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8 minutes ago, terrytini said:

It may ( or may not) interest some that after our appalling start of 7 Points from 7 games, we played another 39 games.

With Grealish starting - Played 19/ Won 11/ Drew 3/ Lost 5.........Scored 34.....Conceeded 18.........36 Points at 1.89 per game.

Without Grealish starting - Played 20/ Won 12/  Drew 4/ Lost 4........Scored 31....Conceeded 15....40 Points at 2.00 per game.

So, without the bad start we did better without him.With the bad start included its

Without Grealish - Played 27/ Won 13/ Drew 8/ Lost 6......Scored 38......Conceeded 24.....47 Points at 1.74......So overall worse of course.

So if we do how we did without him in total, we get 80 points, Play Off.

If we do how we did without him after the first 7 games, it’s Automatic promotion !

There are many variables of course, this isn’t a scientific thesis, but I think it shows that maybe some have overstated his contribution and importance.

I love watching him, and I love he’s a fan, and I hope he stays, but, I don’t agree with the view he is essential for success.

Prepare to be abused & laughed at. I have said all of this multiple times going back weeks/months and apparently it is just meaningless stats.

Over 2 full seasons in this league the stats when he plays are even worse than yours mentioned above, We get worse the more he plays...

https://www.villatalk.com/topic/4026-jack-grealish/?page=722&tab=comments#comment-2442233

 

Edited by LakotaDakota
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2 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said:

Prepare to be abused & laughed at. I have said all of this multiple times going back weeks/months and apparently it is just meaningless stats

Lol.

Or “ facts” as we used to call them before Trump, Farage, Johnson, etc ?

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3 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said:

Prepare to be abused & laughed at. I have said all of this multiple times going back weeks/months and apparently it is just meaningless stats

Lol you almost weren’t quick enough to beat the first one !!?

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3 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said:

Prepare to be abused & laughed at. I have said all of this multiple times going back weeks/months and apparently it is just meaningless stats

It kind of is meaningless stats if to get them you have to ignore our start to the season.

I can do that too, if you don't include the 11 games we won with Grealish starting, our win percentage with him is 0%, he must be terrible!

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1 minute ago, PieFacE said:

Meh...stats, I watch football with my eyes. I can see we're a much better footballing team with Jack in the first 11 than without. That much is clear to me. 

Whether we are a better footballing team is entirely subjective, and your view is your own and can’t be questioned.

However, ill take the Points !

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4 minutes ago, MessiWillSignForVilla said:

It kind of is meaningless stats if to get them you have to ignore our start to the season.

I can do that too, if you don't include the 11 games we won with Grealish starting, our win percentage with him is 0%, he must be terrible!

This ignores nothing, Our 2 full seasons in this league. People will still argue or say it's just stats though but the truth is he hasn't even started 50% of the games & when he does play we get significantly less points

Total amount of Championship games played by Aston Villa = 92

Jack Grealish :

In matchday squad: 66 (71.73% of possible)

Starting eleven: 39 (42.39% of possible starts)

Came on as sub: 19

Unused sub: 8

Of the 39 games he has started We have Won 16 Drawn 11 & Lost 12 (41.02% win percentage) 1.51 points per game

Of the 58 games he has played any part in at all We have Won 22 Drawn 16 & Lost 20 (37.93% win percentage) 1.41 points per game

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

In the 34 games he played no part in at all We have Won 18 Drawn 9 & Lost 7 (52.94% win percentage) 1.85 points per game

Edited by LakotaDakota
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11 minutes ago, terrytini said:

It may ( or may not) interest some that after our appalling start of 7 Points from 7 games, we played another 39 games.

With Grealish starting - Played 19/ Won 11/ Drew 3/ Lost 5.........Scored 34.....Conceeded 18.........36 Points at 1.89 per game.

Without Grealish starting - Played 20/ Won 12/  Drew 4/ Lost 4........Scored 31....Conceeded 15....40 Points at 2.00 per game.

So, without the bad start we did better without him.With the bad start included its

Without Grealish - Played 27/ Won 13/ Drew 8/ Lost 6......Scored 38......Conceeded 24.....47 Points at 1.74......So overall worse of course.

So if we do how we did without him in total, we get 80 points, Play Off.

If we do how we did without him after the first 7 games, it’s Automatic promotion !

