Manchester United

[kurtsimonw]

On 11/8/2016 at 10:05, villa4europe said:

the way he set madrid up in the classicos was shocking and he couldnt hide it anymore

No chance.

He went there and tried to outplay Barca and lost 5-0. His total record at Madrid v Barca was 5 wins, 6 draws and 6 defeats. He also knocked Barca out with both Chelsea and Inter. He made a balls up trying to outplay them, learned from that and set his team up to try and get a result.

It does amuse me when people use his defensive style as a stick to beat him with, as if there's something wrong with it. Then use their other hand to wank over Simeone who's as defensive as it gets.

Edited November 9, 2016 by kurtsimonw

[Zatman]

slaughtering his players in public. the Roy Keane approach to management isnt going to end well

[TrentVilla]

9 hours ago, Zatman said:

slaughtering his players in public. the Roy Keane approach to management isnt going to end well

Depends who the club back.

I think he has a point about some of the players and the club can't keep finishing outside the CL places and changing managers.

They are going to have to back him against the players here.

[Genie]

After 16 games in charge:

Moyes: W9 D4 L3 = 31 points

LVG: W8 D4 L4 = 28 points

Jose: W8 D3 L5 = 27 points

Then when you factor in that David Moyes couldn't even have Leighton Baines from Everton and LVG and Jose have had hundreds of millions to spend...

[TrentVilla]

18 minutes ago, Genie said:

After 16 games in charge:

Moyes: W9 D4 L3 = 31 points

LVG: W8 D4 L4 = 28 points

Jose: W8 D3 L5 = 27 points

Then when you factor in that David Moyes couldn't even have Leighton Baines from Everton and LVG and Jose have had hundreds of millions to spend...

Yes but you also have to factor in what each manager has inherited due to the signings made by the man before them.

I think it's hard to argue that LVG improved the squad with the money he spent or Moyes for that matter.

[Genie]

Moyes clearly had his hands tied though, being told he could have Fellaini or Baines really shows how bad the club was being run at the time. They've now gone to the other extreme of paying WR transfer fees on a player probably valued by most at about half of that.

 

[TrentVilla]

59 minutes ago, Genie said:

Moyes clearly had his hands tied though, being told he could have Fellaini or Baines really shows how bad the club was being run at the time. They've now gone to the other extreme of paying WR transfer fees on a player probably valued by most at about half of that.

 

I don't dispute that but that doesn't detract from the point I was making.

[bobzy]

14 hours ago, kurtsimonw said:

No chance.

He went there and tried to outplay Barca and lost 5-0. His total record at Madrid v Barca was 5 wins, 6 draws and 6 defeats. He also knocked Barca out with both Chelsea and Inter. He made a balls up trying to outplay them, learned from that and set his team up to try and get a result.

It does amuse me when people use his defensive style as a stick to beat him with, as if there's something wrong with it. Then use their other hand to wank over Simeone who's as defensive as it gets.

His knocking out of Barcelona with Inter was a farce - game full of horrific gamesmanship (mainly from Mourinho's side, also from Busquets), a goal ruled out for a hand ball that never was and Inter Milan playing for a 0-0.  Pretty sure Mourinho made a mysterious late change before the game, calling in a defender for an "injured" forward as well.  0 shots in the entire game.

Simeone is defensive, but generally plays to win a game on the counter-attack - and that's fair enough given that he's evolved Ath Madrid to be a major force in European football who are, basically, just punching above their weight.  He's also kept the momentum going and retained his job for longer than Mourinho has ever been at a club.

 

[kurtsimonw]

1 hour ago, bobzy said:

His knocking out of Barcelona with Inter was a farce - game full of horrific gamesmanship (mainly from Mourinho's side, also from Busquets), a goal ruled out for a hand ball that never was and Inter Milan playing for a 0-0.  Pretty sure Mourinho made a mysterious late change before the game, calling in a defender for an "injured" forward as well.  0 shots in the entire game.

Simeone is defensive, but generally plays to win a game on the counter-attack - and that's fair enough given that he's evolved Ath Madrid to be a major force in European football who are, basically, just punching above their weight.  He's also kept the momentum going and retained his job for longer than Mourinho has ever been at a club.

