Gabby Agbonlahor

[7392craig]

2 hours ago, Dave J said:

Football is all about opinions and I totally respect yours but  crikey do you really believe Gabby has had a better career than Lescott ( villa career aside?)

The point was 'worse players for villa', I've no doubt Lescott has had the better career, but in terms of players pulling on the shirt for us, then no.

[Zatman]

4 hours ago, sne said:

FWIW I think he was at his best playing out wide in a 4-3-3 under MON.

So him being played out of position during the last few seasons is something I can't 100% agree on.

But then again we all see things different.

his best form under MON was playing a lone striker and one of main reasons we were top 3 in 2008/09 season before we gave him a strike partner called Emile

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 hours ago, av1 said:

And yet the Manager made it clear his is not in his plans. What does that tell you about the bloke? Does he love playing football or does he just love the money? and he knows he can't get it anywhere else. 

He will happily stay at home picking up his wages and posting the odd stupid #readyifcalledupon crap online. He is like an ex that just can't get the message. 

The majority of the fans want him gone, the club wants him gone, just bloody go Gabby. 

Please stop pretending to know what people are thinking. As if there is one difinitive scenario or bust. It could also have to do with someone having known nothing but Villa their whole lives and finding it hard to let go. Not everything is a conspiracy theory based on your pre conceived notion of him being a tosser.

You think he genuinely gets joy out of his situation and is just pleased to pick up wages? Absolute hog wash.

I know for a FACT he could currently be in the middle east getting treated like royalty.

The other thing is you would be surprised to see how slim this "majority" is outside of VT.

As i've stated before, you would be stunned to know that for every crass hooligan berating him on social media, there are 2 supporting and showing love!

Edited August 20, 2016 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[skarroki]

3 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Please stop pretending to know what people are thinking. As if there is one difinitive scenario or bust. It could also have to do with someone having known nothing but Villa their whole lives and finding it hard to let go. Not everything is a conspiracy theory based on your pre conceived notion of him being a tosser.

You think he genuinely gets joy out of his situation and is just pleased to pick up wages? Absolute hog wash.

The other thing is you would be surprised to see how slim this "majority" is outside of VT.

As i've stated before, you would be stunned to know thar for every crass hooligan berating him on social media, there are 2 supporting and showing live!

Of course he gets joy out of the situation. If he had any problem with it he'd be match fit, like a professional footballer should be. 

For every supporter at the ground supporting and liking Gabby, there are 20 who will cheer and support no matter what, but will talk about how useless and unfit he's become over the last few seasons. 

If on a rare occasion Gabby comes up in conversation with a football fan, the question that is nearly always asked is "what happened to him". He got complacent, he lost his pace and lost the fans by continually messing up off the field. 

 

This guy should not play for the club again. If we need more strikers on the bench, bring some in, or pick Kozak, Davis, RHM. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

26 minutes ago, skarroki said:

Of course he gets joy out of the situation. If he had any problem with it he'd be match fit, like a professional footballer should be. 

For every supporter at the ground supporting and liking Gabby, there are 20 who will cheer and support no matter what, but will talk about how useless and unfit he's become over the last few seasons. 

If on a rare occasion Gabby comes up in conversation with a football fan, the question that is nearly always asked is "what happened to him". He got complacent, he lost his pace and lost the fans by continually messing up off the field. 

 

This guy should not play for the club again. If we need more strikers on the bench, bring some in, or pick Kozak, Davis, RHM. 

1. See my update/edit on the post.

2. Have you seen what shape he is in now, as well as his workouts. (An inconvenient truth?)

3. I genuinely suspect that a huge reason for his complete shutout (aside from the "performance" issues), even as witnessed with a terrible bench last match is in part due to the boisterous fans on social media. (You really think Green was a better option than Gabby? Come off it - example)

4. Most importantly, until now alot of posters are so trigger happy to shoot down any ounce of positivity towards him - they don't realise I have not even necessarily been championing for him to be involved. (NOT EVEN HIS STAUNCHEST SUPPORTERS EVER DENIED HIS SHORTCOMINGS OR THOUGHT HE WOULD EVER BE A WORLD BEATER) It is the hyper convoluted vitriol, exaggerations and personal abuse I cannot stand. Give credit where it's due ffs. I repeat, Gabriel Agbonlahor has been one of the most influential/important players of the last decade or so. Was a focal point in a team consistenly finishing 6th. Is our record goal scorer, played 50 percent of his games "out of position".

It is no coincidence that in a good team he performed better, in a shite team he performed worse. In this current set up, and with the team we are building he could flourish.

