Popular Post Wainy316 Posted September 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted September 6, 2021 Imagine not wanting a player that good back at your club because he hurt your feelings a bit once 5 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 13 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Not sure I understand why likes of Gabby are considered legends - never even got close to 20 league goals in a season for us and without his pace he would have been a League 1 player. Sadly I think we have that provincial mindset that if you're local and play for the club, and maybe score a few goals against the Noses, you're a legend. Never mind the fact that Gabby was utterly useless from 2010 onwards bar a few games a season. His best season he got 12 league goals - Ollie beat that in his first season for us. Players like Mellberg, Laursen, Barry I could see as sort of legends (except we didn't win anything with them), at least they had real quality about them. Back on topic, we need to forget about Greasy now. I think if we're as ambitious as we say we are we shouldn't be waiting for him to come back. He's already burnt his bridges with his comments and lack of respect IMO. Leicester have lost numerous players to the Scummy 6 over the years but have rebuilt a stronger and better team and that's what we have to do. One thing we can learn is having a release clause (no matter how high) is not clever and we should try to avoid it in future. Levy would never allow that. And also not to get too attached to one single player because ultimately there is no loyalty in football. Gabby had a disgusting unhealthy attitude and was seriously unprofessional in those twilight years. Only turning up against the Noses. He was very happy to be partying abroad when the club was being relegated. And came off as xenophobic towards Garde. Nowhere near a legend for this club, no matter the goals scored. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Stevo985 Posted September 6, 2021 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted September 6, 2021 (edited) 50 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: True enough but "just" being a very good player does not a legend make. I get that the younger generation have not had a genuine legend to look up to, but that does not make Gabby, Barry or Grealish legends. Gabby and Grealish both shat on the club (in different ways) and Barry left chasing the bright lights and trophies. Personally I would class Mellberg or Laursen as legends before any of the above. As a comedian once said on the tellybox, "being a legend used to require removal of a sword from a stone, now it seems to just need you to return with unexpected crisps" See to me you're putting Laursen and Mellberg as "legends" purely because they left when we were ok with them leaving. Laursen played less than 100 games for Villa and achieved less thank Jack did, wasn't as good a player as Jack was, captained us less times and only played for us because he had a bad injury as opposed to coming up through the ranks at the club. Why is he a legend and grealish isn't? Because he retired here? If jack had done his cruciate in the summer and had to retire would he be a legend? Mellberg let his contract run down and left for Juventus on a free. Is that worse than how Jack has left? Or because he bought everyone a shirt does that make him a legend? I've said it dozens of times. Grealish is getting punished by our fans for being good enough for an elite club to want him. In the eyes of the fans he'd have been better off being shit and staying here for his whole career. It's backwards Edited September 6, 2021 by Stevo985 6 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wict01 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 I think there is a fine line to walk between actual legendary status and being a "hero" to the fans. Less than a legend, but fondly remembered. For me, players like Laursen and Carew would probably fit into that second category. The closest players to legends in my time supporting the club would probably have to be Mellberg and Ian Taylor. I was born in 92, so I don't really remember much of the sides that last won us trophies. Grealish for me would probably also have been in the "hero" camp and has left short of fulfilling the potential to become a legend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 If Hutton is considered a legend by some then so is Grealish. I dont believe either are Jack still could be but he isnt now. I think Barry and Mellberg are probably the closest in the last 15 years 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 2 hours ago, villa4europe said: Depends on your age I'm 37 and due to the inaccessibility of football in the 90s compared to today I didn't see that much of mcgrath, probably saw him play more for Ireland than I did for villa So that leaves grealish up there with gabby, Barry, Taylor etc For anyone under the age of 30 he's comfortably the best villa player they've seen, which then you throw in winning stuff that's a lot of Villa fans with no legends... Ive seen them all and Grealish is the best talent we have ever had, the only downside is that he never scored enough goals 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 2 hours ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Not sure I understand why likes of Gabby are considered legends - never even got close to 20 league goals in a season for us and without his pace he would have been a League 1 player. Sadly I think we have that provincial mindset that if you're local and play for the club, and maybe score a few goals against the Noses, you're a legend. Never mind the fact that Gabby was utterly useless from 2010 onwards bar a few games a season. His best season he got 12 league goals - Ollie beat that in his first season for us. Players like Mellberg, Laursen, Barry I could see as sort of legends (except we didn't win anything with them), at least they had real quality about them. Back on topic, we need to forget about Greasy now. I think if we're as ambitious as we say we are we shouldn't be waiting for him to come back. He's already burnt his bridges with his comments and lack of respect IMO. Leicester have lost numerous players to the Scummy 6 over the years but have rebuilt a stronger and better team and that's what we have to do. One thing we can learn is having a release clause (no matter how high) is not clever and we should try to avoid it in future. Levy would never allow that. And also not to get too attached to one single player because ultimately there is no loyalty in football. For me legends are the ones that took us to Glory. So I'll leave that to the likes of Withe, Mortimer and Cowans. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 59 minutes ago, Zatman said: If Hutton is considered a legend by some then so is Grealish. I dont believe either are Jack still could be but he isnt now. I think Barry and Mellberg are probably the closest in the last 15 years Grealish can come back and score a goal by running the length of the pitch if he wants to be compared to the Scottish Cafu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 32 minutes ago, Spoony said: Grealish can come back and score a goal by running the length of the pitch if he wants to be compared to the Scottish Cafu He’s crap at that though, always hits it straight at the keeper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 People are getting legends and cult heroes mixed up. Yes I said cult Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post barry'sboots Posted September 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted September 6, 2021 (edited) I really can't understand the hate. I love watching Grealish play. He is definitely the best Villa player I have seen (I am 54) and is right up there with the best premier league players at "10" or "11" for me. Such a talent. I was gutted that he chose to leave this summer, particularly to Citeh, but I can't bring myself to hate him for that. I am just disappointed that he chose to leave when it felt like everything was moving in the right direction for the club and I really think we could have gone on to big things with Jack at the core of it. His departure has definitely set us back and, maybe, given the negative net spend and reluctance to buy/upgrade in two or three areas, spooked the owners a little and made them realise how difficult it is going to be to crack the Top 4/break the Sky 5 (can't bring myself to say "Sky 6"/include Arsenal!!). I will not support him or hope that all his dreams are fulfilled but I will continue to enjoy watching his precocious talents (except when he plays us!). I partially blame Safegate for Jack's desire to move as well. Jack has said that playing for England has always been a huge aim for him and Safegate's reluctance to start Jack in big games because he was not regularly playing big games in Europe was, I am sure, a part of Jack's decision making process. However, that reluctance seems to have melted away since Jack's move to Citeh, even though he has yet to play a European game for them, let alone a big pressured one - somehow he is now deemed to be a first XI England player. And where are Declan Rice's huge games in Europe?? (I do get that Safegate has fewer options in that space) This is a real disgrace imho and potentially shows that the alleged bias that Safegate has against the Villa is true - shocking that an England manager can operate in this way. Or maybe Gareth just thinks if he's good enough for Pep ...! Those saying don't allow release clauses clearly do not understand negotiation. If Jack ran his contract down he could have left for nothing/minimal amounts. By signing a new contract (which he may not have done without the release clause) it has, at least, guaranteed us £100m if he left and the chance to re-build without him. I will always be thankful to him for that. It was only because Kane had his stupid brother as his agent that he did not have a similar release clause, instead relying on a stupid gentleman's agreement with a non-gent! Easy to avoid on a new signing/contract but on a contract renegotiation with a top player and a smart agent it is virtually impossible to avoid such a clause if the player wants it. At least, in this case, it is a far bigger clause than the £8m in Delph's contract!! Those saying they would never want him back are probably some of the same that are saying what an astute signing Ash has been the second time around. Ash cost us money (circa £11m I think) and then, from memory, let his contract run down and went for £17m?? He then proceeded to dive against us! Most on here have forgiven him these sins and welcomed him back at 36 years of age. As such, I would think that Jack at 30 years old, assuming he is still of the same talent and fit, should be more than welcomed back. In summary, I will continue to enjoy watching Jack but will not support him, particularly when he wears a Citeh jersey, but I will never hate/boo him. I will always be grateful for the £100m legacy. I definitely hope that we are in a position to re-sign him in 5 years time or, even better, to turn him down because we have better players!! Edited September 6, 2021 by barry'sboots 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 5 hours ago, Stevo985 said: See to me you're putting Laursen and Mellberg as "legends" purely because they left when we were ok with them leaving. Laursen played less than 100 games for Villa and achieved less thank Jack did, wasn't as good a player as Jack was, captained us less times and only played for us because he had a bad injury as opposed to coming up through the ranks at the club. Why is he a legend and grealish isn't? Because he retired here? If jack had done his cruciate in the summer and had to retire would he be a legend? Mellberg let his contract run down and left for Juventus on a free. Is that worse than how Jack has left? Or because he bought everyone a shirt does that make him a legend? I've said it dozens of times. Grealish is getting punished by our fans for being good enough for an elite club to want him. In the eyes of the fans he'd have been better off being shit and staying here for his whole career. It's backwards Absolutely not. He left for Champions League football and wasn’t going to play against us… If Grealish had gone to Italy or Spain, I don’t think a single one of us would have blamed him… but he went up the road and will be trying to actively beat us, possibly cost us trophies and medals… potentially (if worst comes to worst) even relegate us… and he would be happy to do so as long as he gets his own personal success… 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 6, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted September 6, 2021 1 minute ago, DJ_Villain said: Absolutely not. He left for Champions League football and wasn’t going to play against us… If Grealish had gone to Italy or Spain, I don’t think a single one of us would have blamed him… but he went up the road and will be trying to actively beat us, possibly cost us trophies and medals… potentially (if worst comes to worst) even relegate us… and he would be happy to do so as long as he gets his own personal success… This is mental 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 12 