GlastonSpur

Why on Earth would any manager field that? Bale is a disasterous LB, as shown by his comical 2nd half at the weekend.

...

He really isn't. You may recall that it was his performances at LB for S'hampton which brought him to prominence in the first place. Sure, in the Prem he's had a few rickety games here and there at LB, but he's also had several very good games at LB for Spurs.

Harry has said that he sees Bale's long-term future as being at LB - and he's not a bad judge of players. Bale is still only 21 remember, and it isn't easy switching back and forth between the LB and LW positions, playing LB in one game, then LW in the next. Once he gets the LB slot on a regular basis I'm pretty sure he'll make it his own and do well there on a consistent basis.

I'm willing to bet that it won't be long before Harry switches Bale to LB more or less permanently.

... Modric, Lennon and vdV in the same midfield? And I think Villa's midfield is lightweight at times! It's also to easy to just nullify your width and smash you on the counter....

Why? We would still have Palacios, Huddlestone or Sandro sitting behind these players. Besides, the main ethos of the Spurs game is to play attacking football, which can mean risking the trade of a few losses here and there for the chance of a larger number of 3 point wins.

No offense Glaston, but you criticise BOF for picking and choosing regarding Rafa's stats (not wanting to count his Dutch League career), yet you basically said half of Villa's trophy count do not count when comparing us with you. You can't have it both ways.

I have never said that half of Villa's trophies "don't count". I have simply pointed out that the value of some of these trophies counts for less compared to trophies won in the post-Victorian era, when the league structure included a much much larger number of teams including teams like Spurs, Chelsea etc etc.

So there is no analogy with the goals scored by VdV for Ajax in the Dutch league. His goals there do count, just as Villa's trophy total includes those won in the Victorian era. You can that argue that his each goal for Ajax counts for less than each goal scored for Hamburg or Real Madrid or Holland - and I'd agree with that argument, But to remove them altogether from his impressive goals stats, as BOF wishes to do, is plain silly.

Which part of what you very selectively quoted is 'nonsense'? ...

All of it, including the non-quoted part.

Anyone with a grain of sense could see that signing VdV for 8m does not equate to a "piss poor window". He is a fantastic player, and if you aren't aware of that then it speaks volumes about your knowledge of football.

If you want the real definition of a piss poor window this summer it's this: losing your manager, losing your best player and replacing him with a mentally fragile lightweight. I've read various posts from VTers who are desperarately trying to convince themselves that Ireland will turn out to be great for you, but I think the truth is already starting to dawn on some ... and that's why City were so eager to swap him for Milner and give you 16m on top.

... The fact is VDV is a last-gasp panic signing for a position you didn't even nearly need to fill. And you add him to the 3 backups that I mention. ... A like for like to Modric and to a lesser extent Kranjcar, so you bought a backup for Modric. ..

Last minute signing yes, panic signing no: you don't turn down the chance to sign someone like VdV. Levy saw the chance and took it.

The notion that VdV has been signed as "backup" for Modric is laughable: your knowledge of VdV is a joke tbh. Both players will be regular starters if fit - either as part of a 5-man midfield in a 4-5-1 formation, or else, in a 4-4-2, with Bale at LB, Modric in LM, Lennon in RW, VdV in central attacking midfield and one of Huddlestone, Palacios or Sandro sitting behind them. VdV can also play as 2nd striker in a 4-4-2.

Lies, damn lies and statistics. Remove his Dutch career and concentrate on the big leagues. His percentage falls below Lampard. He also 'managed' to score less than 1 in 5 playing for Real Madrid. Bravo, Rafa, bravo.

Why remove his Dutch career with Ajax? It seems that you're the one wishing to manipulate the stats, by selecting those that suit you and deleting those that don't. And we haven't even begun to look at his assists. I'm starting to wonder how many times you've actually seen VdV play.

Keep going, any time soon now you'll manage to convince yourself that VdV is a just a mediocre hack.

All that negativity directed at Spurs must have been quite the shock.

Not at all. This thread of full of it: most of it deluded, innacurate nonsense. I only have to cast my eye back over the last few months to read multiple claims that Spurs had no chance of 4th, no chance of making the CL group stages and no chance of getting improved shirt sponsor deals.

TBF Glaston did say 'arguably' world-class. Presumably only argued by fans who are clinging to a piss-poor transfer window given the absolute golden opportunity to cement their place among the elite ...

It's hard to take such nonsense seriously.

Just signing VdV alone is a major coup for Spurs by any standards. And as an earlier poster said, had Villa signed him VT would be exploding with delight right now.

Are you even aware of VdV's track record as a player? Lampard is rightly considered to be prolific goal-scorer for a midfielder, with a career total of scoring in 29% of appearances: VdV's equivalent percentage is 37%.

I said VdV is arguably world-class and I stand absolutely by that. Your ignorance is breath-taking.

