avfcinwales Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Just for the record, I certainly am not alluding to wanting anyone other than MON at the helm !! Neither am I, but then we don't have a need to put a differing view do we ? As to the best manager they could have ever appointed, I don't think so, he may become a great with us, but I would have found 3 at least, with better records and available too, so I'm sure Lerner's advisers would have . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 24, 2006 Author Moderator Share Posted November 24, 2006 Just for the record, I certainly am not alluding to wanting anyone other than MON at the helm !! Neither am I, but then we don't have a need to put a differing view do we ? As to the best manager they could have ever appointed, I don't think so, he may become a great with us, but I would have found 3 at least, with better records and available too, so I'm sure Lerner's advisers would have . But would they a) have come to Villa at this present moment? and do they have a good knowledge of the English game? Knowledge of the English game is far more important than European football at our current position I'd argue. Before we start talking about Europe, lets qualify for the tournaments first and be doing it on a regular basis before we start thinking about MON's semi-apparent lack of European managerial experience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfcinwales Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 But would they a) have come to Villa at this present moment? and do they have a good knowledge of the English game? Did Wenger, Raffa, Mourinho ? I think when Lerner took over he would have been more than able to persuade anyone he wanted I'd agree that O'Neills experience makes him the ideal choice for us in our recent predicament it would have been hard to find one so suited, but there are others who could have done the job and with a proven European record. Mind you as I keep saying I'm sure in time he'll answer all the questions he's so far been a wonder and he's 100% value for money, you have to love him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Did Wenger, Raffa, Mourinho ? If you don't think much of O'Neill's European record, lord knows what you'd have said about Wenger's at the time he was appointed Arsenal manager. And really, considering the talent he's had available, he hasn't really done much since has he? :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Ron Saunders had acheived very little before taking over villa so I'm not sure what can be deduced by examining a mans career at previous clubs...... It Took Alex Ferguson 5 years to take a grip clearly a period of time totally unacceptable by some fans and probably MON himself......The one thing certain about Martin O'neill is if you were asked the question on Millionaires who is the most popular Manager in British Football and was unlucky enough to not be a football fan the "ask the audience question would be delivered with a resounding 100 % ......Have faith, his teams will be a transition and we are lucky enough to be around to watch it happen Nothing is 'being deduced'. In fact if you read my post thoroughly you would see that I actually point out that 'what went before' can NOT be used as a guide for what will happen to us, but that I chose to comment on the squad 'for the purpose' of responding to what Malcolm asked anyway. I also went on to say that "I expect he will" be able to make the jump to consistent big fish, so I don't know what the 'have faith' comment was referring to - as I clearly already DO have faith. For me to mention that he technically has never been in a major league with a club equipped to win things is not a criticism, it is a fact, and to jump on such a comment and try to turn it into me criticising him is exactly what annoys people on here i.e. that people in here are seemingly not allowed to make a point about MON if it doesn't sing his praises from the rafters. To repeat - I am not criticising him, I am merely pointing out something that he has not yet done in his career - while also pointing out that I believe he will have no problem in achieving it. BOF.... i'm sorry, but i was referring to Malcolm, not you, perhaps i need to operate this site better....... Of course people are entitled to express their opinion on Martin O'neill and inevitably he is not always going to get it right. The annoyance for me is how Malcolm and his likes seem to be just waiting to say " I told you so " David O'leary this ,that and the other...... "if it had of been last year that ball would have gone in" and so on.......Despite the majority of fans, most of the media and his industry have no time for him..... He still bangs on about him and tries to dig Martin in the ribs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 In 2003, O'Neill was number 5 in the manager of year awards from World Soccer magazine, after Ancelotti, Lippi, Mourhinho and Ferguson. Not rated? It's getting ridiculous now. Who said he's not rated ? Your post is the first post in this thread to use the word 'rated' in any context. It is only people mis-interpreting the posts that have gone before who think this is some kind of MON-bash when nothing could be further from the truth. BOF...... when a person makes a statement to a bunch of people he don't know Like " I HATE THE MANAGER" and the same person has bigged up a manager(David O'LEARY) who is clearly disliked by most........ what in the name of...... are people supposed to think.You to some degree have aided and abetted in sharing his sense of humour which we are not privvy to,so perhaps you have been drawn in to it when perhaps you should not be If he ( Malcolm) is genuine that he is joking in his sarcasm, pehaps he should clear the air and come out and say he is unconditionally behind Martin O'Neill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 But would they a) have come to Villa at this present moment? and do they have a good knowledge of the English game? Did Wenger, Raffa, Mourinho ? I think when Lerner took over he would have been more than able to persuade anyone he wanted I'd agree that O'Neills experience makes him the ideal choice for us in our recent predicament it would have been hard to find one so suited, but there are others who could have done the job and with a proven European record. Mind you as I keep saying I'm sure in time he'll answer all the questions he's so far been a wonder and he's 100% value for money, you have to love him WOW.... we are getting closer to a vote of confidence!