said:

A couple of things I guess, first one that we shouldn't ignore - Arsenal have been brilliant - they've got everything right.

For us, I think the shape is wrong - and for me that's not about four or five at the back - it's becoming clearer and clearer week by week that Ings and Watkins aren't a pair, they're an either/or decision. No use playing two up front if that's not where the ball is ever going to be - neither of them is a better winger than El Ghazi, neither of them is a better midfielder than Sanson - they're sharing a role and it's making us look like we're playing with ten men. We've looked awful.

I thought we might hang on for 1--0 at half time and change things, but this one looks over now - no complaints about that, we've been completely outplayed.

14 first half shots from them - none from us - that tells its own story.

 

Arsenal haven't been brilliant but we have been absolutely retarded so far. Unable to string more than 3 passes together. Final third balls are none existent and creativity. We are so clueless and for me Mcginn is a massive reason we are behaving like donkeys and making mistakes because he alone has caused so many of them.

When something has gone wrong Mcginn is at the centre of it all.

No way was it a penalty and what the he'll are they doing allowing a rebound on it when it should be half time a d whistle blown.

What is wrong with this game now its all just so messed up, this game has me pissed off so bad.

Have had enough because our players are playing absolutely wank lately and they need sorting out. Against Arsenal though who for last games we've played them we've shown them who's boss and now the shit VAR is back to haunt us along with players showing up to not play football but actually throw a spanner in works.

Not sure I even want to watch the second half ffs someone shoot me dead please lol

1 hour ago, QldVilla said:

For me that’s the point though, you become a better coach by the challenges you take on. What would Smith’s win ratio be what would any managers win ratio be with similar resources? IMO the better coaches are the ones that sometimes take the harder road.

I think if Smith had players like what City do then we'd be looking at a team challenging for a top spot and champions league football. I think handing everything like that to Smith on a playe straight away certainly wouldn't allow him to learn, simply he has to earn his way to that type of team. If the day comes that Smith gets his hands on a team with that much quality then I do hope it's with us as I think he would do well and by then he will of learned. 

I still say it now but give him time and I still think the best is yet to be seen and felt within the squad from Smith. I think he's still only finding his feet at the top level and once hes gotten himself through those tough challenges like you talk about he will surely shine. I know many would disagree but I think he will capture a trophy or title at Villa and if the Owners can support him all the way as they have been doing then that is fantastic. I also think as soon as Smith finds a winning formula and a system most struggle to deal with he will go onto win something. Once he does win something the real era of Smith will begin and for a while he will be the sought after English Coach not to mention a Coach who once he knows what winning is and what it took him to do it. I think for Smith it's getting that first win of some final and taking a trophy then he will go on and start repeating it many a time just like fergie did with utd. Remember Smith has had us in a final with City and if it weren't for bad timed injuries we may of been in Europe and then who knows.

I personally think Smith has at times had alot of bad luck with squad injuries, especially when it's been apparent that we were doing well then all of a sudden they have hit and its killed the season.

Alot of luck, some good planning and the right tools for the job and if things click right could see Smith and Co take home a trophy or title.

4 hours ago, TRO said:

I think its a really good post Brian and very interesting question.

As you know, I want Dean to succeed, he is the epitome of harmony, safe pair of hands, a manager with a real passion for the club....We have progressed under his stewardship and a number of indivudual players have too.

You might know, I have doubts about the steel in the side, something Dean has never struck me, to be that important, having said that I like his style of play in general....The thing that troubles me is, despite a claim to highlight progress, we are a bit of a win one, lose one team, on the whole.

I don't feel a sense of urgency to find consistency.....I sometimes find myself having doubt about the drive and will to win, of the team....In some games I see it and in others I don't......I am not sure if we see win one, lose one as ok...or thats just the way it is....thats not drive.

All the successful managers of the past are restless for perfection they strive and it shows in their Demeanor....I am not saying Dean is not driven or wants what we want, but I don't always see it....It's great to see composure and a calm head, but a little bit of passion and losing it, is also a trait of a driven manager.....Dean Has always claimed the team mirrors the manager, I ask the question, is Dean a win one lose one sort of character?