... You still could have done with a striker ...

Yep, I agree with this, but there's always the January window, when perhaps some suitable possibilities will become available (and non-CL-cup-tied, provided Spurs are still in the CL for this to make a difference).

Given that Sandro was really signed back in Feb/March time, Spurs haven't spent a fortune this summer, so maybe we'll have some cash left in reserve for the next window.

I would have liked Suarez the most, but that was a non-starter given that Ajax also qualified for the CL.

I would be really disappointed if I were a spurs fan after that transfer window, VDV or not.

They have wasted a golden opportunity to sell their club as a Champions League team to attract a higher standard of player but they haven’t added anyone better than their current first 11. They won't get another chance like that for a few more years IMO.

You must be jesting with us, I presume.

* VdV: an arguably world-class player, with Champion's League experience, signed for just 8m

* Sandro: Brazilian U-21 captain, now called up into their senior squad and fresh from having just helped his old team to win the most prestigious club competition in South American football - the Copa Libertadores.

* Gallas: vast CL experience and vast experience of the Prem. Few teams will have a better backup CB on their books.

* Good quality backup goalie signed.

* None of our key players sold (unlike some clubs I can think of).

PS. It's a squad game sunshine - it's not all about first XI. But you can bet that VdV will be in that first XI more often than not.

Only Keane is the type of player that you would describe as anywhere near 'Champion's League' quality. Sure the other players might improve, but whether it will be significant enough to make a difference, nobody knows.

Whereas Liverpool and Manchester City have brought in 'Champions League' quality players. You can speculate whether the Man City team will gel or not, but one thing you can sure about is that the players they have bought have proven their quality in other teams. If they do gel, they'll be challenging for the title, let alone 4th place.

Dos santos, Kyle Walker, Kyle Naughton and O'Hara have not shown anywhere near the same level of performance as the likes of Yaya Toure, David Silva, Jerome Boateng etc.

I wouldn't gamble your hopes too heavily on decent young players.

The post I responded to was discussing Prem league placings, not how Spurs would do in the CL. The league is a marathon, not a sprint, and my point is that the Spurs squad depth will improve again even with no new signings, and last season's squad finished 4th.

Livepool have signed Joe Cole - CL quality, yes. But they will likely be losing CL-quality Mascherano in return, and Benayoun has already gone. None of their other signings are CL quality, far from it.

Man. City: the "likes of Yaya Toure, David Silva, Jerome Boateng etc. " have not even kicked a ball in the Prem yet. They might all flop for all we know, or at the very least take quite some while to adapt. Right now, with the season about to kick off, I'd in preference take the Prem-proven trio of Huddlestone (over Toure), Modric (over Silva) and Corluka (over Boateng), just as I'd take Bale over Kolarov.

City for the title? No chance. I have them down for 5th.

Unless they realise that Man City will most likely take the other CL place next year so they're banking the cash and only making minimal improvements this year. Would be in keeping with Levy's management of the finances. Not to say that they won't try to get 4th, but currently looking unlikely for us, them, Plop and Everton.

There's plenty of reasons to think that Spurs - even without any further signings - will be doing more than just making "minimal improvements":

* dos Santos: Last season was partly injured and partly away on loan. Now he's back after impressing in the WC, impressing in pre-season and picking up the MotM award in Mexico's 1 -1 draw with Spain last night. In effect he'll be like a new signing.

* Sandro: Brazilian U-21 captain and now called up into their senior squad.

* Cudicini: back and fully fit after his motorbike accident. Good backup GK that wo didn't have for muich of the 2nd half of last season.

* O'Hara: back after being with Pompey on loan last season. The experience looks to have improved him hugely.

* Keane: back from his loan to Celtic.

* Kyle Walker: Looked excellent in pre-season playing at both RB and CB. May well have a significant role to play in the first-team squad this season.

* Kyle Naughton: back from his loan spell at Boro'. Has also impressed in pre-season.

OK, some of the above might still be sold or loaned out, but then again Spurs might make 1 or 2 new signings, so it all balances out in the wash. The point is that either way the Spurs squad will likely be stronger than last season - and that's not counting the fact that young players like Bale, Lennon, Huddlestone, Modric, Kaboul, Rose etc will likely kick on again this season.

I think Jol is the ideal candidate, and I hope we attempt to capture him.

I agree that's he the ideal candidate.

But I don't see it happening since Ajax would want 12m euros in compensation and Lerner appears to want to cut back on spending, not increase it.

If I had to guess, I'd guess you'll end up with Sven.

Glaston if spurs had won quite a few titles before 1950 would you say they were meaningless?

I have seen some of your post when you compare the achievements of both spurs and villa and you seem to be very selective in how you dismiss what villa have won but do not seem to put the same level of scrutiny to what spurs have won.

