macandally Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Put simply, not good enough. Why?? Why is it that you are so certain that what is currently happening is NOT good enough. I have been a villa fan for 20 years. I am yet to see anything that suggests we should be immune to whats happening which indeed is something that has happened to almost every team in the whole of english football since Ive been a fan I find it amusing that you want me to justify to you reasons why I think a protest is necessary. I would suggest that you are better served trying to justify to those who will protest why you think they shouldnt. Frankly, I think you are fighting a losing battle as the facts, the results an the performances are against you. We are sinking and trying to hide that fact no matter what the circumstances is folly. We should not be where we are and find ourselves there not because of a lack of investment (20 million pound spent by McLeish) but because of a complete lack of managerial competence. Go compare there to as many countries as you want, but I would rather back those that take a stance for what they believe in, than those who are afraid to stick their head above the parapet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Put simply, not good enough. Why?? Why is it that you are so certain that what is currently happening is NOT good enough. I have been a villa fan for 20 years. I am yet to see anything that suggests we should be immune to whats happening which indeed is something that has happened to almost every team in the whole of english football since Ive been a fan I find it amusing that you want me to justify to you reasons why I think a protest is necessary. I would suggest that you are better served trying to justify to those who will protest why you think they shouldnt. Frankly, I think you are fighting a losing battle as the facts, the results an the performances are against you. We are sinking and trying to hide that fact no matter what the circumstances is folly. We should not be where we are and find ourselves there not because of a lack of investment (20 million pound spent by McLeish) but because of a complete lack of managerial competence. Go compare there to as many countries as you want, but I would rather back those that take a stance for what they believe in, than those who are afraid to stick their head above the parapet. You dont seem to be able to answer the question. Why should we not be where we find ourselves? You dont need to convince me of the possibility that we are sinking. I am well aware its a possibility (as much as being a decent side again tbh). What I am also aware of is that its all 'part of the game' and this is what I am trying to put across to you - there is no reason to protest. Lets say we go down. Of course I would be upset and dissapointed but I wouldnt go and protest because somebody has to go down. And we have shown nothing - absolutely nothing in 20, 30, 40 - 100 years to suggest we shouldnt have to endure it at some stage. I find it madness that people would be football fans and be uncapable of actually enduring half of what football is about. I would actually just be patient Macandally because the last 2 decades have shown were likely to replace the manager who doesn't win anything with a manager who doesn't win anything. And why? Because we dont fall into the elite group of clubs who either dominate english football (and have done for decades) or have a stupid amount of wealth - And bar the odd millosecond (in the grand scheme of it), we haven' t fallen into that elite group for nearly 120 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Lions_Roar Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Mantis, can you honestly say that Mcliesh's previous role has not (at the very least) sped up embarrasing shite like this. Really, those protesting - fill ya boots. Go and make an arse of yourselves. Because no one with half a brain has a clue what on earth your protesting about. If its because your unhappy with whats happening at AVFC then football is NOT the sport for you - neither is any competitve sport foir that matter. Of course his previous role has contributed BUT not necessarily the fact that it was at SHA. It is more that he has served up the same crap in his previous role. He has proven that he cannot manage at this level before he came here and he continues to prove this so well! If you, as a supposed Villa fan that posts regularly on here, don't have a clue why people are protesting then I think it is probably you that has half or brain. You could disagree and that is your right but to say that you don't understand why people are protesting suggests that you do not bother to read anybody else's posts. Wel ive got a few ideas why people want to protest but there just silly reasons. A manager who the fans don't like? - yep, thats part of football. A manager who is not performing very well? - yep thats part of football A team thats not performing very well? - yep thats part of football A club cutting costs? - yep thats part of football All these things are part of the game. Like always, many teams are currently suffering from them. OTherwise English football wouldnt be a competitive environment. Nobody wants to be suffering from them, everyone always wants better but its certainly not a god given right for AVFC to be immune from it. For me, the protestors will be just people who cant take the downs of football. I'm sorry but when did you decide who the fans like and dislike? I actually like AM as a person despite being against his appointment. Given what hes had to do I think he's performing ok. Yes it's not good enough but has the season finished? A team not performing? Maybe you should listen to givens interview, are you protesting against the team? Club cutting costs? I thought The country was in recession? They're doing what most businesses are doing! I think you have miss understood my post