Current affairs Stockholm Burning

[Tegis]

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

Touché

 

 

 

 

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

You know, over here (where there's a lot of socioeconomic inequality, by developed country standards) the Scandinavian countries are often held up as models for governance, especially by people who are dissatisfied with the incumbent government here. While I'm sure a fair bit of it is justified, it is interesting to see that Scandinavia is also, in some respects, not the socialist utopia a lot of Singaporeans (seem to) think it is.

 

 

 

 

No where is a utopia. Anyone who tries to tell you otherwise is trying to manipulate you.  

 

Sweden has a very large middle class and the population have a culture of believing the government works for the people (The British seem to think that is a quaint idea ). That attitude helps when you have to pay 50-60% of your income back in various taxes, at least everyone is getting something out of it. At the same time there are a lot of young Swedes who move to the US or UK to break out of that 'happy middle' culture and make their fortune.  

 

 At the other end of the spectrum, new migrants still find it tough to break into that happy middle. People with poor language skills or even just having a foreign sounding surname can find it tough to get a job. Other Swedes can resent having to pay for people who are not paying into the tax system themselves frustrations can build on both sides.

 

 

and Touché

Edited May 24, 2013 by Tegis

[BOF]

It's sad how Europe swings to the right when everybody is broke.  I don't think we are quite at the levels we saw in the 1930s, but it is still thoroughly depressing.

Everyone swings to the right when they're broke. It's a defence mechanism; a 'look after your own' approach when there isn't enough to go around. It's human nature and it's understandable but it sure ain't pretty.

[bickster]

It's sad how Europe swings to the right when everybody is broke.  I don't think we are quite at the levels we saw in the 1930s, but it is still thoroughly depressing.

Everyone swings to the right when they're broke. It's a defence mechanism; a 'look after your own' approach when there isn't enough to go around. It's human nature and it's understandable but it sure ain't pretty.

Not sure thats correct, I think plenty swing to the left too. Both extremes see a rise, its the centre ground that decreases

[BOF]

It's sad how Europe swings to the right when everybody is broke.  I don't think we are quite at the levels we saw in the 1930s, but it is still thoroughly depressing.

Everyone swings to the right when they're broke. It's a defence mechanism; a 'look after your own' approach when there isn't enough to go around. It's human nature and it's understandable but it sure ain't pretty.

Not sure thats correct, I think plenty swing to the left too. Both extremes see a rise, its the centre ground that decreases

As a misanthrope I see the swing to the right as being by far the larger swing. You're right that the centre suffers though.

[BOF]

Swedish journalists are paying people to burn cars so they can get some footage. Article is in Swedish so good luck with that

[Tegis]

Our equivalent of the Redtops if its true. They are denying it of course.

 

Interesting!

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

Looks like a standard Friday night to me.

[LondonLax]

Crazy if true

[Juju]

I live sort of on the outskirts of Croydon. I worked in Croydon and had only left that borough for another 2 months before the riots.

 

If it was about equality, the poor, they would't have smashed up some of the businesses in West Croydon that they did.  It was lazy clearings in the woods robbing trainers and flat screens.   Waterstones was untouched, Richersounds robbed. Primark, left alone, Footlocker, raped. The majority of looters were of school and near school age, with all the advantages of easy to get local college places, an education they chose often not to take advantage of.  There was nothing heroic about that night, it was no "protest", it was feckless, lazy, out for a laugh thieves and scumbags, trying to hide behind the screen of "mass riot" anonymity. If they needed food and clothes, they could have taken them, but they left the bread and cereal in Lidl, and went straight for the alcohol and fags. There was no particular grief to bring about the riots, it was simply "copycat" of the Tottenham riots. Even I got warned that my bit of the country was next, in the  "organised" for looting the next night by people on the periphery of it all.

 

I would be surprised if Sweden was any different. Rascism and alienation are flags of political convienience for unjust enrichment. If they really cared they'd be out marching, voting and being active. Not just stealing shit - thats not very left wing to deny a hard working person their small business livelyhood, you know, the guy who pays his taxes and employs local people. 

