AVFCinSpain

In re-joining this forum, it seems as far as Hogan is concerned, the views of his capabilities are almost two extremes. IMO, under the new management team, all the squad should be given the opportunity to demonstrate if they can fit in the playing ethic Smith wants. Perhaps it will be fairer to make judgements in the new year, assuming the majority have had decent chances of showing their capabilities.

Kodjia v Hogan, we probably will need them both for rotation

Don't think Carroll will come to B6, his heart seems to be Tyneside and we need to see how our current forwards measure up pre-season under PL. If we have £20m in the kitty, there are other priorities in my opinion.

I would say looking at that we need to purchase a right back, a left back, two centre halves, two central midfielders,two wingers and a striker.

I would like to see the back of Hutton, Warnock, Collins, Makoun, Delph, Bannan, Allbrighton and Fonz

I still think that the squad is very poor and lacks quality and depth and is especially weak at full back and centre mid

I'd agree we are weak in several positions, but I don't see Randy funding this amount of new players without several being sold first.

This result just about keeps McLeish in his job, but clearly, we're just fortunate we have a few points buffering us from the bottom clubs, as it's difficult to see us winning again this season.

Tactically inept, with a squad who don't have a leader on the pitch with a manager who seems unable get his team able to play for 90 minutes, is a recipe for relegation but for teams who are below us but not much worse and possibly more up for the fight.

I don't expect AM to go this season, but if he's at B6 next season, the season ticket holders could well be an all time low next time, and the odds for relegation will have us among the favourites.

More sad days ahead

I think Gardner will come on v Swansea if we're winning by more than a goal.

Might also get a minute or two at Chelsea if the game is up by the 80 minute mark.

Just the opposite :?

I didn't see the game but sounded like his coming on made a significant difference

Played better tonight but another set piece goal against, we will be passed by Sunderland moving up as we continue to sink.

We have a better squad than some of the teams below us, but I can't see us scoring enough to balance out our poor defence.

What's the odds Sunderland will overtake Villa in less than 5 matches as they climb the table and we sink lower towards the bottom four?

Bent wants to go to the European Championships and he's not going to get in the squad on current form, as he gets pretty poor service and to be honest he's had chances of late and failed to take them. Once Young and Downing went, it could only be a short time before Bent will want to go too.

AM does not do positive, his mind set is based on clean sheets and the odd goals. Unfortunately, his plan is coming well undone at VP. He needs to go by the New Year, but with giving him a long contract, Lerner again showed a lack of business acumen IMO and will again have to pay put a lot of dosh toshove McLeish out the door, along with his support team. Whoever replaces him will need to be someone who believes in playing football and as we aren't likely to get a big name who's any good, we should be looking for an up and coming manager. Certainly Martinez could have been no worse than AM. Lambert at Norwich has shown there are good prospective Premiership managers about.

I think we got suckered by 'arry. He got Hutton's replacement back from Villa, a better player for his time at B6 and then convinced AM to buy Hutton who 'arry wanted rid of. AM keeps singing Hutton's praises and saying he needs time to settle down, but IMO, he's just poor quality. Luke was a better RB and Herd should be selected before Hutton.

It's difficult to see what Villa are doing to plug the goals against at set pieces, we can't defend a lead or set pieces, especially late in a game. The coaches need to kick Collins and Dunne's arses. The shortest player on the pitch being able to head a goal just about sums Villa up at present.

Looking at the reasons Hughes gave for leaving Fulham, I doubt very much if he would have come to Villa in its current financial state. The reality is probably that McLeish was one of the few managers who would have accepted the remit on offer in summer 2011.

If you can believe them. Hughes is a bitter man, as evidenced by his sniping at Citeh and Mancini and he doesn't seem to have been offered anything that has been available since he left. I think he may have created himself a problem with his regular quotes to the press and coming across as a moaner. Personally I wouldn't have wanted him at B6 anymore then McLeish. AM was a second choice after Martinez turned us down, and maybe he's regretting that decision in letting Whelan talk him out of it. At least if Martinez was manager, we'd be playing better football and perhaps be able to defend set pieces. If defending is AM's strong point, then it's pretty poor stuff.

Villa always got pinched, but as stated, a lot of players are bought purely so the competition doesn't have them. Ashley Young to united is a stupid buy from ferguson, but it's better to have him then let him terrorise you in a blue shirt.

The premiership is an utter farce. Football is no longer a game of skill but a game of wealth. My best mate is a Leeds supporter and he said it's never been better being in the championship, the team is a team that sticks together and they fight it out every week. Real football is not in the premiership and I honestly believe there has never been a strong case to have a break away European Super League. Let the rich boys go and play their own game, leave football to the rest of us.