However it is too late for alot of fans.

The lengths people go to,discredit,him are laughable. Bloke who said he was in the worst 50 Villa players went on to compare him to Gary Shaw. Lol

Next we will be comparing Westwood/Tshibola/Jedinak to Ian Taylor or Paul Merson when they have a bad game etc.

Anyway as has been countlessly said, opinions are like...........

At least try to ensure they have some sort of substance.

Edited August 20, 2016 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Mister_a]

14 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

1. See my update/edit on the post.

2. Have you seen what shape he is in now, as well as his workouts. (An inconvenient truth?)

3. I genuinely suspect that a huge reason for his complete shutout (aside from the "performance" issues), even as witnessed with a terrible bench last match is in part due to the boisterous fans on social media. (You really think Green was a better option than Gabby? Come off it - example)

4. Most importantly, until now alot of posters are so trigger happy to shoot down any ounce of positivity towards him - they don't realise I have not even necessarily been championing for him to be involved. (NOT EVEN HIS STAUNCHEST SUPPORTERS EVER DENIED HIS SHORTCOMINGS OR THOUGHT HE WOULD EVER BE A WORLD BEATER) It is the hyper convoluted vitriol, exaggerations and personal abuse I cannot stand. Give credit where it's due ffs. I repeat, Gabriel Agbonlahor has been one of the most influential/important players of the last decade or so. Was a focal point in a team consistenly finishing 6th. Is our record goal scorer, played 50 percent of his games "out of position".

It is no coincidence that in a good team he performed better, in a shite team he performed worse. In this current set up, and with the team we are building he could flourish.

However it is too late for alot of fans.

The lengths people go to,discredit,him are laughable. Bloke who said he was in the worst 50 Villa players went on to compare him to Gary Shaw. Lol

Next we will be comparing Westwood/Tshibola/Jedinak to Ian Taylor or Paul Merson when they have a bad game etc.

Anyway as has been countlessly said, opinions are like...........

At least try to ensure they have some sort of substance.

You are talking about his ability, whilst overlooking his attitude.

It's not his ability that is currently in question (well, mostly...) It's the persistent rumors that he is poison in the dressing room and didn't give a crap about training or the team, until this pre-season, when he suddenly seems to have realised that the wheels are coming off his gravy train.

He's not been shut out because of posts on social media ffs, he has been shut out because last season his attitude visibly stank and he wasn't very good at his job. 

If he had just joined another team and had lost weight and was ready to go then fair enough - I can see another teams fan's saying 'let's give him a clean slate and hope he can turn it around', but there's just too much baggage surrounding him, and my guess is that RDM doesn't want his attitude influencing his new team, and I agree with that decision 100%.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

50 minutes ago, Mister_a said:

You are talking about his ability, whilst overlooking his attitude.

It's not his ability that is currently in question (well, mostly...) It's the persistent rumors that he is poison in the dressing room and didn't give a crap about training or the team, until this pre-season, when he suddenly seems to have realised that the wheels are coming off his gravy train.

He's not been shut out because of posts on social media ffs, he has been shut out because last season his attitude visibly stank and he wasn't very good at his job. 

If he had just joined another team and had lost weight and was ready to go then fair enough - I can see another teams fan's saying 'let's give him a clean slate and hope he can turn it around', but there's just too much baggage surrounding him, and my guess is that RDM doesn't want his attitude influencing his new team, and I agree with that decision 100%.

Fair enough, however I have actually addressed that attitude issue numerous times in the thread, but it keeps going in circles.

I'm not naive enough to think social media would be the only reason for god sake. However just take a look at our current owners activity, interaction and monitoring if it for the answer to why the notion is not so far fetched. People have been fired and/or had careers ruined for much simpler things due to overly zealous or PC people moaning on social media even against the will of the hierarchy.

Some of your points may be true, but what is closest to the truth, is that the actual truth lays closer in the middle of the spectrum than to any particular/extreme side of opinion.

There are however,  certain things i actually might KNOW.

Anyway its 4 in the morning here and ive been at it all day. Lol. You fellas have a great night! Got to get up in a couple hours to watch Bolt hopefully get that relay gold!

Edited August 20, 2016 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[dudevillaisnice]

I'm with the manager and seemingly the club on this, they see him in training more often than all us of here combined and if he isn't in the plans then it's a case of trusting the managers judgement which I do. We can argue about the state of the bench but it's pretty clear we will add to the squad which will only put him down the pecking order (which even now he isn't part of) for his own good he should just leave even it's a loan just to play some games. 

