Zatman Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 England is the least racist country in Europe. Are you Dave Richards? bizarre statement to make as no barometer for this sort of thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted March 20, 2012 Moderator Share Posted March 20, 2012 Whatever about England being the least racist country in Europe; it may or may not be; but I think the salient point is that certainly within sport England is far less racist than Russia. I would also say it's a fair enough statement that racism is rife within Russian football. That doesn't mean 'the majority' as Zatman would incorrectly infer. It just means that it happens a lot and openly. Just ask Peter Odemwingie about the differences between playing in his current league and in his previous one. Trent is also right that the 'abuse' of Rio & Anton by fans is not because of their colour but more to do with the fans taking their own players' side in a dispute. It is club loyalty and nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Lol. Russia I can live with. Qatar I cannot.I can't live with either. Neither Russia nor Qatar are fit to host a World Cup. Russia at least have a footballing pedigree. They have played at numerous World Cups and Euros. Qatar have never qualified for the World Cup.So? Racism is a big problem in Russian football. Is this the kind of country we want hosting a World Cup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 20, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted March 20, 2012 Poland and Ukraine would be very similar fanwise to Russia and racism happens often there but no threads on VT about it. What on earth are you on about? You said up there If Samba was racially abused in Mexico or China this topic wouldnt have started but now you're pointing out that there isn't a thread about 2 countries that Samba HASN'T been racially abused in? What point are you trying to make? This is a thread about a specific incident, which has evolved into a more general discussion about the country in which the incident took place. If the incident had taken place in Poland or Ukraine, then we would probably be having a similar discussion about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 I would also say it's a fair enough statement that racism is rife within Russian football. That doesn't mean 'the majority' as Zatman would incorrectly infer. It just means that it happens a lot and openly if that was original comment i would have agreed but comment was "racism is rife in Russia" but now you're pointing out that there isn't a thread about 2 countries that Samba HASN'T been racially abused in? What point are you trying to make? I picked 2 random countries e.g MExico and China and then you said Mexico and China haven't won a world cup bid and don't have a long running history of racist incidents in football (as far as I know) If they had, and they had been given a world cup recently, then there WOULD be similar comments about them getting a world cup, whether England had lost out to them or not. which i replied Poland and Ukraine(hosts in summer) have a similar racist culture in football though never threads on players being abused there. Happens all the times in these countries Samuel Inkoom is an example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 which i replied Poland and Ukraine(hosts in summer) have a similar racist culture in football though never threads on players being abused there. Happens all the times in these countries Samuel Inkoom is an exampleHave you not considered that the reason why this thread was made is because Samba was an established Premier League player until very recently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 20, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted March 20, 2012 I would also say it's a fair enough statement that racism is rife within Russian football. That doesn't mean 'the majority' as Zatman would incorrectly infer. It just means that it happens a lot and openly if that was original comment i would have agreed but comment was "racism is rife in Russia" but now you're pointing out that there isn't a thread about 2 countries that Samba HASN'T been racially abused in? What point are you trying to make? I picked 2 random countries e.g MExico and China and then you said Mexico and China haven't won a world cup bid and don't have a long running history of racist incidents in football (as far as I know) If they had, and they had been given a world cup recently, then there WOULD be similar comments about them getting a world cup, whether England had lost out to them or not. which i replied Poland and Ukraine(hosts in summer) have a similar racist culture in football though never threads on players being abused there. Happens all the times in these countries Samuel Inkoom is an example Forget it. I'll remember not to get in the way of you and an anti-England rant again. It's boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 if you read properly it wasnt an anti-English rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 If the incident had taken place in Poland or Ukraine, then we would probably be having a similar discussion about that. There will be lots of these discussions in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theunderstudy Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Well fine, branching out to other countries that England "didn't lose the World Cup to". Off the top of my head. Italy. Mario Balotelli, adopted Italian, racially abused due to his skin colour. Spain. Lewis Hamilton being racially abused by Spanish F1 fans, as well as the infamous Spain vs. England game. Portugal. Balotelli and Toure "allegedly" racially abused by Porto fans. Russia. Odemwingie racially abused by his OWN fans. Et cetera. Loads more that I could think of if I tried hard enough. To claim there's a bit of a race problem in Russia is hardly English bitterness, it's plain as day. And I say that as a Scot, so don't try and convince me it is English bitterness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS-T Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Lol. Russia I can live with. Qatar I cannot.I can't live with either. Neither Russia nor Qatar are fit to host a World Cup. Russia at least have a footballing pedigree. They have played at numerous World Cups and Euros. Qatar have never qualified for the World Cup.So? Racism