JulieB Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Downing saying he wants to go and us saying hes not for sale are 2 totally different things though. Just because he might have intimated to McLeish that he would like to leave, that doesnt stop us from coming out and saying hes not for sale. Yeah but exactly the same scenario happened if you remember with Barry, the summer that Livepool tried to prize him away from us. MON if you remember spoke to Barry and he made it clear that he wanted the move. MON came out and said as much. Villa did not subsequently tell Liverpool that the player wasn't for sale... they said.. "OK we'll sell him... for £XXM Cough up or do one"... As it happens they backed off so he stayed. Anyone else apart from me spot the difference?!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Villa did not subsequently tell Liverpool that the player wasn't for sale... they said.. "OK we'll sell him... for £XXM much. Cough up or do one" Didnt that turn out to be pure speculation by the media though? To the point where they have backtracked on this and are now saying that we arent willing to sell for any price? All since McLeish has come out and actually given them something to quote, rather than something to assume or make up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andym Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Play hardball and throw him in the reserves, let him see his contract out etc. Sorry but it wont work like that in the game today. He is an ssset worth approx 19M by all accounts. Not sure the club, or any club really apart from Citeh, is in a position to lose 19M or a significant portion of it. It is a pity we could not show him we can achieve what he wants and so keep him here but that's what a club in our position faces I'm afraid why is it always the club that is 100% responsible? if downing wants wants champions league and trophies so much why hasnt he put in the performances to help us get there. he came into a team with a solid keeper and defence, with a midfield of milner, young and petrov and with gabby and carew upfront back when they were both playing really well. we had come so close the year before and then spent big in the summer (including on downing) to ensure the same didnt happen the next year. it was the perfect platform for him to succeed - no pressure on him, other quality attackers who would create space for him etc. yes he was injured for the first few months, but even when fully fit he was crap. he wants a cup - he played in a cup final with us and was annonymous. if he was so desperate to win a cup maybe he could have worked his backside off and put in a matchwinning performance. even last season where he was better, he still wasnt outstanding. a decent amount of goals and assists but nothing special. marc albrighton in his first ever prem season nearly got as many, and in much less minutes played. at least barry and young put in a shift and really tried to help us get somewhere before leaving. and along with milner they all were able to dominate games and win them for us on their own. they had the ability to singlehandedly get key results for us. imo downing has not shown that, he has never dominated a match for us like those 3. its what annoys me the most about footballers. they seem to expect success handed to them on a plate and they take no responsibility themselves for lack of success. thats despite the fact that at the end of the day it is they who go out on the pitch and are ultimately responsible for results Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieB Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Villa did not subsequently tell Liverpool that the player wasn't for sale... they said.. "OK we'll sell him... for £XXM much. Cough up or do one" Didnt that turn out to be pure speculation by the media though? To the point where they have backtracked on this and are now saying that we arent willing to sell for any price? All since McLeish has come out and actually given them something to quote, rather than something to assume or make up. No it wasn't media speculation at all. I specifically remember MON being interviewed live on air about the Barry situation because of the disgraceful way FSW had been talking about signing him openly and Gerrard for that matter. So Villa decided to hit back publically and play hard ball. MON made it clear that Barry wanted to leave and didn't want to sign a new contract. He had 2 years on his present deal and that Villa had little choice but to allow him to go IF Liverpool paid the sum because MON wouldn't want an unhappy player on his hands. MON actually publically stated that they had made it clear what the price of the player was to Liverpool after they'd made a derisory first bid. Liverpool never matched the price, so Villa refused to sell. I actually applauded Lerner & MON for playing hard ball with the Bindippers at the time. MON never said Barry wasn't for sale.. they actually said OK you can have him for this price The Downing scenario is different.. This time McCleish has said. He's NOT FOR SALE. and if Villa are doing this despite the feelings of the player, then why speak to him twice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazdavies79 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I don't want any of their shite players but for 20m Ill take him there myself. Hes not that good at all, plays simple football. After watching a video of his best bits it just made me miss Ashley Young! Sell him now and use half of that money on Nzogbia and the other half on