There is something to be said for being competitive in a lower league and striving for the title, against being an nonentity in the Premiership.

Well weve just agreed to pay blues £10m - so I think the ruthless streak has come to an abrupt end.

I think he got Mcleish because he couldn't get anyone else. Yes he invests money - but does he invest time - I think he has been in the UK less than 48 hours in total since GH departed. Hardly smacks of guy in love with Aston Villa.

Where has this figure come from?

£2m seems to be the accepted compensation figure, but agree there will be additional costs to pay off GMc and his team, plus possible compensation for AMc's team from the Sty.

I'd agree that success is a bigger factor, along with motivational skills and proof that his sides play football.

At least the short list is much better than 12 months ago -

Hughes, Benitez, Rijkaard, Moyes

vs

Curbishley, Houllier, etc.

You can add Flores from Atletico Madrid to these, according to talkSport

A reasonable review John of a poor game from Villa's perspective.

I was of the opinion when GMc took over the reins, we'd could expect 2 points from the remaining games, (possibly 4 if we could overcome Wigan as a bogey team). He seems unable to motivate the players and they look like they are just going through the motions as they think the clubs safe from relegation. The quotes from Luke Young today make it seem like all is not well at the club from the dressing rooms view of things and this needs to be addressed as a serious issue.

No dithering from the Board, grasp the nettle and move the club forward.

If the NotW is to be believed, Riise is on GH's radar and if this is a sign of GH's thinking, lord help us. This pre-occupation with all things Red Scouse is bewildering and would seem set to continue if the FSW is GH's replacement. :cry:

In many respects, it's becoming make or break time for the club, M. Houllier, the players and the fans.

We all need to pull together whatever we think of the management team. If we lose this weekend, I fear for our safety despite the next couple of fixtures which we should win.

UTV

Is it that bad we are reminiscing about Doug now?

No, just saying that he'd do a better job of hiring and firing than Randy would imho.

What is it with the whole Randy hate thing? He's the best thing to happen to this club in years!

I dont hate him, im just a little pee'd off that he appointed such a useless rocket polisher as our manager, and for that reason i wouldn't trust him to do it again, it doesn't matter anyway as he wont have the bottle to sack the old fool.. another thing with Randy is why didnt he have the balls to get a manager from another club, to much of the mr nice guy i think..

Didn't RL have a group of supposed experienced football people to advise him and the board? Unfortunately, like many times when consultants are brought in to an organisation, you need to be sure the consultants are up to the task, and it looks like Randy's clearly weren't.

To change managers now is a Catch 22, probably damned if we do and damned if we don't.

Unless we could achieve a miracle and get a charismatic Svengali like manager in the style of Mourinho, who could be brought in at this stage, short term measures like Fat Sam would be as dismal IMO.

It may sound like heresy, but maybe success in the Championship for a season would be better than mid table mediocrity in the Premiership, as long as it was one season, but that's not a given as Leeds/Charlton etc. found out.

If GH still has the support of the board after Saturday, I hope he'll bring in some new blood who can score goals, because once again last night, we didn't convert the few chances we created.

Also, why did GH wait so long to bring Albrighton on, we seemed to pose more danger after he came on than the rest of the match, poor tactical decision I thought.

If we win the next two games, I might believe we are starting to turn the corner, especially if we get a couple of decent players in. However, another performance like after the ManUre game and the Chelsea match will just be a pleasant memory among many poor ones.

The support will be there if the players earn it.

Currently, there is only a handful doing a full shift, the others don't look as if they are bothered.

If the management team in the dugout looked a bit more animated and could be seen to be encouraging the team, it might help, IMO, their whole demeanour is one of defeat.

I can understand MON walking out being responsible for some of our early poor performances but to keep blaming him for results like yesterday is just ridiculous.

Redknapp didn't have a preseason with spurs or any chance to sign players and he got off to a great start as soon as he took over. How on earth did he manage such a thing?

Man management, good judgement and he's always been a good wheeler and dealer.

As much as I dislike Twitchy, he's done a great job at WHL.

Although Randy is the main man, I believe he had a panel of so called football experts to guide him and the board on appointing a new manager. IMO therefore, given Randy's lack of in depth knowledge about the game in the UK and Europe, he relied on these experts to provide sound advice and judgement, which it seems, has proved to be a really bad call.

Given the choice, it has been compounded by Houlliers choice of assistant, first Thompson, who turned it down then McAllister who looks out of his depth, by his demeanour on the bench.

The some of the senior players must also carry part of the can, as they aren't delivering a full shift. The fans deserve better than some of these w*nkers are providing.

MON chose the worst time to leave, and he bought some poor players at inflated prices and wages, but given a more motivated manager, we might have been up around the top six, so IMO, I don't think much blame can be laid at MON's door.