I don't subscribe to the theory, that Saturday, was just one of those games... in our case....it happened in sorts against Burnley, where they formed a queue at the back post and bullied us, West Brom did it in the play offs and Crystal Palace did it in May 2021 with a 3-2 win. sure the odd occasion, it happens to all teams, but we have a bit of a trait of it.

Some folk say we have a soft underbelly.....I say at times, other times we can show some grit...but its not consistent.

I think we have the makings of a very good team, but I still feel a lack of urgency or intensity in Midfield ( McGinn aside) I don't see a tenacious soul tearing it up like a Conor Gallagher does, and he is not amongst the best in the league, he too is still learning his trade, but he gives you energy.....I want to see a bit more of that from our guys.

I tend to feel like you, Wes Edens is the one who will rest at nothing for success, and from what I gather, he gave a look of thunder to Christian Purslow on Saturday after the game.....They have spent some serious wedge, unprecedented as far as I can remember.

I think some valid points have been made on both sides of the Dean Smith analytics......I desperately want him to succeed, but I can also see some of what the doubters can too, while accepting he has done a sound job to date.

I think it might be a good time for Dean to do a self analysis on himself, and his staff and see where a bit of additional ingredient can be added.

But, good question Bri.....it will be interesting to see,what others say.

 

 

I just think we're returning to the days of a fanbase automatically expecting things to happen straight of the bat, that bad results shouldn't and can't happen and being too impatient with those in charge. As a fan base the worst thing we could start expecting is self entitlement, there is only one road that leads down and that disappointment. 

This was a long term plan put in place by the Owners and fans just have to realise that rushing it could have real bad consequences. To be fair it Smith was sacked who out there would we get in to do a better job, there really is no guarantee anyone could do better that Dean is there?

Things will just have to take shape at there own speed and patients in the whole scheme and those in ccharge the fans must have. Its pointless going from a fan base who decide to stand by Smith to all of a sudden go against him for a hiccup like the ones against wolves, to put it bluntly there is going to be many more of those along the way.

Every season we remain a Premier league club under the control of our Owners we do become better. We also have to trust the process and so long as Smith is in charge then they must have a fair bit of faith in him to continue on the work. I'm pretty sure TRO that our Owners would indeed pull the trigger I they saw an opportunity to get someone in his place if they thought without a doubt he could do better that Smith. I'm also pretty sure the red button would be pushed on Smith if the Owners felt like he were going to take Villa off the cliff nose dive style. 

For me it's a season that got put out of our control early by Injurys, we've still not been at full power and the stars we have had play for us have not played to there full potentially yet I think. I'm still waiting for our team to play full strength with full ability and looking like a full sharp edge of the sword. We all knew in the summer bringing another five or so players would take us back abit and it has. Systems have also changed and so does the way in how players played last season to how they're playing now, much has changed..

Again trust the process, trust that we will have as much downs changing things this season at top flight level as we will have ups and every fan should be fine. I must be honest that I'm just most grateful that we're a Premier outfit still again and realise we're a long way off from being anything other than that in this league. It's all going to take time and adding stress as a fan base to players and the staff maybe isnt the way to go. For the time being so long as we don't get relegated I am happy and patient with Smith and everyone like the Owners or players and happy for new things to be tried to find a winning process for a while.

Your idea though of a self analysis may be a good idea TRO, it doesn't hurt to pull yourself back and see where your going wrong at all does it?? Having two Coaches like Smith and JT seemed to be something good for Villa, maybe Smith needs a different head next to him seeing things he himself doesn't see. Usually it doesn't hurt having more minds, more eyes and different thought processes working out problems, think of it like different angled CCTV cameras all positioned differently, those cameras all see different images and situations from different angles but together they all start forming a singular story, Smith may need this to make him be more efficient.

I think the fact that teams who will finish the league at the top regular will sometimes go and pull stinkers like the one we had against Wolves, it does happen at the top league in the entire sport.

Not making excuses for the players or for those in charge of them but someone has to lose a game of football if there is no draw.