Walker. Job done. Walkers signed a new deal Andy. The only thing I dont understand is the figure itself. What did we pay £15mil? That was when he was at relegated Middlesbrough and with a broken leg. Yet Liverpool will only pay what 3-5mil more. That season he also played 37 games for Boro scoring a mindblowing zero goals! Yet after his second most successful season he's only worth a couple of odd million more than his worst! Has he? Ouch. Didn't know that, pretty gutted. We paid £10m for him rising to £12m and I think its safe to say we overpaid for him, like most of MON's signings were. I just dont rate him that much. Id happily replace him with Nzogbia and have cash left over, if we can do that then its good business IMO.I agree, though I wouldn't say I don't rate him, for £18+ million pounds I'd pocket the cash. A player of similar ability could be brought in with cash to spare, which could be used to strengthen other areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Has he? Ouch. Didn't know that, pretty gutted. We paid £10m for him rising to £12m and I think its safe to say we overpaid for him, like most of MON's signings were. I just dont rate him that much. Id happily replace him with Nzogbia and have cash left over, if we can do that then its good business IMO. Ah yes that was it. He did, again looks like our relaxed take our time attitude with transfer could have cost us again but maybe he's be told he's Spurs first choice next year. I agree we overpaid, and he reminds of the poor mans Barry when he was playing left mid to be honest. I like my wingers to be quick and direct but he isn't that at all, N'Zogbia is a must this window! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Villa did not subsequently tell Liverpool that the player wasn't for sale... they said.. "OK we'll sell him... for £XXM much. Cough up or do one" Didnt that turn out to be pure speculation by the media though? To the point where they have backtracked on this and are now saying that we arent willing to sell for any price? All since McLeish has come out and actually given them something to quote, rather than something to assume or make up. No it wasn't media speculation at all. I specifically remember MON being interviewed live on air about the Barry situation because of the disgraceful way FSW had been talking about signing him openly and Gerrard for that matter. So Villa decided to hit back publically and play hard ball. MON made it clear that Barry wanted to leave and didn't want to sign a new contract. He had 2 years on his present deal and that Villa had little choice but to allow him to go IF Liverpool paid the sum because MON wouldn't want an unhappy player on his hands. MON actually publically stated that they had made it clear what the price of the player was to Liverpool after they'd made a derisory first bid. Liverpool never matched the price, so Villa refused to sell. I actually applauded Lerner & MON for playing hard ball with the Bindippers at the time. MON never said Barry wasn't for sale.. they actually said OK you can have him for this price The Downing scenario is different.. This time McCleish has said. He's NOT FOR SALE. and if Villa are doing this despite the feelings of the player, then why speak to him twice? I think weve got our wires crossed Julie, my post was referring to the Downing situation, not Barry. The speculation i was referring to was the one about us saying we want 19m for Downing, which in the end did indeed turn out to be speculation. Since McLeish came out and said he wasnt for sale, the papers are now backtracking on what they originally said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-Reacho Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Play hardball and throw him in the reserves, let him see his contract out etc. Sorry but it wont work like that in the game today. He is an ssset worth approx 19M by all accounts. Not sure the club, or any club really apart from Citeh, is in a position to lose 19M or a significant portion of it. It is a pity we could not show him we can achieve what he wants and so keep him here but that's what a club in our position faces I'm afraid why is it always the club that is 100% responsible? if downing wants wants champions league and trophies so much why hasnt he put in the performances to help us get there. he came into a team with a solid keeper and defence, with a midfield of milner, young and petrov and with gabby and carew upfront back when they were both playing really well. we had come so close the year before and then spent big in the summer (including on downing) to ensure the same didnt happen the next year. it was the perfect platform for him to succeed - no pressure on him, other quality attackers who would create space for him etc. yes he was injured for the first few months, but even when fully fit he was crap. he wants a cup - he played in a cup final with us and was annonymous. if he was so desperate to win a cup maybe he could have worked his backside off and put in a matchwinning performance. even last season where he was better, he still wasnt outstanding. a decent amount of goals and assists but nothing special. marc albrighton in his first ever prem season nearly got as many, and in much less minutes played. at least barry and young put in a shift and really tried to help us get somewhere before leaving. and along with milner they all were able to dominate games and win them for us on their own. they had the ability to singlehandedly get key results for us. imo downing has not shown that, he has never dominated a match