[Davkaus]

 

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

The title of the video is ridiculous. Why is it that when Muslims do something, their religion suddenly becomes extremely relevant.

 

 

 

Because few other religions have sacred texts that espouse the complete eradication of any non-believers. All religions are ridiculous, but Islam is particularly wicked.

[turnbull]

Call me selfish, but as long as I can get a hotdog meal at Ikea Wednesbury unmolested, I don't give a toss.

[peterms]

Not sure thats correct, I think plenty swing to the left too. Both extremes see a rise, its the centre ground that decreases

  

As a misanthrope I see the swing to the right as being by far the larger swing. You're right that the centre suffers though.

 

So you two swing both ways?

[Pelle]

 

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

Touché

 

 

 

 

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

You know, over here (where there's a lot of socioeconomic inequality, by developed country standards) the Scandinavian countries are often held up as models for governance, especially by people who are dissatisfied with the incumbent government here. While I'm sure a fair bit of it is justified, it is interesting to see that Scandinavia is also, in some respects, not the socialist utopia a lot of Singaporeans (seem to) think it is.

 

 

 

 

No where is a utopia. Anyone who tries to tell you otherwise is trying to manipulate you.  

 

Sweden has a very large middle class and the population have a culture of believing the government works for the people (The British seem to think that is a quaint idea ). That attitude helps when you have to pay 50-60% of your income back in various taxes, at least everyone is getting something out of it. At the same time there are a lot of young Swedes who move to the US or UK to break out of that 'happy middle' culture and make their fortune.  

 

 At the other end of the spectrum, new migrants still find it tough to break into that happy middle. People with poor language skills or even just having a foreign sounding surname can find it tough to get a job. Other Swedes can resent having to pay for people who are not paying into the tax system themselves frustrations can build on both sides.

 

 

and Touché

 

 

Can't agree with the first part. I've seen enough to think that these are just lazy scumbags who don't want to work but just wants to demolish and blame it on their poverty and all that. They don't have any interest in working. I know I'm generalising, but as someone else said in this thread, if they were really angry about all those things they'd know there are better ways to protest than cause a riot.

 

The last part whilst holds a lot of truth ain't the whole turth. On my shift where I work over 50% are immigrants in one way or another. And I got to know that a fair few of them actually once were illegal immigrants that cheated their way in here. They're msotly from former Yugoslavia and the one who told me was one of them. Anyway, I don't care about that. They're swedish citizens now and as long as they do their job I really couldn't care less. Some of them I like, some of them I like less. Just like I do with all people. Anyway, in the area around my work, heavy industry mostly evolving around Volvo, there are lots of immigrants working. BUT at least at my working place there are few of them who holds a higher position. We had one but he was put aside to my advantage, but that was his own fault. He had the day shift and they were complaining about him for years and the bosses tried to talk to him change his way of leading the shift, but that didn't work. So yes, they definitely have a disadvantage when it comes to get a job, and the ridiculous thing is that there are many high skilled immigrants, doctors and such, that can't get a job in their area as they haven't got "the right education and qualification". And whilst that might be true they seldom gets the chance to get the right education and qualification. But these are rarely the ones to complain, at least not through riots. They know better.

 

And it's also disturbing with all those swedes complaining about all the immigrants and saying they're either taking our money through wellfare or taking our jobs. They think they're just costing us a lot of money. I try to tell them that most of it is just pure bullshit, but they don't listen.

