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Transfer Speculation (Summer 2013)


samjp26

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You've insulted me too though. You can't possibly take the moral high ground when you're deliberately posting to get a reaction.

 

Only yesterday you used the fact this year is my first year as a ST holder to invalidate my opinion. You called me pathetic in another thread.

 

Anyway this is utterly pathetic. Neither you or Sutherland have addressed anything I've said and you've just posted to get a reaction out of me. Well done. You've provoked another Villa fan into insulting you.

 

You know what is pathetic though? Getting your kicks from posting deliberately provocative comments in order to get somebody to call you something, only to then take the moral high ground. But whatever, we're all Villa fans aren't we?

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To extend the conversation, the problem with Saber ideas is football is the subjective nature of any useful stat. Con's favorite "key passes" stat, for instance, relies on a person deciding which passes are key and which are not. In baseball, however, you have either gotten on base or not. No subjectivity needed.

It's not subjective. You don't understand how it works.

A key pass is that which would have been an assist if the shot at goal had gone in. So a key pass results in a shot at goal.

It is completely subjective. Who decided what a shot is? If a corner gets hit in and it glances off someone's head, where Bannan got most of his "key passes" btw, is that a real chance?

You do not even understand basic statistical analysis, which makes your insistence on using them very humorous to those of us who do.

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I called your post on your opinion pathetic.

I used your first season as a season ticket holder as a reason why you shouldn't be telling other fans they need to be humbled.

Not once have I called you a cretin or a word removed.

It's a shame you have to resort to such insults on here.

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You've insulted me too though. You can't possibly take the moral high ground when you're deliberately posting to get a reaction.

 

Only yesterday you used the fact this year is my first year as a ST holder to invalidate my opinion. You called me pathetic in another thread.

 

Anyway this is utterly pathetic. Neither you or Sutherland have addressed anything I've said and you've just posted to get a reaction out of me. Well done. You've provoked another Villa fan into insulting you.

 

You know what is pathetic though? Getting your kicks from posting deliberately provocative comments in order to get somebody to call you something, only to then take the moral high ground. But whatever, we're all Villa fans aren't we?

Oh have a day off pal, Aint that like **** a bird behind your mrs back and saying you made me do it!

 

No need for personal insults lad! Just a thought like.

Edited by sutherland
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So what you're saying here is that you can't just view a stat, you have to look at the situation in which the stat was gained.

I think that's what everyone has been saying to you for months.

 

 

No, what I said is it's an objectively derived statistic and even the short passes have meaning. 

 

If you could pass it 2 yards to Bale or 2 yards to Parker for a long shot, who would you choose?

 

BTW watch MOTD tonight... Walker best RB.

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To extend the conversation, the problem with Saber ideas is football is the subjective nature of any useful stat. Con's favorite "key passes" stat, for instance, relies on a person deciding which passes are key and which are not. In baseball, however, you have either gotten on base or not. No subjectivity needed.

It's not subjective. You don't understand how it works.

A key pass is that which would have been an assist if the shot at goal had gone in. So a key pass results in a shot at goal.

It is completely subjective. Who decided what a shot is? If a corner gets hit in and it glances off someone's head, where Bannan got most of his "key passes" btw, is that a real chance?

You do not even understand basic statistical analysis, which makes your insistence on using them very humorous to those of us who do.

 

 

I'm glad you are amused. It's second best to being informed but at least you're not angry.

 

You criticise me for subjectivity and then hand wave blatant generalisations like "where Bannan got most of his key passes btw" and I'm supposed to believe this? You've just told me it's all subjective, so like I'm going to believe you on this datapoint.

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Anyone think we could have a look at Tom Ince or will the price tag be too high?

 

Haven't they tried to claim he's worth £25m? Worth a look but Blackpool need to become a lot more realistic. If Liverpool are interested we probably won't have much chance. 

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If you could pass it 2 yards to Bale or 2 yards to Parker for a long shot, who would you choose?

Whats that got to do with your argument? According to you it doesn't matter who you pass it to because if that player has a shot on target its classed as a key pass.

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If you could pass it 2 yards to Bale or 2 yards to Parker for a long shot, who would you choose?

Whats that got to do with your argument? According to you it doesn't matter who you pass it to because if that player has a shot on target its classed as a key pass.

 

 

Have a shot. Not just a shot on target.  Bale is more likely to shoot than Parker.

 

That is objective. 

 

If you're in space 40 yards from goal and want to make an attacking move but all the through balls are closed off, a good pass is to a long shot specialist.

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If you're in space 40 yards from goal and want to make an attacking move but all the through balls are closed off, a good pass is to a long shot specialist.

Haha

But like i said according to you it doesn't matter. All you care about is that key pass stat. You don't care if it was a great ball through that leads to a one on one or if it's a simple pass to any player who decides to shoot.

Its why looking at the stat and nothing else is pointless.

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If you're in space 40 yards from goal and want to make an attacking move but all the through balls are closed off, a good pass is to a long shot specialist.

Haha

But like i said according to you it doesn't matter. All you care about is that key pass stat. You don't care if it was a great ball through that leads to a one on one or if it's a simple pass to any player who decides to shoot.

Its why looking at the stat and nothing else is pointless.

 

 

If you want a key pass statistic that distinguishes between Hard Key Passes and Easy Key Passes you will need to come up with a better system.

 

What we have is better than nothing. The vast majority of passes do not result in a short at goal.

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If you're in space 40 yards from goal and want to make an attacking move but all the through balls are closed off, a good pass is to a long shot specialist.

Haha

But like i said according to you it doesn't matter. All you care about is that key pass stat. You don't care if it was a great ball through that leads to a one on one or if it's a simple pass to any player who decides to shoot.

Its why looking at the stat and nothing else is pointless.

 

If you want a key pass statistic that distinguishes between Hard Key Passes and Easy Key Passes you will need to come up with a better system.

 

What we have is better than nothing. The vast majority of passes do not result in a short at goal.

It might be better than nothing but it still doesn't mean much without looking at how those key passes were gained.

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If you're in space 40 yards from goal and want to make an attacking move but all the through balls are closed off, a good pass is to a long shot specialist.

Haha

But like i said according to you it doesn't matter. All you care about is that key pass stat. You don't care if it was a great ball through that leads to a one on one or if it's a simple pass to any player who decides to shoot.

Its why looking at the stat and nothing else is pointless.

 

If you want a key pass statistic that distinguishes between Hard Key Passes and Easy Key Passes you will need to come up with a better system.

 

What we have is better than nothing. The vast majority of passes do not result in a short at goal.

It might be better than nothing but it still doesn't mean much without looking at how those key passes were gained.

 

 

 

Yes it does. A key pass is a more significant event than a non-key pass. It creates a chance to score.

 

Players with more key passes than others are creating more chances to score. So a player with 30 KP vs a player with 10 KP over the same game time... the player with 30 is objectively more creative.

 

If you are comparing a player with 30 KP to another player with 30 KP only then do you need to get into a discussion who is better.

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