Bolitics UKIP Nutters

[tonyh29]

Thats still racism though Tony

yeah but it's more a  misguided racism rather than hateful racism if that makes sense

 

arguably there isn't a difference but those FB nutters aren't card carrying members that want to deport everybody that doesn't salute the St Georges flag and most of them despite these posts do seem to have adopted a tolerant if selected view  ... maybe they are 5 % racists or something whereas 30 years ago they would have been 50% racist  .... I'm probably not making sense here am I

[drat01]

 

Thats still racism though Tony

yeah but it's more a  misguided racism rather than hateful racism if that makes sense

 

arguably there isn't a difference but those FB nutters aren't card carrying members that want to deport everybody that doesn't salute the St Georges flag and most of them despite these posts do seem to have adopted a tolerant if selected view  ... maybe they are 5 % racists or something whereas 30 years ago they would have been 50% racist  .... I'm probably not making sense here am I

 

Southern git ! :-)

Edited April 30, 2013 by drat01

[peterms]

 

Thats still racism though Tony

yeah but it's more a  misguided racism rather than hateful racism if that makes sense

 

arguably there isn't a difference but those FB nutters aren't card carrying members that want to deport everybody that doesn't salute the St Georges flag and most of them despite these posts do seem to have adopted a tolerant if selected view  ... maybe they are 5 % racists or something whereas 30 years ago they would have been 50% racist  .... I'm probably not making sense here am I

 

 

The "hateful racists" continually seek to stir up resentment, hatred and bigotry among the "misguided racists".

 

One tiny example:

 

English Attitude ‏@EnglishAtt 5h

When you get home from work, and you see your family sad and poor, remember its due to the massive drain of immigration/foreign aid etc ; )

 

Immigration is a net economic benefit, and poverty in the UK is an outcome of rapidly increasing inequality.  Yet there's a constant stream of propaganda aimed at hoodwinking people into thinking that if only there weren't immigration, they would somehow be better off.  The outcome is a gradual shift in social attitudes which creates a climate slightly more accepting of bigotry, discrimination, and violence.

 

The lad I've quoted (there are plenty more like him) enters into discussion with hardcore nazis about the presentational aspects of using the swastika:

 

English Attitude ‏@EnglishAtt 5h

@TheAryanStorm Bro, I agree, it is a big obligation. But, why do you still identity with the Nazi flag? It does not evoke optimal sentiment.

 

The stream of hate from people like this is directed at people who would recoil from nazi views, but whose views and attitudes are the target for influence for the nazis.  The aim is gradual erosion of the line you perceive between hateful and misguided views.

[bickster]

ALex Wood is your knife wielding nazi saluting UKIP candidate from the front page of the Mirror today. Nice chap

Then you've got Mr Farage himself talking about "coloured people" on Radio 4 today

[AVFCforever1991]

 

What a disgrace 

Edited April 30, 2013 by AVFCforever1991

[peterms]

Frankie Boyle ‏@frankieboyle 28 Apr

Subtitles for the deaf on the news called the UKIP leader " Nigel for Raj". If I worked for Private Eye I could take the rest of the day off

[Jon]

Racist blah blah nutter blah blah facist blah blah lunatic blah...Yawwwwwwwwnnnn!! The smugness and self superiority coming from this thread is quite something. Although not a UKIP supporter, I think it a little rich to dismiss over 10% of the population (according to polls) as 'racist, far right nutters who support policies of utter crap'.

I find it quite strange that someone with an interest in the wellbeing and fortunes of our Finnish brethren would strike up a defence of UKIP.

 

[chrisp65]

Racist blah blah nutter blah blah facist blah blah lunatic blah...Yawwwwwwwwnnnn!! The smugness and self superiority coming from this thread is quite something. Although not a UKIP supporter, I think it a little rich to dismiss over 10% of the population (according to polls) as 'racist, far right nutters who support policies of utter crap'.

disagree totally

Here is a 'new' party that is misleading people with a cheap party trick that could potentially skew the outcome of a democratic election and adversley affect the future direction of this country. It's a classic snake oil side show con.

Are you against change? Sign here.

Are you against that mad health and safety stuff you saw in the paper? Sign here.

