juteface Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 "We reiterate, our greatest commitment and our greatest solidarity ... for the creation of an independent Palestinian state with the holy city of Jerusalem as its capital."-Hugo Chavez yep, that's looks anti Israel It's anti Israeli policy. Very different from being anti-Semetic. I love this media hate campaign of twisting something someone says to be some sort of racist/genocidal/ignorant thought. Chavez wasn't a great political leader but he's paved the way. Hopefully someone with a better political mind and Chavez's balls comes into power. South America needs bold leaders that are willing to tell the developed nations to beat it and develop their own economies.a The days of Europe and North America running the show are over, China has huge control over Africa and South America will hopefully continue giving the West the Bird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 (edited) Feel sorry for his family but I'm not particularly saddened by this either. Can't really understand the praise he's getting in this thread. Thought this was an interesting article on him. Edited March 6, 2013 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Biro Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 Wont pretend to know anything about politics but his bush comments were always pretty hilarious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 The guy was complicated to say the least. He raised the standard of living of the poor in Venezuela, improved education, housing and health care...he even sold oil at a steep discount to northern US cities, including my own, to people who couldn't afford to pay market price. He was smart and had charisma to burn. But he was also a military strongman who would kill for power, suppress opposition, and cozy up to international despots just to thumb his nose at Uncle Sam. He was a one-off, and he'll be remembered as a legend of Latin America. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 Has someone already won the Celebrity Death Pool? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 (edited) He bought a third world country into the developing world. At a price of course, but a price the people were more than willing to pay. American propaganda aside those that are richest often have the money and the power to shout the loudest, so he was never going to be popular internationally. More importantly, I don't think he cared. A revolutionary leader, if not always a great man. RIP. I'd pretty much agree with the above. As someone also said in this thread hopefully his ideology will outlive his personality cult. Edited March 6, 2013 by markavfc40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 I hope the oppressive and authoritarian parts of his ideology don't live on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 The days of Europe and North America running the show are over, China has huge control over Africa and South America will hopefully continue giving the West the Bird.I take it from the tone of your comment that you think this is a good thing then? Presumably you won't be complaining as the relative wealth of the West continues to decrease, living standards fall and the general public finally cotton on that the cushy welfare state of the last 50 years is grinding to a juddering and unaffordable halt. It's easy to sit in the comfort of Western civilisation and cry about feeding the world, but not so easy when the question is 'how do I feed my family'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 The days of Europe and North America running the show are over, China has huge control over Africa and South America will hopefully continue giving the West the Bird. I take it from the tone of your comment that you think this is a good thing then? Presumably you won't be complaining as the relative wealth of the West continues to decrease, living standards fall and the general public finally cotton on that the cushy welfare state of the last 50 years is grinding to a juddering and unaffordable halt. It's easy to sit in the comfort of Western civilisation and cry about feeding the world, but not so easy when the question is 'how do I feed my family'? Well if we can't afford to live our lifestyle unless it is at the expense of four fifths of the world then we really don't deserve it. China, India, Africa and South America need to be able to share the same standard of living we do, whether that means a raising of standards for them or a lowering for us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 VIVA CHAVEZ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 I know this forum is pretty left wing (pretty is probably too weak a word for it) but why the Chavez love in? This was a man that was virtually a dictator and had very little respect for human rights and the rule of law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 7, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted March 7, 2013 I don't think this forum is predominantly left wing. Levi, Tony, awol, etc. all fight their corner rather well, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 (edited) Not saying everyone on here is left-wing, but a large majority are and when I say left-wing I mean really left-wing. Nothing wrong with that of course I just don't understand why people are lavishly praising a dictator like Chavez. Edited March 7, 2013 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 7, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted March 7, 2013 I don't even know the difference between left and right wing. Seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 (edited) I don't even know the difference between left and right wing. Seriously. Right Wing is Hitler, left wing is Stalin... Edited March 7, 2013 by AVFCforever1991 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 I don't even know the difference between left and right wing. Seriously. Right Wing is Hitler, left wing is Stalin... Funnily enough those two dictators were very similar. Just goes to show the more extreme you get the more similarities you can find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 I know this forum is pretty left wing (pretty is probably too weak a word for it) but why the Chavez love in? This was a man that was virtually a dictator and had very little respect for human rights and the rule of law. Love in is a bit strong. An appreciation for a man who helped bring an end to US control (e.g. killing leaders they didn't like) and bring a lot of good to his country is understandable when it wasn't done with his arse in the air, bent over to the IMF and crew. Clearly he had his flaws but compared to 'dictators' that plighted that region (US backed or otherwise) he was largely benevolent. He was an autocrat (not an outright dictator, he was elected fairly after all, even if he did control the media) no doubt, and had his flaws, but no more than any US president, frankly, and a whole lot less dangerous that many would have you think. Plenty I don't agree with though, his stance on Israel and closeness with Iran for example (but again, the West are not innocent in turning a blind eye when it suits them, Saudi Arabia, anyone?). I also think a free market would've helped the middle-classes that struggled while the country was rebalancing. It is a young system, however, and issues will be ironed out in other countries in the region. So no, not a love in, just an appreciation for a man that stood by his convictions (rightly or wrongly) and did a lot of good to those who needed it and importantly showed that strong social policies do more for the poor than the bullshit trickle-down myth of neo-liberalism. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 And yet if he wasn't claiming to be acting on behalf of the poor (but used the same authoritarian methods) he would be vilified on here, and rightly so. Also let's not forget his militant stance on the Falklands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted March 7, 2013 Author Share Posted March 7, 2013 I know this forum is pretty left wing (pretty is probably too weak a word for it) but why the Chavez love in? This was a man that was virtually a dictator and had very little respect for human rights and the rule of law. Love in is a bit strong. An appreciation for a man who helped bring an end to US control (e.g. killing leaders they didn't like) and bring a lot of good to his country is understandable when it wasn't done with his arse in the air, bent over to the IMF and crew. Clearly he had his flaws but compared to 'dictators' that plighted that region (US backed or otherwise) he was largely benevolent. He was an autocrat (not an outright dictator, he was elected fairly after all, even if he did control the media) no doubt, and had his flaws, but no more than any US president, frankly, and a whole lot less dangerous that many would have you think. Plenty I don't agree with though, his stance on Israel and closeness with Iran for example (but again, the West are not innocent in turning a blind eye when it suits them, Saudi Arabia, anyone?). I also think a free market would've helped the middle-classes that struggled while the country was rebalancing. It is a young system, however, and issues will be ironed out in other countries in the region. So no, not a love in, just an appreciation for a man that stood by his convictions (rightly or wrongly) and did a lot of good to those who needed it and importantly showed that strong social policies do more for the poor than the bullshit trickle-down myth of neo-liberalism. Bravo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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