Smith has to start thinking about points, the points should come first and foremost. Even beyond the need to keep outscored the opponent even when we've outscored the opponent. 

Collectively it was a cock up and collectively it must be put right.

We have enough quality at this level to not do these stinker games but somewhere along the line the stinkers always happen due to lapses in concentration. Its then how the team responds afterwards that will show the teams maturity, respond wonderfully and all of a sudden a run could be put together, respond awfully and we will be in tons of trouble. The whole team and staff now have to prepare for the next battle and the wolves match somehow has to be put behind them. The one thing I think they have to be careful about isn't repeating there weaknesses and what happen go on and make it a strength.

5 minutes ago, useless said:

People on here constantly use the fact that Brighton don't score their chances to excuse their poor points totals and Potter as a manager. He's just the latest manager that the press over hype and gullible suckers fall for it.

We scored 2 goals, we should of held off in a defensive way but the mess ups in midfield and final 3rd of opponents half invited pressure onto us that didn't need inviting if we were made to of been more defensive.

We don't need to keep trying to outscored opponents we've already outscored so I do not know where this Brighton thing comes from.

We were 2 nil ahead against wolves so Brighton talk is irrelevant because we had the game and all Smith, Co and the players had to do was tactically change the game to suit us in a defensive way. Pull everyone back and take opportunities only if they arise and we could of been sitting on 3 points. We had to keep going for goals and trying to get balls up field all while we kept losing possession and not retrieving the ball.

Another thing I picked up on is we kept playing it out from the back when under pressure, which cost us as well.

Another mess up was our players would half assed clearing the ball from 80 mins on instead of just putting there foot through it and sending it down field and just clearing I hoof style.

13 hours ago, hippo said:

Rightly or wrongly the head coach is responsible for results. If poor performance s and results persist he will get the sack.

The coach - coaches and organises the players to limit mistakes to the abolosute minimunuim. One of the things they will have worked is closing out a game.

As the organiser, motivator, tactician, - the head coach is accountable. Not as a one off - but if it keeps happening the finger will point squarely at the head coach.

 

I'd say your right to an extent but if the players who are coming on are not doing all they can then what can a coach do.

Let's face it we've been through this many a time before where our players look below there opponent. Coming on and playing like they did doesn't dissolve those players from blame and they all from Head Coach down to the players collectively have to say "hold on we massively dropped the ball here and we got it way to wrong"

Our squad is capable of much we know that, yet when they start cocking up, they cock up big and make themselves look like the leagues amateurs.

Dropping 3 goals in 15 minutes makes me want to scream at them, they did wonderfully till the first then Wolves just rallied and rallied. If there was an example of Shock and awe, that wolves match was it, it happened all in 15 minutes.

One thing I will say against Smith is I know he wants to keep on cracking for more goals and to go and win the match. I mean come on really, if it means we drop all 3 points and let 3 goals when we've score 2 goals and lose in that 15 min shit show, then use common sense. I'm afraid smarter brains must prevail and its obvious go protect the points and change it to suit us. 

I'm sure if Smith had of pulled it off with his substitutes we would not be all here tearing the team and the staff to bits, we'd be singing his praise.

We just won't ever get to Europe if Smith doesn't start behaving smarter when we're in a winning position or make a smarter choice regardless of his favorites. I don't think Axel and Young should be on the pitch, but they will be put on again and somewhere cost us again. I think if we're winning and comfortable then then defence all of a sudden starts being harassed, add extra security to the defence, don't go chasing more goals. I admire the way he chases games down win, lose or draw but for a club that's still ticking on and trying to be better sometimes a game we're winning to then keep going and going to put a game out of sight isn't always the best course of action.

Pressure, that last 15 mins where did all the pressure go, its like we just changed our tune and stopped running at Wolves. We just became way to passive familiar sight because we become relaxed after scoring, sit off then become so passive that it effects out chasing down of the ball. For eighty mins our persistent movement of multiple players crowding Wolves was lovely then one goal went in, another and then the winner and not once did our lads try to change there tune in a 15 minute gap.

Smith is one problem I see in how and when he uses his substitutes but then the players who switch off so easy when it was and should of been a clear win are another problem. 