for us like those 3. its what annoys me the most about footballers. they seem to expect success handed to them on a plate and they take no responsibility themselves for lack of success. thats despite the fact that at the end of the day it is they who go out on the pitch and are ultimately responsible for results Summed up nicely. If Downing was determined to play for a CL team only why did he sign a lucrative contract with us, and not hold out for one of the big four. The answer is obviously that if he'd done that he'd still be playing Championship football for Middlesborough. They're a cynical bunch and unless we can get a bunch of players like Gaby (can't really think of any others) this will continue happening. We're hoping N'Zogbia signs but if he has a successful two seasons here it will be the same with him - and he's probably thinking that himself at this stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieB Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I think weve got our wires crossed Julie, my post was referring to the Downing situation, not Barry. The speculation i was referring to was the one about us saying we want 19m for Downing, which in the end did indeed turn out to be speculation. Since McLeish came out and said he wasnt for sale, the papers are now backtracking on what they originally said My bad. Wirescrossed... with you now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Said it before. Downing will go when Liverpool stop trying to buy him on the cheap and offer what we want. I'd be chasing Man Shit for Downing's ready made replacement, Johnson. N'zogbia and Johnson on the wings and Parker and Milner in the centre. Top six no problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Said it before. Downing will go when Liverpool stop trying to buy him on the cheap and offer what we want. I'd be chasing Man Shit for Downing's ready made replacement, Johnson. N'zogbia and Johnson on the wings and Parker and Milner in the centre. Top six no problem! As Neo said "it's an honour to meet you!". Could not agree more, if we could get 2 out of the 4 it would be good. 3 or all 4 would be amazing! Petrov is passed it, needs to go. Possibly back to Celtic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Said it before. Downing will go when Liverpool stop trying to buy him on the cheap and offer what we want. I'd be chasing Man Shit for Downing's ready made replacement, Johnson. N'zogbia and Johnson on the wings and Parker and Milner in the centre. Top six no problem! As Neo said "it's an honour to meet you!". Could not agree more, if we could get 2 out of the 4 it would be good. 3 or all 4 would be amazing! Petrov is passed it, needs to go. Possibly back to Celtic! The honour is all mine mate. Agree about Petrov as well. O'Neill gave him a four year contract at 29 when he was already showing signs of being fatigued after 60 minutes in games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Said it before. Downing will go when Liverpool stop trying to buy him on the cheap and offer what we want. I'd be chasing Man Shit for Downing's ready made replacement, Johnson. N'zogbia and Johnson on the wings and Parker and Milner in the centre. Top six no problem!Sounds good although I'd rather play a 4-3-3 with Milner, Makoun and Petrov making up the midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulver Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 If we sign that busted flush Joe Cole I may unlock the gun cabinet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyOne Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 You mean you didn't unlock the gun cabinet when McLeish was appointed? Joe Cole seems a possbility if Liverpool throw like an 18m Joe Cole for Downing. I'm not saying that's a good deal (far from it, I would rather take the money without Cole), but will our naive board see it? Most likely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabby Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Taking Cole would be doing Liverpool a HUGE favour they want him off the wage bill. No it's straight cash or jog on from me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hercs23 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Mirror saying it will be TODAY that downing will tell avfc he wants out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakid007 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 20m cash or no deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coops_AVFC Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Papers know DJ is back in training tomorrow, so it's an easy story to run. According to the Mirror Fabregas was supposed to be gone/future decided today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieB Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Cole used to be such a good player...what's happened? There was a time when we would have fell over backwards at the thought of him coming to Villa. It's like Stephen Ireland - how can such gifted, talented players become so ineffective practically overnight? Edit Add: BTW I'm getting really bored of Bindipper rags printing articles about Downing wanting to seal his move to Anfield. Apparently Downing is now furious we're not selling him... Yawn...If he want's to move McCleish then perhaps it's time to send him down to B6 to collect his P45. If not then when the bid comes in tomorrow for £18M please just Fax back... "Which part of NO did you NOT understand?!!!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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