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2006 Author Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2006 Yes but the I hate the manager line was explained to all in the fourth post of this topic Malcolm isnt "uncnditionally" behind MON, he has always said he has his reservations. But that isn't to say he doesnt think MON is a good manager, he has stated this on more than one occaision. (read his Everton post match comments for something that resembles gushing praise). See now I have my disagreements with Malcolm over his opinion (see above) but I do think theres a certain amount of Malcolm bashing going on with people actually not reading what he's said beforehand. The "I hate MON" line was obviously ironic to me because I've read most of his articles. I can also see where the confusion would come in with newer / not so active posters, which is why I posted shortly after putting the topic up, to explain it as the first two posts had obviously read the first paragraph and ignored the substantive. The substantive of the article is a very valid opinion which provides some good debating points, its a shame people can't see past the first line and take it literally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Just for the record, I certainly am not alluding to wanting anyone other than MON at the helm !! No.. me too Bof......But where you seem bemused as to why this has dragged on , is because you supported Malcolm in his little game of " I Hate the Manager"by saying "I knew you were joking" OTHER FOLK DID'NT. There may be a few Stalwarts on here, but here are also a few who are not in the inner circle. My point is, we are all clearly discerning Villa Fans with individual views who see the game differently and long be it so,but some comments written by us,not delivered with due care and attention might get us burn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 Yes but the I hate the manager line was explained to all in the fourth post of this topic Malcolm isnt "uncnditionally" behind MON, he has always said he has his reservations. But that isn't to say he doesnt think MON is a good manager, he has stated this on more than one occaision. (read his Everton post match comments for something that resembles gushing praise). See now I have my disagreements with Malcolm over his opinion (see above) but I do think theres a certain amount of Malcolm bashing going on with people actually not reading what he's said beforehand. The "I hate MON" line was obviously ironic to me because I've read most of his articles. I can also see where the confusion would come in with newer / not so active posters, which is why I posted shortly after putting the topic up, to explain it as the first two posts had obviously read the first paragraph and ignored the substantive. The substantive of the article is a very valid opinion which provides some good debating points, its a shame people can't see past the first line and take it literally I accept your comments with sincerity, however my view is this : Malcolm clearly writes some interesting stuff and is more than capable writer, but I am Poles apart with him on the subject of O'Leary and with him on a lot of other things. He seems to write what he really thinks about O'neill in his early paragraphs and then begins to repair the damage by writing to keep himself on side with the readers. His comments on O'neill are nebulous to me, But Perhaps that is Malcolm and i will just have to accept it. ..... I personally have no doubt in my mind that Martin O'neill will Emulate Ron Saunders, I have watched many managers come and go and I have never been so sure of my opinion with regards to a Manager...... I believe we have seen absolutely NOTHING yet he is just keeping the wheels on......... just sit back and enjoy the experience that you have all longed for ...... IT REALLY IS COMING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2006 Author Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2006 I think you are right, I feel similar myselt TRO. Malcolm just isnt getting as carried away as some fans are. He has a different outlook, thats all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfcinwales Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 TRO what do you think of John Cresswell's views on O'Neill ?? If my avatar doesn't spell out my attitude on O'Neill at least if I do say at some future time I told you so then you can always throw that back at me I'd also say that if you had really read my views on O'Leary you would have seen that I was one of the few to criticise him regularly when others where shouting we were certainties for Europe and that in his last season while 'fans' of the club were ranting irrationally I and a few others tried to offer an alternative view that basically put the blame elsewhere without totally excusing O'Leary from blame. Just because it did not agree with your viewpoint which I had no problem with just the way some turned it into a personal battle and the way they expressed their vitriolic opinions, is tough really. As to O'Neill and Lerner I have reservations, which had you really read my comments would be plain to see. When I get proof as at the Everton match I say so, as above I say so, yesterday again I didn't agree with his team choice, his tactics, or his methodology but we didn't lose, and we had plenty of chances That suggests to me he did ok still I'm sure he will do well with us, but European Title, how old is he now Besides and you'll love this, Randy's doing great, some wonderful moves, but he still hasn't spent a penny on transfers though has he, lets see in January shall we Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.S.O.D.F Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 Besides and you'll love this, Randy's doing great, some wonderful moves, but he still hasn't spent a penny on transfers though has he, lets see in January shall we Petrov? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 that in his last season while 'fans' of the club were ranting irrationally I and a few others tried to offer an alternative view that basically put the blame elsewhere without totally excusing O'Leary from blame. So anyone with a differing view to you was "ranting irrationally"? Even though they were right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 No Risso because they weren't ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfcinwales Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 No Risso, Cresswell, Drat, PB, BOF, Rantin and lots of others disagree with me all the time. They don't make it personal, they don't rant and abuse managers or players, well not often, and they read and remember what i've said, some in the hope they can pick me up at a later date, PB, but they never as I remember assume their opinion to be right, neither do I. I've often got it wrong, it just happens I often get it right too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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