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: This is mental Why is it mental? Picture it… we are in the relegation zone at the end of the season when Man City come to Villa Park… City need to win to win the title… Villa need a draw to stay up… Ball ends up at Grealishs feet with an open goal in front of him with 95.55 on the clock and only 6 minutes of stoppage time… He’s a professional… so he is going to score… and he has just won them the league… He will celebrate and love it… But, at the moment, he is pedalling the whole “I’m Villa through and through, please still love me, I’m still same old Jack” narrative… He’s trying to have his cake and eat it to preserve his boy-next-door public image that he has gained for himself since he was being tapped up at the Euros 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 11 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said: Why is it mental? Picture it… we are in the relegation zone at the end of the season when Man City come to Villa Park… City need to win to win the title… Villa need a draw to stay up… Ball ends up at Grealishs feet with an open goal in front of him with 95.55 on the clock and only 6 minutes of stoppage time… He’s a professional… so he is going to score… and he has just won them the league… He will celebrate and love it… But, at the moment, he is pedalling the whole “I’m Villa through and through, please still love me, I’m still same old Jack” narrative… He’s trying to have his cake and eat it to preserve his boy-next-door public image that he has gained for himself since he was being tapped up at the Euros Of course he'll score. He's a professional footballer and winning the league. That doesn't mean he's not a Villa fan? His goal wouldn't be the reason we went down... it would be the previous 37 games that got us to that point. You're worrying about a scenario that will never likely happen. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 6, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted September 6, 2021 28 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said: Why is it mental? Picture it… we are in the relegation zone at the end of the season when Man City come to Villa Park… City need to win to win the title… Villa need a draw to stay up… Ball ends up at Grealishs feet with an open goal in front of him with 95.55 on the clock and only 6 minutes of stoppage time… He’s a professional… so he is going to score… and he has just won them the league… He will celebrate and love it… But, at the moment, he is pedalling the whole “I’m Villa through and through, please still love me, I’m still same old Jack” narrative… He’s trying to have his cake and eat it to preserve his boy-next-door public image that he has gained for himself since he was being tapped up at the Euros He's a professional. If he went to Real Madrid and we continue to imprive then you might get the same situation in the Champions League in a few years. Why does it matter? You're basically saying he has to play for Villa forever. it's nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 1 minute ago, Stevo985 said: He's a professional. If he went to Real Madrid and we continue to imprive then you might get the same situation in the Champions League in a few years. Why does it matter? You're basically saying he has to play for Villa forever. it's nonsense I didnt say that... at all... In fact, I literally said:"If Grealish had gone to Italy or Spain, I don’t think a single one of us would have blamed him…" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 6, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted September 6, 2021 Just now, DJ_Villain said: I didnt say that... at all... In fact, I literally said:"If Grealish had gone to Italy or Spain, I don’t think a single one of us would have blamed him…" But the scenario you're trying to avoid could happen if he went to Spain as well, on a bigger stage. So therefore he can't go anywhere unless it's somewhere he's guaranteed never to play Villa? Just makes no sense to me. What does it matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 18 minutes ago, Xela said: Of course he'll score. He's a professional footballer and winning the league. That doesn't mean he's not a Villa fan? His goal wouldn't be the reason we went down... it would be the previous 37 games that got us to that point. You're worrying about a scenario that will never likely happen. Would you be happy to score the deciding goal that sent Villa down if it meant you got a shiney little medal and you could raise a trophy with all your new friends? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: But the scenario you're trying to avoid could happen if he went to Spain as well, on a bigger stage. So therefore he can't go anywhere unless it's somewhere he's guaranteed never to play Villa? Just makes no sense to me. What does it matter? But we arent in Europe at the moment are we? We are in the Premier League and have made improvements every year since the owners took over... and our talisman got tapped up on international duty and ditched us, and is now contractually obliged to try to beat us twice a season... If it was just in cup competitions, and it was the luck of the draw that we ended up playing against him (like in Europe) then thats just bad luck... but to willingly give up our clubs captaincy, and want to go to another club in the same country and still spit this bullshit mantra of "Im Villa through and through"? Im not buying it... No Villa fan would ever willingly want to do that... I've said it before and I will say it again... I am a Villa fan... Not a football fan, not an England fan... I have no love for any other team... I'd rather win a throw in for Villa than any number of medals for any other English club... If his contract had run out and he was being forced out by management even though he wanted to stay (like Albrighton and Carew), I would have wished him well If his contract was running out and he went abroad (like Mellberg), I would have wished him well... If injury or sickness stopped his career and he had to retire (like Laursen and Petrov), I would have wished him well... Grealish has blotted his copy book.... and he wont care what we think because he gets to win his trophies... Bully for him... But as soon as a journalist gives him short shrift and ruffles his feathers, he didnt like it one bit... He doesnt love or support our club... He just didnt want to have bad publicity for ditching us... So he tried to butter us up with "See you soons", "Up the Villas" and "Villa till I dies" etc 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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