 

Most of the problems lie within the politicians, the lame politicians, no matter what colour they have. Many swedes feel that they've tried to make it as good as possible that they've forgotten the swedish people. And sometimes it's true too. The politicians have made it a bad thing to sing the national anthem apart from special occassions. They were helped by racists, of course. Not that I go around singing the national anthem, but when it comes to situations like graduations and it's not allowed to sing the swedish anthem there because it could alienate the immigrants it's starting to get ridiculous. Same with the swedish flag. My ex girlfriends class in high school had a swedish flag behind them when they were taking a photo for the school photo album. They had to take a new picture because of the flag. For them it was just a"fun thing" to have on the picture. The political correctness has in some parts gone too far. In the summer graduation it's been a tradition for many years to sing a summer hymn. It's not allowed anymore. And the funny thing is that the immigrants I've talked to don't care about that. It's mostly in the politcians heads. One other thing is that we shall allt hem all swedes as they live here now and all that. But most of the ones I know don't wanna be called swedes. They don't think of themselves as such. They're proud of where they come from, as they should be. They're croatians, serbs, turks, chileans and they don't want to be called swedes. Of course this don't go for everyone, but for many. When I lived in England I didn't want to be called english. Of course, I didn't have a english citizenship, nor did I try to get one, but if I did I still wouldn't feel like an englishman, no offence.

 

And the integrations has failed big time. Studies shows when an area reaches over 30% immigrants, the swedish people starts to move out. There's something really wrong there. Why are we as a people so afraid of other people? Other cultures? We, living in the western world, are so certain that our moral truths are the right ones that we seldom even consider that we can be wrong or that other cultures morality and laws can be equally true. There are some obvious ones in some cultures that I can't for my life say is right, like how some cultures treat women and stuff like that. But if we could just share with each other we'd all be so much richer. And now I sound like Tomas Di Leva. Who only us swedes knows who he is.

 

I could tell tons of stories working in both ways, but I feel this has already got longer than I thought it to be. But again I want to state that I'm absolutely no racist. I don't mind immigrants at all. But some of this political correctnes in this country does my head in sometimes. And it's 4:30 in the morning. I guess my not very well thought through rant is over.

[Keyblade]

 

 

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

The title of the video is ridiculous. Why is it that when Muslims do something, their religion suddenly becomes extremely relevant.

 

 

 

Because few other religions have sacred texts that espouse the complete eradication of any non-believers. All religions are ridiculous, but Islam is particularly wicked.

 

 

Yeah, no.

[TRO]

Their religion doesn't have anything to do with these riots. It's poor people who feel alienated from government institutions like the police taking out their frustrations at being poor and feeling left out of society.

It seems similar to the London riots and the Paris riots from a few years back

 

Poor is no excuse for wilful damage and civil unrest. we were poor in the 50's but we had values and channelled all our energies in to trying to improve our personal financial standing. people make money and lose it all too, but just come back....The folk in Oklahoma have lost everything through no fault of there own, but they will endeavour and come back.

 

This is more sinister than being poor.

 

I believe some serious review of immigration rules across europe need to be looked at.

[maqroll]

 

 The political correctness has in some parts gone too far.

 

It's absolutely pathological in just about every western developed country. A complete acquiescence to immigrants, some illegal, and many with no intention of assimilating into their new country at all. Once upon a time, immigrants worked really hard to assimilate, learn the language, the customs, the history etc. Now it's all about getting on the government tit as soon as they enter the country. Why work when government will pay for your housing? Insanity. 

[Keyblade]

Implying immigrants are the only ones who abuse government welfare.

[maqroll]

Sorry, but where did I imply that? 

 

We can have a discussion about the rampant abuse of welfare by non-immigrants if you want to. 

 

You go first.

[drat01]

 

 

 The political correctness has in some parts gone too far.

 

It's absolutely pathological in just about every western developed country. A complete acquiescence to immigrants, some illegal, and many with no intention of assimilating into their new country at all. Once upon a time, immigrants worked really hard to assimilate, learn the language, the customs, the history etc. Now it's all about getting on the government tit as soon as they enter the country. Why work when government will pay for your housing? Insanity. 

 

What a quite obscene thing to post.

[maqroll]

Oh deary me. Before you brand me as "X", you should know that I was speaking only of the immigrants who are guilty of said offenses.