is a big problem in Russian football. Is this the kind of country we want hosting a World Cup? Spain and Italy have racism problems as well. Would you be against them hosting the World Cup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted March 21, 2012 Moderator Share Posted March 21, 2012 I think the key difference between Spain/Italy and Russia is that Spain and Italy are actually embarrassed about the racism in their sport/country whereas Russia isn't. It is generally accepted by the people in Russia. In fact didn't a prominent Russian FA rep. try and claim that bananas were actually a compliment in Russia when confronted with the Odemwingie banner. That kind of bare-faced lying is the difference. At least the others are trying, however sparingly, to change the situation. And a country trying to change should be encouraged to do so. Countries that aren't trying, shouldn't be rewarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 21, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted March 21, 2012 Wot BOF said. I believe that the majority of people in Russia actually ARE racist - in the way that the majority of people in England used to be, probably as recently as the 1950s. Doesn't mean they are all tooled-up neo-nazi skinheads wandering around with a view to GBH and/or murder - although they are plenty of those as well (see my quote from the Moscow student upthread) - but I'm quite sure that they consider non-whites to be "inferior", and see nothing wrong with what they probably think is "harmless banter". It's not really surprising, given that they have never had the waves of immigration that we (post-colonial) countries in the west have. Like BOF says, the authorities in Spain, Portugal, etc. KNOW they are out of order; I honestly believe that the Russians don't think they are - they just think that have to put up with silly political correctness, which annoys them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voinjama Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Wot BOF said. I believe that the majority of people in Russia actually ARE racist - in the way that the majority of people in England used to be, probably as recently as the 1950s. Doesn't mean they are all tooled-up neo-nazi skinheads wandering around with a view to GBH and/or murder - although they are plenty of those as well (see my quote from the Moscow student upthread) - but I'm quite sure that they consider non-whites to be "inferior", and see nothing wrong with what they probably think is "harmless banter". It's not really surprising, given that they have never had the waves of immigration that we (post-colonial) countries in the west have. Like BOF says, the authorities in Spain, Portugal, etc. KNOW they are out of order; I honestly believe that the Russians don't think they are - they just think that have to put up with silly political correctness, which annoys them. Can I ask, have you lived or spent a lot of time in Russia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I believe that the majority of people in Russia actually ARE racist. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS-T Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 England is the least racist country in Europe. Are you Dave Richards? bizarre statement to make as no barometer for this sort of thing In England multiculturalism and racial diversity is embraced and celebrated and encourages. In England a lot of people try very hard not be racist or to offend other people's cultures. Spme people even think it has gone too far and the political-correctness has taken over. This doesn't happen in other countries in Europe. France probably is as multi-cultural as England and even they have banned the burka. That would never happen in England for fear of offending Muslims. Some people are even excused from the law for example Sikhs are allowed to carry knives and ride a motorcycle without a helmet. All these reasons lead me to believe that England is the least racist country in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 21, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted March 21, 2012 Wot BOF said. I believe that the majority of people in Russia actually ARE racist - in the way that the majority of people in England used to be, probably as recently as the 1950s. Doesn't mean they are all tooled-up neo-nazi skinheads wandering around with a view to GBH and/or murder - although they are plenty of those as well (see my quote from the Moscow student upthread) - but I'm quite sure that they consider non-whites to be "inferior", and see nothing wrong with what they probably think is "harmless banter". It's not really surprising, given that they have never had the waves of immigration that we (post-colonial) countries in the west have. Like BOF says, the authorities in Spain, Portugal, etc. KNOW they are out of order; I honestly believe that the Russians don't think they are - they just think that have to put up with silly political correctness, which annoys them. Can I ask, have you lived or spent a lot of time in Russia?Nope. It's just an educated guess, and I'd be happy to be proved wrong. I do know a few Russians, Poles and Bulgarians, and I've lived a long time here and seen how things have changed in way they don't seem to have in eastern Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theunderstudy Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I think the key difference between Spain/Italy and Russia is that Spain and Italy are actually embarrassed about the racism in their sport/country whereas Russia isn't. It is generally accepted by the people in Russia. In fact didn't a prominent Russian FA rep. try and claim that bananas were actually a compliment in Russia when confronted with the Odemwingie banner. That kind of bare-faced lying is the difference. At least the others are trying, however sparingly, to change the situation. And a country trying to change should be encouraged to do so. Countries that aren't trying, shouldn't be rewarded. True enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Giving the World Cup to Russia was such a stupid idea. Racism is rife in Russia, everyone knows that. Increasing social unrest too, with Putin asserting his control more now....I predict more empty seats then there were in SA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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