Trinity-Tom Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Get rid. There are managers out there who can do no worse. Financial constraints have not helped DOL and with investment I think he would get success BUT financial investment is not something we will get so we need a different kind of manager. Someone like Jewell, O'Neill etc... who can get the best out of the players they have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derryvillan Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Out as soon as is practical Is now practical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethRobinson Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 people who say now is not the right time do not accept that there will ever be a right time. ........how is that different to you saying; Out as soon as is practical If it is not practical to sack him now then you must surely be saying that 'now is not the right time' :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahamaad Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Of course. Look at the wonders Peter Reid achieved , plus he has most of that team aswell. We'd easily gets 4th place with him in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Of course. Look at the wonders Peter Reid achieved , plus he has most of that team aswell. We'd easily gets 4th place with him in charge. Thanks for that, adds to the whole debate. Practical - IMO he is not the right manager for the club, never will be. He has to go whether that is today, tomorrow or next week he has to go. Whether I want him out now ( which would be good ) or not is irrelevant as I do not make the decisions. I accept that he will more than likely stay now until the end of the season. You see I DO NOT ACCEPT THAT IT IS A QUESTION OF TIMING as some are trying to make it. The question is "Is he the right manager for us"? IMO he is not. If he is not the right manager at some ficticous point in the future then he is not now. I WANT HIM OUT NOW. I have to accept that the board will not make that decision NOW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity-Tom Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Of course. Look at the wonders Peter Reid achieved , plus he has most of that team aswell. We'd easily gets 4th place with him in charge. Perhaps the FA will get in there first though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard unless ellis reads this forum then every post could be the same as none of us pick the side or play at LB etc, its all about opinions. The only certain fact about management is that one day you will leave the club. You are now of the opinion that he's not the right man for the job and want him to go NOW. The timing point is a fiar one because of the impact it would have on many aspects of the club, hence it being raised. Maybe its me not reading all of the posts but I still havent seen a good argument about why he should go NOW and that the effect would not be detrimental both from a financial and an operating impact. Maybe if someone could put one forward a lot of these threads would stop and we could discuss more important and ejoyable things like 1982 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I do not think he is the right manager for Aston Villa. I did not 14 games ago and I do not now. IMO He has to go. Whatever I think, though, will not influence the board and their decision. I have to accept this and this is what I mean by PRACTICAL. Others say now is not the right time but they conveniently avoid saying whether or not he is the right manager for us in their opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claret&blewit Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 We have got to keep him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard - in a small way the fans opinion may have an impact on what they think. More than happy to say he's the right manager for the situation we are in now. I think you will find that a lot of people have said similar. I'll ask my question in a slightly different way as no one is answering it. Sack DOL today, would this impact the club NOW in a bad way or a good way and why Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Who knows for sure? You are asking a question that you know no one can answer for definite. What I can tell you is that IMO he is not the right manager for the job so keeping him IMO is pointless, it will be detrimental to us. No maybe good maybe bad, a definite detrimental. I mean for years now people have been saying Ellis Out! (and I have been one of them) without once offering an alternative of who they want to replace him or what the implications would be. Now it seems you cannot say DOL OUT without first putting together a business plan to prove your case with accurate costings of the change in management in terms of dismissal costs and employment costs and adding a risk analysis of where any new manager will get us. Why is he the right manager for the job Ian? What qualities does he have that make him the right manager for the job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity-Tom Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 In answer to your question Drat, I will state the obvious and say, get rid if the right manager is available. DOL is not the right man for the job for the reasons stated in a previous post. Who that manager is, I can't answer, but it has to be an O'Neill style manager and not a DOL one. Thats not to say I don't think DOL is a decent manager as I do but I think at the moment DOL and Villa do not satisfy each others needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisVillan Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Still think he should go. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Whats also a suprise is you have returned so quickly from your self imposed exile. Well as you asked me to return, both publically and privately, I thought it would be a shame to disappoint you. Can you just clarify your stance again for me? You said that DOL was not the right man for us but should be kept on until the end of his contract. Is that still the case? Bumping the question.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard you cant compare the Ellis out and DOL out stances as the same sort of thing. Replacements for DOL are there for people to debate about, replacements in the world of business are not in the public domain so you cant really form an opinion, IMO. The reason I think he's the right manager for us now is based a lot on the fact that he's in the job now. Its a bit of damage limitation as it stands at the moment and I dont think his record as a manager is as bad as some would have us believe. Its a tough job managing Villa and some of the best have tried and somewhat failed. Circumstances at the club have got worse, so we need stability, both from a personnel point of view and from a financial point of view. Getting rid of DOL now would, again IMO, impact both of these in a negative way. As one of the posters above said, we all know who the key to most of the issues at the club is, so that would be in an ideal world the first replacement. DOL is not the best, I will admit that and he has made mistakes and will probably do so again. But AVFC dont find themselves in the luxurious position where it can afford to take many gambles. I still think DOL can and will do a good job for us (EDIT: sorry pressed submit before I could add this) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard you cant compare the Ellis out and DOL out stances as the same sort of thing. Replacements for DOL are there for people to debate about, replacements in the world of business are not in the public domain so you cant really form an opinion, IMO. Not EXACTLY the same situation granted, but the same questions can be asked. What will the impact be? Who should takeover? etc etc . Who knows who will come forward as a manager when the position is vacant. You see it seems now that the DOL fan club are asking for very specific and detailed answers to questions about what happens after DOL is gone. Why is it not the same about answering detailed and specific questions about after Ellis has gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard - I'm not sure where you are going with this. But in my simple mind its just that simple. Ellis - runs the club badly. Can't be replaced unless he wants to leave and then by who? I dont know as I dont know who has money so cant even speculate DOL - has a tough job to do and now isnt the right time for him to leave the club because of the reasons mentioned in lots of threads. One of the reasons is Ellis so I suppose the two are linked and I think that DOL's position would be looked at by any new owners should they chose to make their move. As for others becoming available, how much would they cost etc (and note my questions on all of this have been pretty consistant so its not new ones - Note: stop the "DOL fan club" comments because thats just silly now - IMO) As for the impact after Ellis has gone I think that you will fiind that in the 1789787897789 threads abouut him leaving there has been a few questions about what would be the impact and most feel that it would be of benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelle Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Richard you cant compare the Ellis out and DOL out stances as the same sort of thing. Replacements for DOL are there for people to debate about, replacements in the world of business are not in the public domain so you cant really form an opinion, IMO. Not EXACTLY the same situation granted, but the same questions can be asked. What will the impact be? Who should takeover? etc etc . Who knows who will come forward as a manager when the position is vacant. You see it seems now that the DOL fan club are asking for very specific and detailed answers to questions about what happens after DOL is gone. Why is it not the same about answering detailed and specific questions about after Ellis has gone? Partly agree, partly disagree. Think Ian is right when he says that there are no public potential takeovers to discuss. There are a few managers, though. But it's equally impossible to really say what would happen if a new manager was appointed now. But there's a lot more to discuss over a new manager. To me there is no better manager available who'd come to Villa than DOL, IMO. Of course I'd jump on Mousinho ie if he'd come here, but that won't happen. We won't get Capello, Hitzfield, SGE, not even O'Neill I'd guess as things are now. Those who are available ATM and who might come here ain't better than DOL so why sack him? Again, my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahamaad Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 DOL out now? On what grounds? Apart from the blip at West Ham we have taken points off the top 5 teams. A few wins and we should be mid table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisVillan Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Why do we have to be playing a top 5 team to get a performance out of the buggers? I'd suggest that needs addressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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