 

The Barca-Inter was mostly a farce because of Barca. What do you expect a manager to do when a player is wrongly sent off so early? If it took Barca over 80 minutes to score against 10 men, that's on them. The disallowed goal was more than enough justice for that absolute clearing in the woods Busquets getting a former teammate sent off. It's a two leg game, not really Mourinho's fault Barca threw away a 1-0 away goal lead at the San Siro. 

Winning is winning. If a manager wants to be defensive, surely it's more of an achievement that they're winning a lot of games. His teams generally score goals anyway, too.

Edited November 10, 2016 by kurtsimonw

[villa89]

6 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

Yes but you also have to factor in what each manager has inherited due to the signings made by the man before them.

I think it's hard to argue that LVG improved the squad with the money he spent or Moyes for that matter.

Or Mourinho...

Eric Bailly, Villarreal, £30m
Zlatan Ibrahimovic, Paris Saint-Germain, free transfer
Henrikh Mkhitaryan, Borussia Dortmund, £26m
Paul Pogba, Juventus, £89m

£145m spent, I'd be expecting more impact from players signed for that kind of money.

[kurtsimonw]

Have to wonder if some players just shine in a certain system. Kagawa, Gotze, Mkhitaryan all pretty awful when they got their big moves from Dortmund. Though early days for Mkhitaryan still.

[VillaChris]

3 hours ago, bobzy said:

His knocking out of Barcelona with Inter was a farce - game full of horrific gamesmanship (mainly from Mourinho's side, also from Busquets), a goal ruled out for a hand ball that never was and Inter Milan playing for a 0-0.  Pretty sure Mourinho made a mysterious late change before the game, calling in a defender for an "injured" forward as well.  0 shots in the entire game.

Simeone is defensive, but generally plays to win a game on the counter-attack - and that's fair enough given that he's evolved Ath Madrid to be a major force in European football who are, basically, just punching above their weight.  He's also kept the momentum going and retained his job for longer than Mourinho has ever been at a club.

 

Inter were brilliant in the first leg which was forgotten.

Went 1 nil down and then scored 3 times in space of 15 minutes to give them control in the tie. If Barca had gone 1 up against an english team it would've been end of tie as reflected their dominance of English teams around that time.

Let's not forget in May 2008 Man. United went to Barca and parked their bus for a 0-0 and they have Fergie, Ronaldo, Tevez and Rooney.

And I generally can't stand Mourinho these days but he isn't always the satan of football.

[kurtsimonw]

42 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Inter were brilliant in the first leg which was forgotten.

Went 1 nil down and then scored 3 times in space of 15 minutes to give them control in the tie. If Barca had gone 1 up against an english team it would've been end of tie as reflected their dominance of English teams around that time.

To be fair, Alves and Messi spent the entire game having a diving competition so Inter were really just playing against 9 men.

[rodders0223]

That was one of my first memories or main memories of Yaya Toure. He had so many shots in that game and so many opportunities that were spurned. He was absymal. i was staggered when he came to the PL and was scoring for "fun"

[Zatman]

19 hours ago, kurtsimonw said:

Have to wonder if some players just shine in a certain system. Kagawa, Gotze, Mkhitaryan all pretty awful when they got their big moves from Dortmund. Though early days for Mkhitaryan still.

Mkhitaryan seems to start slow at clubs especially at Dortmund

[bobzy]

20 hours ago, kurtsimonw said:

The Barca-Inter was mostly a farce because of Barca. What do you expect a manager to do when a player is wrongly sent off so early? If it took Barca over 80 minutes to score against 10 men, that's on them. The disallowed goal was more than enough justice for that absolute clearing in the woods Busquets getting a former teammate sent off. It's a two leg game, not really Mourinho's fault Barca threw away a 1-0 away goal lead at the San Siro. 

Winning is winning. If a manager wants to be defensive, surely it's more of an achievement that they're winning a lot of games. His teams generally score goals anyway, too.