There's a big difference between pre-1950s and pre-WWI/the Victorian era.

In any case I haven't dismissed what Villa won in the Victorian era - I've simply put it into its proper context, namely a small league structure in which the vast majority of today's clubs weren't even playing for the most part.

.... out of curiosity, how many of Villa's league and cup wins were you actually alive to witness? ...

The vast majority of these occurred prior to WWI, with the bulk occurring in the Victorian era when the league was tiny. So the answer to your question is probably "not many".

Haha do you remember two seasons ago when Spurs were tearing it up in preseason under Ramos? Dos Santos got 5 assists or something against Leyton Orient? Glaston was being all cockney wideboy about how Ramos and Spurs were going places? Good times

And then two years later they broke into the top four? Good times.

Exactly so. Plus Dos Santos has only recently turned 21 and - for those VTers who maybe hadn't noticed - looks to be turning into quite some player.

Sure, progress has sometimes been one step back and then two steps forward, but why focus on the one step back and not the more important two steps forward? These silly posts from some VTers - desperate to find some stick with which to beat Spurs - are really quite amusing given how Spurs continue to generally kick on in all areas.

... Notice he's not here to refute the quotes as a "fabrication" and just good ole candleface puting the press of the scent.

Come on the Glasto, tell us the truth

As I've already said in another thread ....

... the background context is that Spurs have already spent 7.5m (not an insignificant sum of money) on signing the Brazilian U-21 captain, Sandro.

Beyond that, I wouldn't take most of Harry's comments on transfers at face value. Any club wishing to sign players is hardly going say "yeah, we've got some money", since that won't help the cause of getting a decent bargain. Harry says lots of things, many of them mind-games or throw-away comments: I'm pretty sure Spurs can find the cash - without necessarily neediing to first sell - if the right player becomes available at a fair price.

...

I think City are having an effect on the transfer market for many Prem clubs, because no one is willing or able to complete with them on price and some selling clubs, players and agents are holding out for a possible City bid. So probably not much will happen until City have completed their spending splurge (or until the last few days of the window arrive and it dawns on some agents/club that their player is not getting a mega-bucks offer from City).

IMO Spurs are not in great need of changing their squad - because the depth is pretty reasonable and most of the current players will likely improve again further next season given the ages of most of the players and accumulating Prem experience. Ideally I'd like to see us sign another CB (because of the Woodgate situation), a striker to replace Keane (assuming he's sold) and a pacy midfield attacker to provide further options. But it won't be a disaster if none of these things happen.

Going by your previous guesses on an extensive range of subjects, who cares what your guess is.

Nice to see your lot spending mega bucks as well considering how often you tell us your rich and cash rich and can afford whatever it takes

Sod off you smug, patronising git

Since you apparently disagree with the points I made, why don't you try explaining why they are wrong instead of resorting to stupid insults? It would be a lot more interesting.

PS. What Spurs are or are not doing is irrelvant to a discusson about Milner's situation.

Do they balls.

If they dont stump up £30m we keep Milner another season. Simple as!

Well, yes (if MON sticks to the 30m figure), but only at the cost of all the damaging factors I cited.

If that's a price Villa is willing to pay, then so be it, but if so then IMO you'll end up worse off as a result.

... Milner ... how exactly is he ove valued? Man City were willing to splash £24m on Lescott and if you comapre his performaces against Milner then you will see Milner is fully justified with our valuation.

...

That's all very well in the abstract, but the concrete reality is:

(a) Villa's transfer strategy this summer is dead in the water until the situation is resolved, because otherwise you won't even know for sure whether Mllner needs to be replaced and you won't - it seems - have lots cash to spend unless he is sold.

( If he isn't sold now, his price will likely drop for January or next summer, and in the meantime you'll be left with an unhappy, frustrated player.

To be honest, City have you over a barrel. They could sign anyone out of plenty of alternatives to Milner if needs be, they know you could do with the cash, they know Milner wants out, they know his price will drop if not sold this summer, they know the damage the situation is causing to your transfer strategy ... so they don't need to hurry. I don't imagine it would bother them in the slightest to keep stringing you along until the very last moment, and then pull out altogether and sign someone else instead.

Holding out for 30m is very risky and I'd guess you won't get it.

Tony, you asked in the City thread who Spurs had signed from China, South Africa, Brazil and the US.

They signed the Brazil under-21 captain, Sandro, from Inter this season, as a result of the partnership formed between the two teams.

As for the other partnerships, I believe they're more for commercial purposes than the intention of uncovering new talent. Although obviously, if a good prospect does emerge from those partnerships, Spurs would have first option on them.

We've also had a couple of players on trial from our S.African partner club, SuperSport United. This includes one current triallist, I think, Bongani Khumalo, a defender who played for S.Africa in the WC.

Global fan base

The cosy delusions of some VTers know no bounds it seems.