[Dave J]

20 hours ago, 1958Villan said:

I think two things led to Agbonlahor's fall from grace.

To understand the first requires some honesty from fans, in admitting that the only thing Gabby ever had going for him was incredible pace, that he never had anything in his locker that could be described as a footballing skill.

Just before he left, Mr.O'Neil wanted Gabby to beef up, so that he could bully centre backs. Completely foreign to the way Gabby could play and by doing said beefing up, reducing his one advantage, his speed.

The way Mr. Lerner turned Gabby into Mr.Aston Villa, a cheap PR trick, local lad as the face of the club. The thing is Gabby actually believed it, he believed he was bigger than the club, simply because successive managers weren't allowed to drop him and he was allowed to set bad examples when he didn't like the training regimes. 

Now Gabby has had a kick up his over large backside and at the age when he should be in the middle of his peak years, he finds himself unwanted by the club. Once Gabby realises that he really has no way back at this club and that if he wants some kind of footballing career, he has to be prepared to get really fit and drop down the leagues, the better for him and everyone else.

Here here!

[HeyAnty]

2 hours ago, dudevillaisnice said:

I'm with the manager and seemingly the club on this, they see him in training more often than all us of here combined and if he isn't in the plans then it's a case of trusting the managers judgement which I do. We can argue about the state of the bench but it's pretty clear we will add to the squad which will only put him down the pecking order (which even now he isn't part of) for his own good he should just leave even it's a loan just to play some games. 

I havent seen him training pre season but what i did see was pictures of him sitting at an airport flying ou to fat camp in the middle of the worst ever season in Villas history when we needed him most.  For that alone, he can rot.

[tinker]

Just hope he's fit when we play sha, they love him down there lol

[mottaloo]

"Face of the club" 

Not literally, I hope !!

Edited August 20, 2016 by mottaloo
Spelling error

[TRO]

15 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

Just shows how people can see the game differently as I go back around 35 years and Gabby wouldn't make the top 50 worst players I have seen in that time. He has let himself and us down badly over the last few seasons, last year he was a disgrace, but that can't wipe out what he has done especially the 4 seasons under O'Neill when he was more than decent. He was picked week in week out for a team that finished sixth three times on the spin and more than held his own in it.

Huge let down in recent years most definitely. One of the worst players of the last 40 years sorry I am not having it. Not even close. 

Mark I see both your points of view.....me, somewhere in between.

I have enjoyed Gabby's goals no doubt, but never been a fan of his overall craft.....Its one of them, you either like his play or Loathe it......I prefer to say that I don't rate him as a finished/complete forward.

I have never quite got my head around the Loyalty that he has shown to the club in terms of never wanting to go anywhere else ..... the cynic in me tells me its the comfort zone that attracts him and that any player with ambition/ability during the Lerner reign particularly...However the salary v His goals return, I would say he has been the main beneficiary in recent times.

I would never dismiss your opinion, because there are so many things you say, that I agree with in full......Dave J falls in to a similar category for me.....so its strange in my eyes that you are both at odds with each other on this one.

[TRO]

8 hours ago, dudevillaisnice said:

I'm with the manager and seemingly the club on this, they see him in training more often than all us of here combined and if he isn't in the plans then it's a case of trusting the managers judgement which I do. We can argue about the state of the bench but it's pretty clear we will add to the squad which will only put him down the pecking order (which even now he isn't part of) for his own good he should just leave even it's a loan just to play some games. 

I agree, I too back the managers judgment on this.

Gabby was at one time much better( in terms of goalscoring) than he is now and it depends on what moment we want to comment on.

I guess Lerner WAS an acceptable owner at one stage, before he turned in to the dismissive character he did, so any view depends on which one you want to comment on.

[markavfc40]

47 minutes ago, TRO said:

I would never dismiss your opinion, because there are so many things you say, that I agree with in full......Dave J falls in to a similar category for me.....so its strange in my eyes that you are both at odds with each other on this one.

I don't have a problem with Dave not rating Gabby. Plenty of Villa fans don't. But one of the worst players he has seen in our shirt in last 40 years I just can't get my head around. Even off the top of my head over the last 25 odd years if you just look at forwards/wide forwards this mob were worse than Gabby in a Villa shirt.

Cascarino, Penrice, Heath, McAvenie, Callaghan, Franz Carr, Whittingham, Fashanu, Lampty, Luke Moor, Stefan Moore, Balaban, Kachloul, Carlton Cole, Baros, Harewood, Delfouneso, Bowery, Holt.

That is without even trying and not even looking at other positions.