Don't want gypsies and a wind turbine in your garden? Sign here.

Want tax reduced and spending increased? Sign here.

Fancy being let off the occassional drink drive error that isn't meant to stop hard working people have a fag and a pint? Sign here.

I'm not saying the regular parties are creditable, I'm simply saying he is worse by a bloody big margin.

It's anti anything to raise a crowd charlatan bollocks. The proof of which is that they haven't even vetted the people representing them. It isn't good enough to say we are growing too fast to thin out the odd nutter. They have people that will be representing them, representing us that believe in forced abortion for disabled babies. They have white supremacists hiding in their jolly happy go lucky ranks. Farage himself this morning stated they would impose a flat rate tax at at least two levels. Now clearly one of us doesn't understand what a flat rate means.

He's a chancer that has proven yet again, you can fool some of the people, all of the time.

[blandy]

chrisp65, on 30 Apr 2013 - 7:47 PM, said:

Here is a 'new' party that is misleading people with a cheap party trick that could potentially skew the outcome of a democratic election…

I think as little of UKIP as you, Chris, but I don’t really think the quoted comment is that accurate.

If people vote for the UKIPs (or anyone else, that is democracy in action. I think most/all the parties mislead people. I just think UKIP prey on a set of views that are less palatable, but they’re there, all the same.

The failure would be the other parties, or the democratic system not being capable of exposing the UKIP deceit in a way that voters grasp.

So much of the country doesn’t trust any of them, through the past actions of mainly the main 2 or 3 parties, traditionally, that they’ve kind of only got themselves to blame if someone else comes along and adopts the same techniques to twist things to get themselves the votes or sympathies of people.

The rest of your post, apart from that one line, is exactly my view, too.

[saturdaygig]

Is that Tarquin Fin-tim-lin-bin-whin-bim-lim-bus-stop-F'tang-F'tang- Olé-Biscuitbarrel?

 Or could it be michael peter brian telescope adrian blackpool rock stoke cobbler raw vegetable...etc...etc smith, the very silly candidate. But no! he'd be in the slab of concrete.

[chrisp65]

aye, fair point blandy

 

I think the proper interrogation of UKIP will come once they are so stretched as to need more than Farage in front of the inquiring media. I'd be fairly sure that 5 UKIP spokespeople would give five jazz variations of answers on any given question.

 

It's a really awkward one, what I dislike about the other parties is the droning on message efficiency (for much of the time), that prove 'the party' is all about protecting the brand first and foremost. Whilst UKIP appear to be the polar opposite of this, they are the opposite in a negative way. More a random bag of psychotics than a collective of free thinkers.

 

It'll all be better once I'm in charge.

[WhatAboutTheFinish]

 

Racist blah blah nutter blah blah facist blah blah lunatic blah...Yawwwwwwwwnnnn!! The smugness and self superiority coming from this thread is quite something. Although not a UKIP supporter, I think it a little rich to dismiss over 10% of the population (according to polls) as 'racist, far right nutters who support policies of utter crap'.

I find it quite strange that someone with an interest in the wellbeing and fortunes of our Finnish brethren would strike up a defence of UKIP.

 

 

You are right! You would have thought that a guy who has spent the last 10+ years living and working in various European countries with, as you rightly mention, a very strong affection for certain nations and their citizens would not be an obvious defender of UKIP...and in a way I don't want to be! The fact is that they must (according to opinion polls) have some policies that appeal to a large number of people. This should warrant more respect and debate than dismissing them as extrememists. More than 10% of the population is not extreme but mainstream. The sad thing I find is that none of the major parties can form a coherant and believable message to counter UKIP's claims, they are resorting to trawling through facebook to try to discredit them.

[jon_c]

I'd say at least 10% of people I know are racist, people through work and even members of my own family make some racist comments pretty regularly. At work, customers I deal with everyday, say some outright overtly racist stuff.

This doesn't mean it should be accepted and not rallied against. And certainly not rallied against when coming from a political party.

[Jon]

 

 

Racist blah blah nutter blah blah facist blah blah lunatic blah...Yawwwwwwwwnnnn!! The smugness and self superiority coming from this thread is quite something. Although not a UKIP supporter, I think it a little rich to dismiss over 10% of the population (according to polls) as 'racist, far right nutters who support policies of utter crap'.

