DCJonah Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 10 minutes ago, vreitti said: This is absolutely true... but I find it equally rude and demeaning , that we 'neutrals' aren't allowed to voice our opinion... when it doesn't conform with the majority view. Who said that? If you're spouting conspiracy theories and knocking the manager who has done something no one else has managed since 1966, then you can't be surprised if your opinion gets questioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 1 hour ago, DaveAV1 said: I don’t think there’s an agenda either to be honest. I just think Southgate is a limited defensive manager who doesn’t really understand how to properly use Jack. What Southgate is though is a lucky manager. I agree on both counts. I'm sure over on the City forums they can't understand how Foden isn't in the team either. It's madness. However Southgate has got the morale of the camp a lot better than it used to be and the player like playing for England now. That's one of the biggest things he's done. He is trying to bore his way to victory and now they are in the final nobody will criticize him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, villa89 said: I agree on both counts. I'm sure over on the City forums they can't understand how Foden isn't in the team either. It's madness. However Southgate has got the morale of the camp a lot better than it used to be and the player like playing for England now. That's one of the biggest things he's done. He is trying to bore his way to victory and now they are in the final nobody will criticize him. I've seen Chelsea fans say the same about Chillwell. Especially when Trippier has been used at LB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 I think Chris Powell has been appointed as chief Grealish cheerer-upper. As well as that piggy back, you keep seeing him geeing Jacko up in plenty of different scenarios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderball Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 (edited) 10 hours ago, Tomaszk said: He hasn't got a good performance out of England in five years. Rubbish. How about vs Germany and vs Ukraine and vs Denmark in this tournament? All when it matters, under pressure. Southgate is doing a very professional job: Semi final of the World Cup; comfortable qualifying campaign; now a final at the Euros. He also engendered a “Club England” that never existed, it’s a long game at play here and he is at the heart of it. He has totally turned me around, take your claret and blue glasses off for a moment and accept his decisions are making the difference. And FWIW I thought taking Jack off last night was the wrong decision because it invited pressure when we were comfortable on the front foot, but I understood why he made that calculated change and it certainly didn’t cost him. Safety first, playing the percentages is why we are in a final. TBH I didn’t think Jack made as much of an impact as we might have hoped even though he was solid I think it was an easy decision for Southgate given the context of the game, and even if his curling shot from the corner of the box had gone in, he would still have taken him off. I don’t think we will beat Italy, but I think we have a better chance under Southgate than any other manager in the last 50 years. Edited July 8, 2021 by thunderball 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 5 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Who said that? If you're spouting conspiracy theories and knocking the manager who has done something no one else has managed since 1966, then you can't be surprised if your opinion gets questioned. Well you for starters... attacking each post that dare to question anything in regard to Southgate or England's performances. I get it though, you're so starved of success, it's no wonder you and many alike reek of that sense of entitlement now in your moment of triumph. Furthermore "questioning opinions" are totally fine, you should try it out sometimes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMcGrath_5 Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Just now, vreitti said: Well you for starters... attacking each post that dare to question anything in regard to Southgate or England's performances. I get it though, you're so starved of success, it's no wonder you and many alike reek of that sense of entitlement now in your moment of triumph. Furthermore "questioning opinions" are totally fine, you should try it out sometimes... Grow up, mate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 It's funny how Jack's main problem in getting into the England team is Kane. He's a CF who drops deep to get on the ball and create. For that to work you need other players getting into the box to score. Sterling does exactly this. Jack naturally wants to get the ball and create, not get into the box for the tap ins that is a big thing of what Sterling is about. With Villa the tactic is creative wide players and a 10 getting into the box to support the CF to score goals. That's not how England play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, vreitti said: Well you for starters... attacking each post that dare to question anything in regard to Southgate or England's performances. I get it though, you're so starved of success, it's no wonder you and many alike reek of that sense of entitlement now in your moment of triumph. Furthermore "questioning opinions" are totally fine, you should try it out sometimes... Attacking each post that dares question Southgate? Could you show me an example of these attacks please? I'm not even that much of a Southgate fan. I didn't actually celebrate last night as much as I do for villa games. I'm club over country every day of the week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouUnastanFren Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 1 minute ago, vreitti said: Well you for starters... attacking each post that dare to question anything in regard to Southgate or England's performances. I get it though, you're so starved of success, it's no wonder you and many alike reek of that sense of entitlement now in your moment of triumph. Furthermore "questioning opinions" are totally fine, you should try it out sometimes... To be fair though it is a discussion forum so "attack" is an over exaggeration for someone disagreeing with your post. Was it threatening or an ad hominem attack? Not really. I see this a lot on here and also online in general. Someone disagreeing with you is not the same as you not being allowed to have an opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burchy Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Watching the game last night it frustrates me that when Jack came in most of the attacking seemed to come down the right hand side, miles away from Jack. Sterling has had a great tournament but he quite often than not runs into a brick wall, Jack very rarely does this. I think Jack has his fans within the camp, people like Phillips, Saka, Kane and even Mount who actively seek him out with passes. Sterling and others not so much. He will definitely bring something to the final though and I think we’ll need him as the Italians will be hard to break down. On them does anyone else think Insigne is a smaller Italian clone of Grealish? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwi1890 Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Noticed how Jack and Foden were looking for each other (in a similar way to Barkley and Jack beginning of the season) and upping the tempo , Im sure Southgate’s leg was shaking and he was thinking to himself “this is way to adventurous for my liking” 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, gwi1890 said: Noticed how Jack and Foden were looking for each other (in a similar way to Barkley and Jack beginning of the season) and upping the tempo , Im sure Southgate’s leg was shaking and he was thinking to himself “this is way to adventurous for my liking” I would love to see the two of them on the pitch more. But Southgate seems very keen to have just pace out wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 I think when Jack comes on he's like gravity and opposition players are drawn much closer to him and need to have 2 on him as Jack skipping past one player with nobody there to cover for that is a big danger. This opens up space on the other side of the pitch as a result so it's a complement to Jack he is creating space elsewhere. I think he's a disruptive substitute and a big asset in that way for England. Very few teams have a player they can bring on that has such a consistent impact on the game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderball Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 1 minute ago, CVByrne said: I think when Jack comes on he's like gravity and opposition players are drawn much closer to him and need to have 2 on him as Jack skipping past one player with nobody there to cover for that is a big danger. This opens up space on the other side of the pitch as a result so it's a complement to Jack he is creating space elsewhere. I think he's a disruptive substitute and a big asset in that way for England. Very few teams have a player they can bring on that has such a consistent impact on the game. He is Southgate’s maverick, his wild card. He clearly values him as he is quite often his go to sub, that’s a lot of trust and responsibility given there. This England team is the perfect example of using a squad intelligently. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 He did his job, and although he didn't directly impact the goal, the way we upped the tempo and the space he created when he came on, he clearly changed the game. I just know these 20-30 minute cameos where he can't have as big an impact as we know he can will be held against him as reasons to not start him. All those appearances and just that number of assists?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted July 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted July 8, 2021 He's done his part so far and Southgates gamble worked last night. Jack can improve as a player but he's still our best chance of creating goals and he's shown that when given the chance he delivers. I think his presence in the England squad as well as a few others has pushed Sterling and Saka into performing at their best, which is what a healthy squad is for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdman Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 22 minutes ago, CVByrne said: It's funny how Jack's main problem in getting into the England team is Kane. He's a CF who drops deep to get on the ball and create. For that to work you need other players getting into the box to score. Sterling does exactly this. Jack naturally wants to get the ball and create, not get into the box for the tap ins that is a big thing of what Sterling is about. With Villa the tactic is creative wide players and a 10 getting into the box to support the CF to score goals. That's not how England play. Kane spent half the match in midfield last night and feck knows how he ended up with MOTM! He was good but seems to have this free role where he just floats around where he likes. Once again Jack found it difficult to get any flow to his game last night but that's the trouble with being an impact sub. It was very stop start when he came on, he wasn't getting that much of the ball either and on a few occasions others just weren't on his wavelength. He did have an impact though to his credit. Might have scored too had Kane let the ball run to him instead of shooting himself from a more difficult position! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicho Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, birdman said: Kane spent half the match in midfield last night and feck knows how he ended up with MOTM! He was good but seems to have this free role where he just floats around where he likes. Once again Jack found it difficult to get any flow to his game last night but that's the trouble with being an impact sub. It was very stop start when he came on, he wasn't getting that much of the ball either and on a few occasions others just weren't on his wavelength. He did have an impact though to his credit. Might have scored too had Kane let the ball run to him instead of shooting himself from a more difficult position! I lost count the amount of time he had had hands in the air asking for the ball. Kane should have left it for him, Phillips should have passed it and the actual shot he did have he should have been better with it. I get the running behind stuff with Sterling and he had a great game but just can’t get past if you give Grealish as much of the ball in the same positions he does more. Saka had a good first game, poor second and then was very nervy last night, by the time he went off he looked to have just woken up. He again however is in the team for his ability to run behind. Edited July 8, 2021 by Nicho 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermon Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 I still think either Sterling or Kane should have gone off instead of Grealish. Still don't agree with the Trippier decision, even if they had that many forwards on, we still have a back four plus two DMs. We were noticeably more penned in to our box as soon as that happened, even the commentator said we had gone 10 yards more the defensive. I was screaming for Sancho to come on in place of maybe Kane or Sterling. Felt Kane played terrible, looked like his legs were shot, half the time wasn't even in the box. Southgate didn't react to the tired legs of Denmark imo, fair enough we got the win, but I still feel he is an incredibly limited manager. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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