Upon reading again I think I have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The protests are misguided because McLeish is one of the symptoms of the disease, not the disease itself. Until Lerner sells up, we're going to continue to suffer, whoever the manager is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coda Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I can't believe the coverage this is getting. Some cretin starts a McLeish out website which he has to change due to Villa fans slagging the idea off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted February 12, 2012 Moderator Share Posted February 12, 2012 The protests are misguided because McLeish is one of the symptoms of the disease, not the disease itself. Until Lerner sells up, we're going to continue to suffer, whoever the manager is. Sad but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Put simply, not good enough. Why?? Why is it that you are so certain that what is currently happening is NOT good enough. I have been a villa fan for 20 years. I am yet to see anything that suggests we should be immune to whats happening which indeed is something that has happened to almost every team in the whole of english football since Ive been a fan I find it amusing that you want me to justify to you reasons why I think a protest is necessary. I would suggest that you are better served trying to justify to those who will protest why you think they shouldnt. Frankly, I think you are fighting a losing battle as the facts, the results an the performances are against you. We are sinking and trying to hide that fact no matter what the circumstances is folly. We should not be where we are and find ourselves there not because of a lack of investment (20 million pound spent by McLeish) but because of a complete lack of managerial competence. Go compare there to as many countries as you want, but I would rather back those that take a stance for what they believe in, than those who are afraid to stick their head above the parapet. You dont seem to be able to answer the question. Why should we not be where we find ourselves? You dont need to convince me of the possibility that we are sinking. I am well aware its a possibility (as much as being a decent side again tbh). What I am also aware of is that its all 'part of the game' and this is what I am trying to put across to you - there is no reason to protest. Lets say we go down. Of course I would be upset and dissapointed but I wouldnt go and protest because somebody has to go down. And we have shown nothing - absolutely nothing in 20, 30, 40 - 100 years to suggest we shouldnt have to endure it at some stage. I find it madness that people would be football fans and be uncapable of actually enduring half of what football is about. I would actually just be patient Macandally because the last 2 decades have shown were likely to replace the manager who doesn't win anything with a manager who doesn't win anything. And why? Because we dont fall into the elite group of clubs who either dominate english football (and have done for decades) or have a stupid amount of wealth - And bar the odd millosecond (in the grand scheme of it), we haven' t fallen into that elite group for nearly 120 years. I have endured us being relegated and I remember with glee running round the streets when we won both the league and the European cup. Taking the rough with the smooth is part and parcel of life not just football. What I will say though is that some people refuse to take second best. The protest is not because we are suffering something others or not, it is because we do not believe the current managerial staff are competent to run the club. We have gone through two decades of poor ownership (no matter what Doug would argue), but continuing to repeat your own mistakes is insanity. We have good coaching staff at our club and the frequent managerial changes has not helped us, but, if it is broke, fix it. We are currently broke and McLeish shows no ability to repair us. Its time to have a shift change within the club, a different philosophy on how we play and that requires a progressive and innovative coach. Not a dinosaur whose philosophy is way out of date for the way football is going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Its time to have a shift change within the club, a different philosophy on how we play and that requires a progressive and innovative coach. Not a dinosaur whose philosophy is way out of date for the way football is going. I agree with that 10000000000000%, however I still don't think a protest is valid so I don't think it will influence this debate. While I would never support a protest I would be more inclined to understand one if I had any ounce of belief that people will go about it in a respectful manner. My prediction is that the vast majority will just turn up and hurl abuse at Mcliesh & lerner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulver Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Just out of interest. Can all those in favour of the protest and who will be attending it today list their names here for future reference please ? And if anyone can take some photos of the gathering (ahem) and post em later for those of us unable to see it it'd be much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 2. The reputation of Villa fans - we are already seen as fickle and this will not help our cause. This is already being discussed in the national media. Think about how the reputation of Blackburn fans has suffered; we don't have half as much to moan about as they do! Whether you like it or not (or even care) this will reflect badly on Aston Villa's fans. It will be a repeat of the summer fallout where our fans were made to look a national laughing stock. So if you want to protest tomorrow, just reflect on whether where we are as a club and the potential impact on our reputation is worth it. Supporting a club