TheDrums Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Every people have the right to self determination. The Scottish people like the English. Irish and Welsh are being taxed weekly out of their hard earned money to prop up the British royal family. Enough is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted January 13, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2012 Every people have the right to self determination. The Scottish people like the English. Irish and Welsh are being taxed weekly out of their hard earned money to prop up the British royal family. Enough is enough.Where do you draw the line, though? Cornwall? Yorkshire? What is a "people"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted January 13, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2012 I hereby announce the Brummie National Party. We demand self determination, and claim sole right over the use of the term gambol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Every people have the right to self determination. The Scottish people like the English. Irish and Welsh are being taxed weekly out of their hard earned money to prop up the British royal family. Enough is enough.Where do you draw the line, though? Cornwall? Yorkshire? What is a "people"? Didnt you know that everybody in Edinburgh has much more in common with people from Inverness than people from Newcastle, despite Inverness being much further away and with significantly worse transport links? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDrums Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Every people have the right to self determination. The Scottish people like the English. Irish and Welsh are being taxed weekly out of their hard earned money to prop up the British royal family. Enough is enough.Where do you draw the line, though? Cornwall? Yorkshire? What is a "people"? Well, that brings up the whole debate about nationalism. The fact is though people are connected for whatever social / historical reason to "them" and "us". Its alive today in football, every sport and every walk of life. No god created the country borders around the world, it was human beings themselves. It has always been based on historical, cultural and long term standing traditions in that part of the world. Like the Vikings, Romans etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 It also kinda undermines your initial declaration about the royal family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDrums Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 It also kinda undermines your initial declaration about the royal family. If you are going to say that then at least say why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Get rid of the Royals and create a federal republic, I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mockingbird_franklin Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I hope Scotland doesn't become Independent of the rest of the UK, An Awful lot has been contributed to the UK from north of the boarder, and being part of the UK has provided benefits for Scotland, both Countries have benefited and contributed through our Union. But It's for the Scots to decide how they want to move forward, I just hope any decision is based on reasoned and objective arguments and not anti English sentiment stoked by personnel ambition, admittedly England's sometimes patronising, dismissive and often antagonising (especially historically) attitude to the other 3 areas of the UK hasn't helped to prevent this development. If Scotland chooses to go it alone I can understand why even if I think it might be the wrong choice, but good luck to them if they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 It also kinda undermines your initial declaration about the royal family. If you are going to say that then at least say why. I spent ages typing out what I meant and on reading it back it doesnt make much sense. Point conceded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted January 13, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2012 Balkanisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted January 13, 2012 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2012 Hold on, the Royal Family, they go there all the time. Can Scotland be persuaded to take them as part of the deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAFC2000 Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 The whole agenda behind this and it really is an Agenda with a capital A, its not whats best for England, Scotland or the UK but whats best for the Tories. Scotland being Independent would suit the Tories very nicely in deed. Yes indeed the captain of Spin Scameron is at it again. Scameron Failed to gain a majority in 2010 despite:- - 13 years of Labour who were well worn come the end - 80% media backing - financial backing - Iraq war - Recession. As a result the only way Scameron stands a chance of getting in next time around will be to bend the rules, which he had already done through the boundary reforms and now hence whole Scotland fiasco. You See the Tories are quite rightly hated in Scotland as they also are in Wales. But If Scotland do go there own way then so will a 40 seats from Labour. This will give the Tories an overwhelmingly increased percentage chance of staying in power for a very long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidlewis Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Absolutely ridiculous post. So I take it Cameron has as come out in favour of independence then and generally not bothered at all about it? Perhaps I missed a Drat01 post in here but I dont think even he spun it like that. In fact with the potential cost to the English to get independence sorted it could have massive damaging implications for his "rich cronies" so I wouldn't say it's overly in his interests considering he may end up with a lot less support even with less seats to win. Plus didn't labour lose a lOt of ground to snp in Scotland in the last election? I wouldn't be surprised if they lose seats to them anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 The whole agenda behind this and it really is an Agenda with a capital A, its not whats best for England, Scotland or the UK but whats best for the Tories. Scotland being Independent would suit the Tories very nicely in deed. Yes indeed the captain of Spin Scameron is at it again. Scameron Failed to gain a majority in 2010 despite:- - 13 years of Labour who were well worn come the end - 80% media backing - financial backing - Iraq war - Recession. As a result the only way Scameron stands a chance of getting in next time around will be to bend the rules, which he had already done through the boundary reforms and now hence whole Scotland fiasco. You See the Tories are quite rightly hated in Scotland as they also are in Wales. But If Scotland do go there own way then so will a 40 seats from Labour. This will give the Tories an overwhelmingly increased percentage chance of staying in power for a very long time. Er, one of the core’s values is the union. Its actually called (iirc)The Conservative & Unionist Party. To be honest the one with the main agenda (obviously) is Alex Salmond. He wants to have a vote, when it suits him and then what are the terms of that vote. He knows that if it were done tomorrow he wouldn’t win. He’s hoping for the perfect time, with the perfect conditions, and a time when all those nasty little issues might disappear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidlewis Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Exactly Paulo He wants his own commission which should be banned from the start. If it effects the whole union then the existing commission needs to decide. It's like asking for a divorce and you want to say when, which lawyers we both use and all the conditions of that divorce. No one would allow that. Let the Scottish people vote on it, but no way should EVERYTHING be decided by Scotland. Utterly ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDrums Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Commissions are an absolute waste of public money. Why spend hundreds of thousands on 5-6 people coming to a judgement when the truth is out there if parties accept the facts, which are out there already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAFC2000 Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 The whole agenda behind this and it really is an Agenda with a capital A, its not whats best for England, Scotland or the UK but whats best for the Tories. Scotland being Independent would suit the Tories very nicely in deed. Yes indeed the captain of Spin Scameron is at it again. Scameron Failed to gain a majority in 2010 despite:- - 13 years of Labour who were well worn come the end - 80% media backing - financial backing - Iraq war - Recession. As a result the only way Scameron stands a chance of getting in next time around will be to bend the rules, which he had already done through the boundary reforms and now hence whole Scotland fiasco. You See the Tories are quite rightly hated in Scotland as they also are in Wales. But If Scotland do go there own way then so will a 40 seats from Labour. This will give the Tories an overwhelmingly increased percentage chance of staying in power for a very long time. Er, one of the core’s values is the union. Its actually called (iirc)The Conservative & Unionist Party. To be honest the one with the main agenda (obviously) is Alex Salmond. He wants to have a vote, when it suits him and then what are the terms of that vote. He knows that if it were done tomorrow he wouldn’t win. He’s hoping for the perfect time, with the perfect conditions, and a time when all those nasty little issues might disappear. So are you saying Scameron would not Bennifit from Labour potentially loosing a predicted 40 seats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted January 14, 2012 Moderator Share Posted January 14, 2012 So are you saying Scameron would not Bennifit from Labour potentially loosing a predicted 40 seats? Did you know that there has never been a Labour Government elected that has ever relied on Scottish seats? It is true however that this government wouldn't have needed the Liberals if the Scottish seats were removed from the equation but that in itself is an extreme rarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidlewis Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 It would also benefit avfc if blues and west brom moved their clubs away from Birmingham. Doesn't mean villa fans want it to happen . Mainly because there are a lot of positives to Not splitting or moving away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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