It's only a couple of weeks ago that I was told on here that Spurs were struggling to find a good shirt sponsorship deal to replace Mansion. It's only last season that I was repeatedly told on here that Spurs had "no chance" of top 4.

By the same token some VTers seem to fondly imagine that the reach of Spurs is confined mainly to North London. In fact we have partnership clubs in China, South Africa, Brazil and the USA, a world-wide scouting network, fan clubs right around the globe and a significant international profile. This is one reason why Spurs are able to attract such good sponsor deals: even last season and before, when we weren't even in with a shot at the CL, we had the 3rd most lucrative set of sponsor deals in the Prem.

August 10th 2009:

"Paul Barber, the executive director of English Premier League side Tottenham, had similar reasons to explain why his club traveled to Beijing, China for their fitness training.

He said: "Preseason offers the chance to achieve a number of different objectives including team preparation as well as for additional revenue.

"It allows us to generate further awareness of the club, which is particularly important, because we are looking for a naming rights partner for our new stadium and a new shirt sponsor.

"We believe it is very likely that these new partners will come from outside of Britain, so the chance to present our club and our team in new markets is very important. For clubs as big as we are, the revenues can be significant."

... With an estimated 20 million fans worldwide, Barber feels there is a duty ... to allow international fans to see the team at first hand."

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/SPORT/football/08/06/football.preseason.friendlies/index.html

Some VTers accuse me of "bigging up" Spurs - and doubtless this post will attract the same tired old response - when mostly I'm simply responding with the actual facts to small-time and ill-informed comments from some posters who don't really have a clue about Spurs, but like to pretend they do.

... If Spurs and Sporting fans can afford their season tickets, a £3000 trip to the US, then the cost to travel around Europe all season then more power to them (the jammy bastards).

I'd imagine a fair few of the Spurs fans at the "New York Challenge" trophy games actually live in and around NY. It's called having a global fan base.

Pompous, pretentious, phallus.

Call it what you like, but it's nonetheless true.

... If Spurs and Sporting fans can afford their season tickets, a £3000 trip to the US, then the cost to travel around Europe all season then more power to them (the jammy bastards).

I'd imagine a fair few of the Spurs fans at the "New York Challenge" trophy games actually live in and around NY. It's called having a global fan base.

.... September? Is that when the wheels fall off the bus?

Nah, that'll happen during the open-top parade next May when Spurs show off the quadruple CL, League, FA and League Cup trophies ... them cups is heavy buggers and the double-decker's tyres just won't be able to handle it.

Who's Giraldo Glaston??

He's tipped to break into the Elite squad this season.

Or to give it its full and proper title: Super High Invincibles Team Elite ....

... otherwise known as S.H.I.T.E.

Who's Giraldo Glaston??

Got it all from wiki - admittedly he doesn't appear to be important squad member for City, but he has made 49 appearances for them.

No, no he hasn't.

Unless Citeh have been fielding 2 GKs since January and magically making a lot of new fixtures appear since then too.

Yes, sorry, you're right. I clicked on the wrong wiki link. He joined them in January and so far has made no appearances.

Who's Giraldo Glaston??

Got it all from wiki - admittedly he doesn't appear to be important squad member for City, but he has made 49 appearances for them.

Players City brought in with no Prem experience before this season:

De Jong

Kompany

Robinho

Players done this season:

Silva

Yaya

Boateng

I make that 6 players without Premiership experience in the last 4 years.

I make it considerably more. You've left out:

Kolarov

Zabaleta

Garrido

Caicedo

Giraldo

... plus doubtless one or two more before the summer is over.

Moreover, many of the ones brought in that have needed (or will need) to adjust to the Prem - and gel with team - are intended to be first XI players rather than just squad cover.

Your likely first XI this coming season will include at least 4 players (and probably more) who've not yet kicked a ball in the Prem, far less gelled with their City team-mates: Silva, Boateng, Y.Toure and Kolarov.

In contrast, as things stand right now at least, the Spurs best XI contains no players with less than 2 years Prem experience, with most having considerably more.

You may not think this matters much, but I do. And it's one reason why I think City will finish 4th at the very best - and only then given a lot of luck.

Cudicini 37, Hutton 26, Bale 21, Huddlestone 24, Jenas , Keane 30, Modric 25, Naughton 22, Kranjcar 26, Corluka 24, Walker 20

So not too many in the age bracket you mentioned. But it was a pre-season friendly and I am sure when everyone is back for you they will play much much better. Poor performanace from most of the players on show.

Just three first XI players, two of them playing out of usual position at CB (Corluka) and Huddlestone (in the 2nd half).

PS. Naughton is 21 (not 22). And you forgot to mention Mason (19), Townsend (19), Rose (20), Taarabt (21) ... all took part in the game. Including Bale etc, I make that at least 7 players aged 19 -21.