should be a selfless taks, are you really thinking about the club or yourself? I would never deny the right to free speech, but I am very much anti the protests and what they might mean for our club and will have no problem telling that to any protesters I see tomorrow A very articulate argument - and a commendable one. However, at this point how we as supporters are perceived is largely immaterial. The Club is already a laughing stock, let alone the fans, and has been since the calamitous bungling of the selection process that led to the appointment of McLeish. Every key decision that Lerner and Faulkner have made in the last year has succeeded only in rendering the Club an irrelevance to the English game. Villa are not taken seriously on a national level and won't be for as long as the current regime remains in place. I have no doubt that McLeish is only a symptom of the cancerous ineptitude running throughout the Club, but seeing as there are no signs of Lerner selling up any time soon, the best supporters can hope for is a better man in charge of first team affairs. Newcastle fans ousted Sam Allardyce and Liverpool fans hunted Roy Hodgson down like a dog until matters came to a head in less time than McLeish has already had, with superior track records, less baggage and a less pitiful performance on the pitch to justify such rancour. Whether an organised protest on a match day is the right course of action is debatable, but the fact is when the Club turned around and very publicly told every supporter dead-set against McLeish's appointment to go away and **** themselves, this kind of circus was always going to be inevitable and will continue for as long as he remains in place. The Club have only themselves to blame for causing this division, McLeish should've known better than to take the job and everyone concerned needs to stop burying their heads in the sand and accept that change must happen one way or another. And frankly, with the level of deplorable behaviour currently rife in the national game, the expression of discontent on the part of our supporters will barely register as a blip on the radar, and will be long since forgotten once a better manager is in place. Football coverage in this country is dictated by Sky who love to paint the rosy image of the Premier League being the best in the world because it fuels their coffers. If Villa appoint a manager that can take them back toward the top six and playing superior football, they'll be all over us and as keen to sweep any unpleasantness associated with McLeish's removal under the rug as anyone. Just look at the way we are suddenly presented with the picture of unity at St. James Park - the Geordies have always hated Mike Ashley and were as unimpressed by the appointment of Pardew as they were with Allardyce. Now it's one big happy family that the media can't get enough of. All football fans are tribal and all are as reactionary as the next. If a protest goes ahead today, it may not look good but if it's not today, it will happen another day and keep happening. There is good reason for the dissatisfaction and frustration that supporters feel and I hope this does not get lost in any furore caused by events coming to a head. As such, I would only advise that supporters keep things vocal but respectful - and above all, make sure that the Sky cameras are aware that it is McLeish's style of football, outdated methods, appalling track record and NOT his past association with Blues that is why he is, and always was, unwanted here. Because this is the message that isn't getting across whenever the subject is discussed - and I blame the local media for this as much as the national press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amo69 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Although I cant blame people for being upset and venting their anger I cant really see the point of these protests. We know AM is not going to be replaced and if anything we need to be getting behind the team to avoid relegation. Protests are going to have a negative effect IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Is anything actually happening outside the ground??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejoker Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Is anything actually happening outside the ground??? Someone posted a picture on Twitter showing about 20/30 people holding a few signs...not worthy of making the headlines, put it like that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 How's the protest going ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Is anything actually happening outside the ground??? Someone posted a picture on Twitter showing about 20/30 people holding a few signs...not worthy of making the headlines, put it like that! The shame..... :oops: :oops: :oops: (cheers for the update!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Protests or not Mcleish is on borrowed time if we keep serving up this tripe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejoker Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Randy is never at VP to watch it, so I don't suppose he's bothered if its tripe or not, as long as we stay up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Randy is never at VP to watch it, so I don't suppose he's bothered if its tripe or not, as long as we stay up Yes but Randy never being at VP is part of the reason that I beleive the current set up won't go on very much longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 So how did this little get together go? Was it the storming of the winter palace? or was it just Only One and NDINLT getting together to meet each others immediate family members? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 im still suprised why we didnt try and get roy hodgson, hes a good manager i think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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