Keyblade Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Mantis said: I don't buy this "we hate every good player that leaves us" argument. Benteke was definitely not hated when he left, and while Milner and Young got a bit of stick (the latter mostly because he dived against us the following season), there wasn't really much hatred there, and indeed Young's been welcomed back with open arms. It's all about the wider context. I mean, if we'd have only just scraped safety again last season I guarantee most wouldn't have much of a problem with Grealish if he left. Which would be leaving on good terms. Instead he stayed and said some PR guff about believing in the project and wanting to be part of it, then left after we finished with 55 points despite him missing 1/3 of the season, and signing Buendia and Bailey ready to push on this season. Of course Villa fans are going to feel betrayed and they usually express that by booing. Don't think there'll be any lasting hate like with Delph though. Reminds me of when I was kid as a Raptors fan, when Vince Carter left despite the team making great strides in becoming serious contenders. It really hurt. He was everyone's hero, the beacon of an entire nation. When he came back for the first time he got absolute pelters. Chants of "liar", "VC sucks". It was cathartic. In a way, it showed how much we loved him: (He did have the last laugh that day). A couple of years later we were drawn in the playoffs. The Raptors were back for the first time since he left, and til this day I've never heard an arena so loud and united. But eventually we forgave and forget, and gave him a standing ovation many years later. It might be hard to see now, but I hope we can forgive Jack one day. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 1 hour ago, BleedClaretAndBlue said: Look at these Two Villa fans who made it. fraggles Lescott, ha, is that your wack now kid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 3 hours ago, El Zen said: I’m sorry, but footballers are entertainers. Their frankly embarrassing wealth comes from the money we pay to be entertained by them, and the only return we get for that money is emotional. I do not feel the slightest bit sorry for footballers in Jack’s place being booed for their decisions. It’s a decision they’ve made and a situation they can handle. They should, frankly, accept that being booed and even genuinely disliked by opposition fans is part of the entertainment business they make their money in. If you take that out of football, it becomes very sterile very fast. Right, so it's not actually a pantomime thing then? It's that you should be allowed to genuinely dislike someone - hate them, even - because they play for a different club or weren't willing to spend their entire life serving our club you want them to? No rational analysis of the situation required because they're rich and exist only for our entertainment, and thus they deserve it? I think that line of thinking excuses an awful lot of things, many of them not limited to the football pitch. It's the main reason why social media is such a cesspit these days, for example. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, BleedClaretAndBlue said: Its Villa Park, there’ll be boos, inflatable snakes, printed money & pitchforks Plus a cabbage* *no, I don't mean JG! Edited August 10, 2021 by Xela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Xela Posted August 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2021 I understand why he has gone, I really do. Once the disappointment and sadness went, it was clear. Jack is a child of Sky Sports and the Champions League. The constant narrative from the media that the ECL is the be all and end all of football. He desperately wanted to play at the very highest level. Who wouldn't, if you are an ambitious player? Playing at Camp Nou, Bernabau, San Siro, etc. Being on the same pitch as Ronaldo, Messi, Neymar, Lewandowski, etc. Let's be honest, he wasn't getting that at Villa in the next couple of years. It'll be a huge task for us to break the top 4, despite the great work of the owners and management team. He's had to watch other players, who he is friends with, regularly play these big European games while he watches at home. He's good enough to play at the very top with the elite players. That is why he has gone. The old romantic in me wanted him to stay but his ambition has grown quicker than we can accommodate. Its not about money - he could have probably earned £1m a month staying here. It's about honours and winning things and sharing the same pitch as the very best in the world. @lapal_fan's post a few pages back sums it all up. He's still a Villa fan. Just a very ambitious one. I'm gutted he has gone, naturally, but it all makes sense to me now. The one thing I will try not to do again is get emotionally invested in one player! 7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Keyblade said: Which would be leaving on good terms. Instead he stayed and said some PR guff about believing in the project and wanting to be part of it, then left after we finished with 55 points despite him missing 1/3 of the season, and signing Buendia and Bailey ready to push on this season. Of course Villa fans are going to feel betrayed and they usually express that by booing. Don't think there'll be any lasting hate like with Delph though. Reminds me of when I was kid as a Raptors fan, when Vince Carter left despite the team making great strides in becoming serious contenders. It really hurt. He was everyone's hero, the beacon of an entire nation. When he came back for the first time he got absolute pelters. Chants of "liar", "VC sucks". It was cathartic. In a way, it showed how much we loved him: (He did have the last laugh that day). A couple of years later we were drawn in the playoffs. The Raptors were back for the first time since he left, and til this day I've never heard an arena so loud and united. But eventually we forgave and forget, and gave him a standing ovation many years later. It might be hard to see now, but I hope we can forgive Jack one day. Felt so good when Lowry's loyalty finally resulted in a chip, and DeMar was sacrificed to win the chip 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, AVFCforever1991 said: Felt so good when Lowry's loyalty finally resulted in a chip, and DeMar was sacrificed to win the chip The Raptors' story was honestly so beautiful (minus the sacrifice of DeRozan). Like the perfect sports arc. Maybe I was naive in expecting Jack and Villa to mirror it. On Lowry, that's an example of a player leaving on good terms. It sucks that he's leaving but he has the fans' blessing and he's having his jersey retired as unquestionably the greatest player in franchise history. It all stemmed from loyalty. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdabush Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 20 minutes ago, Keyblade said: The Raptors' story was honestly so beautiful (minus the sacrifice of DeRozan). Like the perfect sports arc. Maybe I was naive in expecting Jack and Villa to mirror it. On Lowry, that's an example of a player leaving on good terms. It sucks that he's leaving but he has the fans' blessing and he's having his jersey retired as unquestionably the greatest player in franchise history. It all stemmed from loyalty. I mean I *suppose* you could consider Lowry a legend, but did he play 41 times for his club in the championship? Not enough to retire his jersey for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Zen Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Panto_Villan said: Right, so it's not actually a pantomime thing then? It's that you should be allowed to genuinely dislike someone - hate them, even - because they play for a different club or weren't willing to spend their entire life serving our club you want them to? No rational analysis of the situation required because they're rich and exist only for our entertainment, and thus they deserve it? I think that line of thinking excuses an awful lot of things, many of them not limited to the football pitch. It's the main reason why social media is such a cesspit these days, for example. Well it is a pantomime thing, because it’s context specific. I genuinely dislike loads of things in the football world. Most of them because of a wrong coloured shirt. It’s not personal, and there is no causal link between genuinely disliking Jack Grealish in a football context, and sending e.g. racial abuse to Saka on twitter for missing a penalty. Trying to establish that link is a cheap shot. Booing a player for leaving your club is something the player should be expected to live with. That’s part of the completely necessary club rivalry the very sport is founded on and doesn’t hurt anyone. Abusing your own player for making a mistake is something completely different. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, djdabush said: I mean I *suppose* you could consider Lowry a legend, but did he play 41 times for his club in the championship? Not enough to retire his jersey for me. A favour that big would be too much to ask. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdabush Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 5 hours ago, Panto_Villan said: If you're booing the pantomime villain then fine, but I think a lot of people aren't viewing it as theatre when they boo. They genuinely dislike someone for having done something that's actually quite understandable. Add to that that the person playing a pantomime villain is an actor playing a role, whereas footballers aren't actors. You're booing a real person for your entertainment. Which is fine if the player is deliberately playing the role (e.g. Troy Deeney) but if not, why do it? Especially when you'll be doing it alongside people who genuinely hate him. Emotions aren't logical though are they? Hatred, in particular, isn't logical. Why do people hate Birmingham City? There's no logic to it, it's literally because they also play in the same city. People loved Grealish when he played for us and when people feel hurt and betrayed it's not surprise that logic goes out the window for a while. You can even see on here when people are starting to move on from the emotional response and are more understanding of the situation. When he comes back to Villa Park, those emotions will be heightened again and no doubt there will be a fair bit of anger flying about. I personally don't think I would boo Grealish, I understand why he made his decision and certainly don't hate him for it but if people feel they need to boo him, if they make a banner or take along a load of inflatable snakes then I'm not going to criticise them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted August 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2021 I think I’d have liked to see him take to the podium at a press conference and cry (Messi style), in a way that it shows how much leaving means to him. I wish he could have shown that it hurt every single fibre in his body and how much it broke his heart. That might have been better than a shit eating grin about how buzzing he was to get the number ten shirt and all the waffle about what a proper football club he’s joined. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Keyblade said: The Raptors' story was honestly so beautiful (minus the sacrifice of DeRozan). Like the perfect sports arc. Maybe I was naive in expecting Jack and Villa to mirror it. On Lowry, that's an example of a player leaving on good terms. It sucks that he's leaving but he has the fans' blessing and he's having his jersey retired as unquestionably the greatest player in franchise history. It all stemmed from loyalty. I'd always hoped Grealish would go out like this Holding the champions League instead obviously... Edited August 10, 2021 by AVFCforever1991 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 1 minute ago, AVFCforever1991 said: I'd always hoped Grealish would go out like this Holding the champions League instead obviously... Even an FA Cup or League Cup would have done. He left some serious unfinished business behind. Inb4 someone says he got us to the PL, as if that was the extent of our ambition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 Everyone should do what they want. Grealish's leaving antics have been such I wont judge any fan for how they react. For me I would stay silent, boo him when he dives and save any banter until the final whistle because lets face it with those players around him the probability is he will have the last laugh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post NeilS Posted August 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2021 One more year was what I was expecting from Grealish. If he would have given one more season and we were still looking short of where we want to be then I would have thanked him and wished him well. He has left before finishing the job. We had a mixed season last year, showing some promising results against a few of the so called top clubs. I felt a bit of extra quality added to the squad this summer would have us challenging again, and maybe with a bit of luck with injuries we could have cracked a euro qualification spot. I fell this will set us back a bit this season, which then puts our other prized assets in Martinez, Konsa, Mings and Watkins in the itchy feet camp. I hope the new signings can help bridge that gap left by Grealish departure, and keep the others happy enough to stay longer and sign new deals. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keyblade Posted August 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, NeilS said: One more year was what I was expecting from Grealish. If he would have given one more season and we were still looking short of where we want to be then I would have thanked him and wished him well. He has left before finishing the job. We had a mixed season last year, showing some promising results against a few of the so called top clubs. I felt a bit of extra quality added to the squad this summer would have us challenging again, and maybe with a bit of luck with injuries we could have cracked a euro qualification spot. I fell this will set us back a bit this season, which then puts our other prized assets in Martinez, Konsa, Mings and Watkins in the itchy feet camp. I hope the new signings can help bridge that gap left by Grealish departure, and keep the others happy enough to stay longer and sign new deals. Exactly where I stand with this. If we finished outside the top 6 this season, I don't think anybody would hold it against Jack for leaving. We all know he's world class. Everyone suggesting we want him to stay forever and keep him hostage are way wide of the mark. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 The thing is, top 6 still wasn't enough for him, and it would take something absolutely breathtaking for us to qualify for the cl which is what he wanted. His personal ambitions came before any affection he had for the club, simple as that, and it's true of pretty much every footballer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted August 10, 2021 Share Posted August 10, 2021 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post theboyangel Posted August 10, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2021 I agree Grealish should just get the silent treatment from us. however we could also just chant Our City, Our Club, Our Home - Not Yours! 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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