There are many variables of course, this isn’t a scientific thesis, but I think it shows that maybe some have overstated his contribution and importance.

I love watching him, and I love he’s a fan, and I hope he stays, but, I don’t agree with the view he is essential for success.

well I'll be damned those are some interesting stats tbh.

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2 minutes ago, terrytini said:

Whether we are a better footballing team is entirely subjective, and your view is your own and can’t be questioned.

However, ill take the Points !

So, would you bench him tonight if you were the manager?

Edited by PieFacE
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1 minute ago, PieFacE said:

So, would you bench him tonight if you were the manager?

That would depend on many things, as I said the above is subject to other variables and isn’t scientific.

The point I’m making is if I had to bench him, or do without, I’d be very confident we’d be fine.....as the above shows.

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17 minutes ago, terrytini said:

It may ( or may not) interest some that after our appalling start of 7 Points from 7 games, we played another 39 games.

With Grealish starting - Played 19/ Won 11/ Drew 3/ Lost 5.........Scored 34.....Conceeded 18.........36 Points at 1.89 per game.

Without Grealish starting - Played 20/ Won 12/  Drew 4/ Lost 4........Scored 31....Conceeded 15....40 Points at 2.00 per game.

So, without the bad start we did better without him.With the bad start included its

Without Grealish - Played 27/ Won 13/ Drew 8/ Lost 6......Scored 38......Conceeded 24.....47 Points at 1.74......So overall worse of course.

So if we do how we did without him in total, we get 80 points, Play Off.

If we do how we did without him after the first 7 games, it’s Automatic promotion !

There are many variables of course, this isn’t a scientific thesis, but I think it shows that maybe some have overstated his contribution and importance.

I love watching him, and I love he’s a fan, and I hope he stays, but, I don’t agree with the view he is essential for success.

There's lots of variables, and I've never liked this analysis of with and without players because of how much a game depends on than just one player.

But this analysis does put a stop to those who say we were crap last season until Grealish got fit.

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5 minutes ago, MessiWillSignForVilla said:

It kind of is meaningless stats if to get them you have to ignore our start to the season.

I can do that too, if you don't include the 11 games we won with Grealish starting, our win percentage with him is 0%, he must be terrible!

1. I didn’t ignore the start, I included it, and the consequent effect, in full.

2. The remainder aren’t ‘ meaningless’.....they have the meaning they have, neither more nor less. 

3. Second paragraph suggests further debate with you on the subject pointless, so I’ll leave it there.

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The stats are interesting; however, perhaps we should take into account the fact that Grealish is a work in progress and is improving every game, as is our general teamwork around him.

(now someone will produce stats that we did better when he first came into the team than towards the end of the season)

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4 minutes ago, terrytini said:

That would depend on many things, as I said the above is subject to other variables and isn’t scientific.

The point I’m making is if I had to bench him, or do without, I’d be very confident we’d be fine.....as the above shows.

Bah you've started something now. Wasn't going to have this argument again as it is pointless to even say anything other than he is obviously better than Coutinho, Modric, Hazard, Dele Alli & Messi combined ;)

Edited by LakotaDakota
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8 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

Guy on sky sports said he expects grealish to be home by Thursday and I agree. The annoying thing is spurs havw had all summer to sign him and now we will be scrambling around to find a replacement.

I think if we get 30m in that eases ffp significantly and we can strengthen in other areas to make our team not competitive. As it stands wven with grealish I don't think we are strong enough for a promotion push

I agree.

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Well I am glad @terrytini and @LakotaDakota are not in charge of sales negotiations. ?

FWIW, I know he is not the finished article yet, he does need to improve his end product and add goals to his game, but I feel that if we are not careful we could undersell a player who can go on to do great things and eventually command a massive pricetag. Jack has the ability to draw opposition players towards him when he dribbles the ball, and he then takes them out of the game by drifting past them, which in a better team the other players will reap the benefits. He doesn't get the protection he should get in the Championship to be fair, if he were playing in the PL for one of the Sky 6 the opposition wouldn't be able to kick him so regularly without reprisal from the referee.

So far with us he has had a stop start career, but it feels like he has grown up in the last 12 months and is about to kick on to the next level, and I think that is why some of the fans feel aggrieved to see him go and probably become the player we thought he would for some other teams benefit.

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