HJ

We've looked fine today apart from our defenders falling over/being out of position/gifting it to the opposition/being too slow. I know it's results that matter and I fear that we're going down, I really do, but individually our central defence has been absolute pony whereas our midfield and attack haven't.

And Friedel should've saved that goal too. He's too old.

Yeah, we always play fine apart from the bits that are shit.

I feel sorry for Houllier today. He's set us up the right way today, got us playing to our strengths, but our defenders - individually and as a unit - are sub-standard.

He's had ample time to make an impact on our defensive play. The simple fact is, regardless of personal, we've been defensively brittle.

You can't polish a turd, and our central defenders are shit.

They looked pretty polished to me last season.

How is it possible that someone as talented as Walker can be so **** stupid?

So what if the new manager is not liked by the players, they moan about his training and continue doing **** all.

How about this time we appoint someone who isn't useless as a manager, and actually manages the players? Most of our players have played successfully under many managers, you know.

oh and everyone shouting for big sam etc, I think we might aswell ask who the players want as it seems they run Villa Park now not the management.

That's just because the management is **** shit.

Wolves at home is the easiest fixture in PL this season. What a joke. Huge game for us and the worst result in years.

The truth is, if we would have won today which we should have there would not be such a reaction. It would have papered over a lot of cracks.

The FA cup team selection was disrespectful to put it lightly, however I will stand by the opinion that todays defeat is not Houlliers fault. What has to be taken into consideration by the board is that the form is a disgrace. Ok we have had injuries, but the squad at his disposal is very much top 6 standard and should be doing better.

We are in a terrible position and the players as well as the manager need to make sure they give us something to cheer about in what has been a write off season.

A lot of things Houllier has done are wrong, and he will continue to make mistakes, but he is trying to adopt a different philosphy at villa. We have a right to voice our opinions to the board and the manager but I believe Houllier will be here next season unless we are relegated.

This post is not to stick up for Houllier, as I have said he has made almost unforgivable mistakes but we need to stay behind him as it only affects the team if we start getting on his back!

But our form over the last few games has been top 6 form. GH is beginning to turn it around.

One win in five? Have you ever considered a career on stage? You made me laugh...

We won the 2 games previous to those 5 and we were very unlucky not to win today.

We've just put together 2 of our best performance of the season back to back...if we'd have won today, which we would have done 8/10 with the chances we had, then we'd be 9th...2 points off 8th. Would people be moaning then???

They would wouldn't they

Well yeah, I don't think everyone would be worshiping Houllier in awe if he brought us the mighty 9th place?

Shit . Xtina Ag-yoolara is singing the national anthem,. It's going to be a 25 minute special , I can feel it. Lets see how many notes she can cram in to one line !!!!!!!!

Right, that was terrible

Harry Redknapp had to go to Spain to get mugged, Kenny Dalglish just sat at home and phoned Mike Ashley

I'm still in shock from today's events. My mind can't get over Andy Carroll for £35 million, I'm lost for words, in what sense is Carroll better than any sort of world class striker?

He's available.

It appears the Torres deal is done, itsop:

Liverpool is going to be better off selling him for that money in the long term, I have a feeling Torres' health is just going to get worse.

In fact if it doesn't go through now it'd be a bit of a disaster for Liverpool, they'd miss out on a lot of money, fans have turned on the player, and they have an unhappy player who probably isn't going to perform near his best and might lose a lot of value if he keeps getting injured.

Torres left training by helicopter apparently.

He has now also left training by car, apparently.

Bent does well as a lone striker...

When? I think his best football was played when Kenwyne Jones was up there doing the donkey work for him, holding the ball and running the channels so Bent could just concentrate on the one thing he's good at.

Still don't like him but at least he seems to have realized our defenders can be brilliant when he lets them defend properly (ie fall back and have the midfielders support in a line front of them) instead of trying to win the possession competition with his high line shit. Who cares if City had 70% possession, I'd rather have the 3 points thanks.

Now if he manages to figure out his set piece set up is shit and do something about that too it would be swell. I think Bent needs a striker partner as well to get the best out of him but we'll see.

BENT!!!

I'm glad its even but goddamn, this has been so boring so far

And since its the topic at hand: Bent started 32 games for Spurs and scored 11 goals in those.

Because alot of substitute appearances can really skew the numbers (in the opposite way as to how Harewood fared), in my opinion.

I'm pretty sure most strikers would rather start and come off then just play the end of games. A player is more likely to score, in my opnion, playing the first hour of a game than they are playing the last 15 minutes of 4 games. It can take a while to get into a game, so the more short appearances you make, the less likely you are to score.

And on the other hand, more goals are scored in the last 15 minutes of matches than any other 15 minute period. And you are fresh vs. possibly tired defenders.

Minutes per goal is nowhere near as bad as goals per start.

Harewood scored 5 goals per start for us. Says it all about that stat if used on anyone with substantial amount of sub appearances.

In fact, I don't see what's bad with minutes per goals. So Harewood scored a lot of goals when he was on the pitch, well done to him.

I, for one, am happy we are signing someone who can score a penalty. How many have we missed since Barry left FFS?

Bent has missed at least 3 since Barry left, from what I remember.. He's decent at pens but not excellent.

Have any of you genuinely watched Darren Bent carefully for a series of games? And if so, are you pleased with this deal?

Yep.

he's not playing that well this season, but still has 8 league goals in 20 appearances.

Gyan, who many are saying is much better, has 7 in 19 appearances.

And that's with Bent "not playing well".

The fee is huge, too much. But in terms of the player we're getting, i'm very happy.

3 of Bent's goals are penalties. If Gyan is completely rubbish at pens then fair enough, but it could well be 5 for Bent and 10 for Gyan if he had been taking pens. I can see why some Sunderland fans would be happier with Gyan on this seasons form.

Have any of you genuinely watched Darren Bent carefully for a series of games? And if so, are you pleased with this deal?

Yeah. He's not worth up to £24m, but IF we build our attack around him he'll do well. Well enough to justify the fee, remains to be seen.

This thread probably gives a more balanced view of him around here, people are getting a bit excited at the moment.

Up to £24m? He's scored a lot of goals before this season but that's a scary amount of money