Last handful of years in the main he has been poor aside from a spell under Sherwood and a couple of spells under Lambert. Last season he was diabolical.

I think even his staunchest critic though would have to acknowledge under O'Neill he held his own in that side that achieved sixth three times on the spin and scored a number of goals for us many of them in big games. Alongside Carew and Ash Young that forward line was a handful for any team on its day.

You could almost split his time here into two halves. The last few years have overall been poor, especially last season, the first half of his time here he did well. He is done here for me. No doubt about that but when he leaves and I look back on his time here I'll look at the good and the bad and when looking at that I find it impossible to see how anyone could say he is one of the worst players they have seen in 40 years as he isn't even close.

Edited August 20, 2016 by markavfc40

[Dodgyknees]

I used to love Gabby. I remember him skinning players and running down the flank, or even getting on the end of through balls. More recently he doesn't try and take players on, he doesn't try for those through balls. He spends time waiting for the ball to be fed to him outside the box and then doesn't move again, so he can be marked out of a game easily. That's why he struggles to touch the ball.

He didn't adapt his game, he got lazy, he thought he was always going to be first choice. It's such a shame because he could have been so much more. I don't celebrate his downfall, it makes me sad.

[1958Villan]

I agree with the sentiments of DK82, with some work, admittedly hard work, Gabby could have become a 25 to 30 goals a season, first name on the team sheet for club and country, striker.

I think that the biggest flaw in Gabby's makeup has been his aversion to hard work. Such a pity that he has not listened to the 'right' people throughout his career.

When I look back on Gabby's career, pity is what I will feel. 'Pity and a feeling of what might have been.' 

[Dr_Pangloss]

15 minutes ago, 1958Villan said:

I agree with the sentiments of DK82, with some work, admittedly hard work, Gabby could have become a 25 to 30 goals a season, first name on the team sheet for club and country, striker.

I think that the biggest flaw in Gabby's makeup has been his aversion to hard work. Such a pity that he has not listened to the 'right' people throughout his career.

When I look back on Gabby's career, pity is what I will feel. 'Pity and a feeling of what might have been.' 

Surely this is a fantastic bit of sarcasm?

Gabby's 'ability' means he'd never score that amount of goals. No football brain, shite first touch and no composure in front of goal, he's at best an average player at worst a total sack of shit.  

Gabby has always been an athlete impersonating a footballer and no amount of 'hard work' could have ever made him a 25-30 goal a season forward.

[abdomlahor]

Gabby was never going to be a 25 goal per season striker. Even in his heyday, did anyone ever trust him when he had to think in front of goal, rather than rely on his instincts? He just never had the ability. 

However, I fondly remember when we went on that great run on away form and set a club record for consecutive away wins with him leading the line in a 4-5-1, and he was just perfect for that role. I don't think he suited any of the systems we've used ever since MON left, which isn't really a fault of his own.

I wonder how he would've turned out if MON was still here. 

[Dave J]

2 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

I don't have a problem with Dave not rating Gabby. Plenty of Villa fans don't. But one of the worst players he has seen in our shirt in last 40 years I just can't get my head around. Even off the top of my head over the last 25 odd years if you just look at forwards/wide forwards this mob were worse than Gabby in a Villa shirt.

Cascarino, Penrice, Heath, McAvenie, Callaghan, Franz Carr, Whittingham, Fashanu, Lampty, Luke Moor, Stefan Moore, Balaban, Kachloul, Carlton Cole, Baros, Harewood, Delfouneso, Bowery, Holt.

That is without even trying and not even looking at other positions.

Last handful of years in the main he has been poor aside from a spell under Sherwood and a couple of spells under Lambert. Last season he was diabolical.

I think even his staunchest critic though would have to acknowledge under O'Neill he held his own in that side that achieved sixth three times on the spin and scored a number of goals for us many of them in big games. Alongside Carew and Ash Young that forward line was a handful for any team on its day.

You could almost split his time here into two halves. The last few years have overall been poor, especially last season, the first half of his time here he did well. He is done here for me. No doubt about that but when he leaves and I look back on his time here I'll look at the good and the bad and when looking at that I find it impossible to see how anyone could say he is one of the worst players they have seen in 40 years as he isn't even close.

Yep- happy to agree that this lot are also amongst some of the worst players I have seen in a villa shirt. Not sure it's reasonable to include Balaban as we never really saw him play did we? I would also say that in my opinion Luke Moore was a more naturally gifted footballer than Gabby could ever dream of becoming- his problem was that he did not put in the hard yards- otherwise we might just have had a striker on our hands!