Are you having a laugh with your first line?  The Inter players were literally falling about being "injured" after not even being touched, the entire game.  Their keeper was booked for time wasting in the first half (I had to look that up, as I assumed more players were booked for time wasting... they weren't!).

Further, Motta wasn't wrongly sent off - it was an over-reaction from Busquets and the Inter player should've only been booked rather than given a straight red... but he was already on a yellow card and put his hand in Busquets' face.  Not an elbow, nothing nasty, but a yellow card (and horrible playacting from Busquets).  If you don't want to run the risk of being sent off, don't put your hand in someone's face.

The disallowed goal wasn't "justice" - only one team ever had any thought of winning that game.  Perhaps it's a problem with a two-legged system, but, from the off, Inter had no intention whatsoever of even having a shot.  "Genius", Jose.

 

Edit:  The "his teams generally score goals too, anyway" made me lol.  He's managed bankrolled clubs and the best team in whichever league they've been in (bar maybe Inter, which was an astonishing achievement even with that Barca game).  Of course they've scored goals.  It would be harder not to.

Edited November 11, 2016 by bobzy

[rodders0223]

So Chris Smalling is out for a month with a broken toe, after Jose Mourinho questioned his commitment, his heart and practically his manhood.

What. A. Cretin.

[BOF]

10 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

So Chris Smalling is out for a month with a broken toe, after Jose Mourinho questioned his commitment, his heart and practically his manhood.

What. A. Cretin.

I might be wrong but I believe Mourinho also threatened to have all of Chris Smalling's pets put down and has assigned a bully to him for outside of training hours.  He also sends random skips and pizzas to his house.

[kurtsimonw]

8 hours ago, bobzy said:

Are you having a laugh with your first line?  The Inter players were literally falling about being "injured" after not even being touched, the entire game.  Their keeper was booked for time wasting in the first half (I had to look that up, as I assumed more players were booked for time wasting... they weren't!).

Further, Motta wasn't wrongly sent off - it was an over-reaction from Busquets and the Inter player should've only been booked rather than given a straight red... but he was already on a yellow card and put his hand in Busquets' face.  Not an elbow, nothing nasty, but a yellow card (and horrible playacting from Busquets).  If you don't want to run the risk of being sent off, don't put your hand in someone's face.

The disallowed goal wasn't "justice" - only one team ever had any thought of winning that game.  Perhaps it's a problem with a two-legged system, but, from the off, Inter had no intention whatsoever of even having a shot.  "Genius", Jose.

 

Edit:  The "his teams generally score goals too, anyway" made me lol.  He's managed bankrolled clubs and the best team in whichever league they've been in (bar maybe Inter, which was an astonishing achievement even with that Barca game).  Of course they've scored goals.  It would be harder not to.

Yeah, let's attack a game with 10 men while you're 3-1 up and risk throwing it away. Being smart means playing the game to the best fit for the team. When you have a 3-1 lead, you don't go all out and leave space for a good team. Knowing you're an inferior team is important. He made that cock up at Madrid when he tried to outplay them and got hammered. If you don't want to run the risk of a team being defensive. Don't throw away a lead and get hammered away from home in a 2 leg game.

Funny you don't mention Porto. Not won the league for 3 years, finished 3rd the previous year. Total net of £8m profit in his time there. But I suppose that doesn't fit the narrative because of the ridiculous achievement. Inter, again, another ridiculous achievement.

As for Chelsea and Madrid, he definitely spends. But he gets results. Which Chelsea and Madrid managers haven't been bankrolled? He has 4 league titles at those clubs. Both clubs massively struggle to win the title without him.

Edited November 11, 2016 by kurtsimonw

[Guest av1]

José  really is a prat isn't he? This week it's a little dig at De Gea. 

 Man Utd boss Jose Mourinho, speaking to Match of the Day: "It was another defeat. If you have a bad game, or an equal game against a very good team like Arsenal, you draw it is not a drama or a bad result because it is normal between two teams.

But when De Gea was on holidays, when Cech made two or three very good saves or when you miss two or three very good chances and you are in total control then the concede late, then the feeling is like a defeat."