Same old same old under Houllier. We go a goal down we lose. 5 defeats in last 6 potentially 7 defeats in last 8 come Saturday. Simply not good enough and he as to go.

As for the game. We huffed and puffed playing the ball backwards/sideways/backwards/sideways but Gomes was rarely worked. We were also at times chasing shadows. And this was against 10 men for 60 minutes.

Couple of baffling selections. Hogg and Delph in the middle with a presumably fully fit Reo Coker on the bench. Then bringing on an arthritic Pires at 2-0 down. As someone in the crowd shouted when he came on " If Pires is the answer then God knows what the **** question is ".

Not good enough and sadly I think it will get worse unless Houllier goes.

Yes. there is most definatley a clear pattern now, that when we go a goal down before half time, the players heads drop and we lose the game.

This suggesting that the manger is not motivating and installing the belief in the dressing room at half time, and that we can go out there and get back in the game. This has not happened once under Houllier, but many times under Martin. A quick example that comes to mind was when we played Middlesborogh away at the end of the 09 season (when on our bad run). We were awfull in the firs half after conceeding a very early goal. The players came out 2nd half a different side with pace, and accuracey. Carew finding an eqauliser and we almost found a winner late on. We also managed the same against Wolves in march when we were 2-1 down. We played badly that day, but still found an answer to grab a point.

This part of managment is so critical i.m.o to the overall package of a good manager. If Houllier is not motivating the players to fight back, then is their much point in having him ?

Having watched the last two games on TV, it was the same picture when the cameras showed our management team on the bench when we were already goals down. No encouragement for the players, sitting with despondant expressions, an already "we've given up" atmosphere coming off them. This is not what fans expect from them when we are playing like we are.

Don't know what their problems are, but at least MON was motivated and his pitchside activities made it clear to his players he was with them, not so these two. What had McAllister done as a coach/manager prior to Villa, not a lot really, but it seems Houllier wanted a comfort factor and was choosing his old mates. I know Houllier is in his sixties and fans are saying he's too old. I don't subscribe to his age being a factor, as Fergie is older, and Twitchy is in his sixties. GH's problem IMO, is he was too long out of English football and hasn't yet got up to speed, unfortunately, we may be down by the time he does, assuming he does.

I don't think RL will get rid of him this season, as it doesn't seem his style, but it looks like the advisors Lerner relied on when looking for MON's replacement did not do a good job, and probably thought Houllier was a safe pair of hands. What Villa really needed was an ambitious manager like Coyle or De Matteo, but there are not many of these about with a decent pedigree of believing in playing football rather than pass the ball in your own half for 10 passes then punt it forward to lose possession.

The next five months are going to be dire if you're a Villa supporter.

GH now has an even bigger struggle on his hands after the last few games.

Poorly judged comments apart, the squad do not give any impression of wanting to play for him, compared to last season. Also, is the long injury list partly due to the new training routine and a lack of some players ability to train significantly harder than previous required to, I'd hope not, with all the facilities the club has at Bodymoor.

It now seems that GH has to step up to the plate and prove to the fans he can motivate the team into at least beating the Baggies and Wigan. Failure to get six points, must surely mean he'll be out the door in January and the judgement of those who selected him to be in serious doubt and questioned about whether they can be trusted for any future manager decision.

The crowd yesterday was very subdued with over 4k empty seats.

Do you live in your own little world Mark?

Do you not understand people are losing their jobs?

It's a month before Christmas also....To some people working overtime on a Saturday so they can get their children/family presents for Christmas is more important than paying out £30 to watch Aston Villa play football.

It wasn't really that bad of an attendance.

I sure do live in the real world pal I have two young children so please don't preach to me about the cost of Christmas etc.

I would never criticize any one for putting work before football or who simply have higher priorities and certainly not those who have recently unfortunately lost their jobs.

More worrying for me yesterday was the lack of atmosphere. It was simply none existent and didn't even pick up that much when we looked for a brief spell like we might some how get something. There was more than enough people present to create an atmosphere and get behind the lads even if they aren't over inspired by the manager.

Perhaps the lack of atmosphere was more about the poor first half performance and when we got back to 2-1 immediately let in the third. We don't seem to have enough fans willing create an atmosphere to lift the team when we are playing poorly, and a lot of empty seats doesn't do anything to improve it either. When we are playing well, the fans are tremendous, but on days like Saturday, there a lot who despite the criticism of O'Dreary, are fickle, but they're not alone, the Spuds fans booed their team off at half time only three or four matches ago.

On the question of atmosphere, for those who recently on another forum talk about the need to increase the ground size to 60,000 as an incentive to get a billionaire to buy Randy out, they might just think about what it would be like with a stadium only half to two thirds full.