I find it quite strange that someone with an interest in the wellbeing and fortunes of our Finnish brethren would strike up a defence of UKIP.

 

 

 The fact is that they must (according to opinion polls) have some policies that appeal to a large number of people.

Very true. and this is why we should turn the postlight on this party, their policies and their candidates. Ane once you do that, they start falling to bits. They ARE a party to ridicule. They are a bigoted, intolerant, right wing party.

 

They appeal to the lowest common denominator of a good many voters, sadly. Mainly those that do not think overly deeply about political issues, or thsoe with entrenched bigoted beliefs.

 

But, if they do pick up a fair share of the vote, their voice should be heard, and they should have representation (in parliament). That's 'democracy'. I do believe that the more focus they get, the more their 'policies', people and values will disintegrate. That is also democracy.

 

At the moment, many voters know little about them other than that they will 'defend British peoples jobs against them foreigners', and it appeals.

[WhatAboutTheFinish]

How many of the 10% you know vote UKIP? Racism is not a problem confined to one political party so in my opinion we should be very careful about ceding the moral high ground to the major parties who are playing the race card because they don't want to hightlight the absurdity of some of their own (or the EU's) policy decisions.

 

They are a party to ridicule because they are right wing? Really Jon? What should we do send them to the Gulag?

 

If, as you suggest, the debate can be had focussed on the policies and subsequently the party collapses...great! That is democracy. Picking out a few things that individuals have written on Facebook 5 years ago is not the level of debate we should be having. 

[peterms]

They are a party to ridicule because they are right wing? Really Jon? What should we do send them to the Gulag?

 

I'm struggling to see the connection between these two things.  Perhaps I'm just being slow this morning.

[claretman]

I know a few people who were planning on voting UKIP, purely down to their immigration policy.

 

I pointed out to one of my mates that as a keen cyclist, he might want to have a look at the UKIP proposals re cyclists (ie Viewing cyclists as people who steal road space from those who pay for it and proposing a 'road tax style' cycle disc that you have to pay for).  This has now made him think twice. 

 

It's the little gems like this hidden away that people just aren't aware of, and why they will win quite a few votes, because people just don't look at the bigger picture, just the big headline.

[mjmooney]

I know a few people who were planning on voting UKIP, purely down to their immigration policy.

 

I pointed out to one of my mates that as a keen cyclist, he might want to have a look at the UKIP proposals re cyclists (ie Viewing cyclists as people who steal road space from those who pay for it and proposing a 'road tax style' cycle disc that you have to pay for).  This has now made him think twice. 

 

It's the little gems like this hidden away that people just aren't aware of, and why they will win quite a few votes, because people just don't look at the bigger picture, just the big headline.

 

Well I may hate their xenophobia, but having heard that cycle proposal I'm warming to them... 

[Awol]

 

They are a party to ridicule because they are right wing? Really Jon?

That a party with the central policy of promoting the supremacy of nation state democracy can be portrayed as right wing extremists just goes to show how successfully the left wing has captured and corrupted the language of political discourse.

 

Want your country's laws to be made only by people accountable to the electorate? You're an extremist little Englander.  Want an immigration policy that is based on recruiting skilled migrants that the economy needs instead of loads of unskilled labour? You're a racist. Want people in charge who will actually put the people of Britain before the interests of the rest of the world? You're a xenophobe.

 

Really? F*** off.

 

Ridiculing people who believe those three points to be legitimate and important is a get out clause for lefties, avoiding the need for a reasoned rebuttal. What it won't achieve is stopping people who agree with that message from voting UKIP, which given the high level of concerted media and political attacks over the past week is clearly causing the establishment some concern.

[Jon]

 

They are a party to ridicule because they are right wing? Really Jon? What should we do send them to the Gulag?

 

 

Deary, deary me.

 

Can you show me where I said they should be ridiculed because they are right wing? How very poor of you.

 

I said they are a party that should be ridiculed.

 

I also the said they are bigoted, intolerant, right wing party.

 

You've put those 2 together, not me.

 

Poor attempt Sir.