As people have mentioned Smiths use of subs gave Wolves the game bu then Smith is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't in that situation. What does drive me absolutely bonkers is those who came on not one of them affected the game in a positive way and I do hope it's not a sign of old  problems creeping back in. Point blank those players should  be playing their hearts out, not coming on and giving half a heart. 

The lack of concentration at this level is totally unforgiving and when our player play a stinker like that for 15 mins, it's unforgivable and they need telling big time. If I were Smith those players would be drilled extra hard now, I'd run them into the ground for there stupidness. Something isnt right for a team to play so well for 80 mins only to then go throw a lead away and go as far as slow a game but I wouldn't be so quick to say its only Smith. I think it has alot to do with the players losing that one, they failed Smith and yes he tried to change a game but what can a manager do when the players he brings on can't provide the quality to affect the game in a positive way.

I think we're coming to a situation where the money we have left must be spent in January to bring in reinforcements to sort out these problems. A couple of excellent players and we're back on track, I guess it's one advantage we have on most clubs is they spent there lot in the sunmer and we didn't.

There are a couple of players I am not confident in so far and they are Young and Tuanzebe, both have so far cocked up enough times to call for different solutions if we have to resort to them. Now sure they have experience but I'm honestly not seeing that experience at the moment and Smith has to come to his senses and if need be drop the both of them and change things up.

To many lapses in concentration in our back line, I'd of expected that in our season returning but now the defence is seeing less of the ball it shouldn't be happening this much. I noticed lapses from alot especially giving the ball away in midfield after we had just relieved Wolves, its not good. Minds were not focused, and marking was rough all while pressing became none existent in second half.

I'm gobsmacked, shocked and totally disgusted in our players for the first time since the championship I have to say.

Winning 2 nill, to draw then go  on and lose, what the he'll were this lot doing for the last 15 minutes, they totally dropped the ball.

Sleep walkers for sure, we deserved nothing from that game and credit to wolves they caught us out.

We certainly don't deserve any European football playing like that.

I agree what the he'll was up with him today along with the rest if the sleep walking players to drop a 2 nil lead and then lose the whole game.

On 06/10/2021 at 08:35, lexicon said:

He does that himself 99% of the time tbf. 

Knowing our luck that 1% is on its way.

Do you know how many fans around here were saying Ings was such a lethal finisher before we signed him, the count was most likely zero lol.

Ings still needs to find his feet I think and he has made some excellent contributions and scored a couple but at the moment I think he's struggling more than what he should be.

I was shocked when we bought him and I still wonder if he will be as good for us as he was at Southampton, that question is on my mind. I think at the moment he's doing just enough to say "yeah he's pulling his weight in the team", I am sure he will get better in the months to come.

As for southgate,he would of been better taking Ings than Kane to the Euros, Southgate is a plonker who rode his way to the final by luck with all the cock ups he made along the way.

On 28/09/2021 at 12:27, Czarnikjak said:

As you said we don't need to buy anybody, unless major injuries happen. But we don't have "load of cash", there's been no cash injected by the owners this season and we had to take a loan from Barclays last month to cover our operating expenses. We are not cash rich.

 

Don't think we needed a loan, the Owners could of easily supported operating costs given the fact we aren't in any debts.

Our Owners have so much money its unreal, the only thing that challenges is us is FFP as it makes it harder to compete.

Selling Grealish is really beginning to be the perfect solution to a season we really have not had to buy anyone out of the Owners pockets,the first season Villa itself has been without the need of financial backing from its Owners. We probably won't be able to be that efficient again for some time, though you do look at the way were playing and it's easy to suggest that many of our players could be quick targets for other clubs. Watching those players of ours on the pitch is fantastic as you know if clubs come sniffing it's those above us who are more successful and they will offer more.

That's part of the project though isn't it?? creating a club where its players play with belief and they then in turn go and play regular beautiful football that's wanted by more successful clubs. Its when it's time to sell, we can quickly trade and not rely on the Owners and we did this for the first time in how long by selling Grealish and bringing in three players where two could be sold for profit down the line.