Keyblade Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 2 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I've said that for ages. People keep going on about him being central, but he is MUCH better wide left and drifting. The notion we should keep AEG wide left at the expense of Jack is so moronic I don't know where to start with it. He's having his best run of games of the season in the middle now. Must have created 30 chances in the last 5 games. There's also the added benefit of 2 wingers bang on goal scoring form as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 19 minutes ago, Keyblade said: He's having his best run of games of the season in the middle now. Must have created 30 chances in the last 5 games. There's also the added benefit of 2 wingers bang on goal scoring form as a result. Not even remotely. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Willard Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 He should be playing CL football. He deserves to play on the biggest stage where he strives. This why it pisses me off that the officials give United 3 points and us 0. Theyll drop off and come end of the season those 3 points will help them secure 4th. If we don't get into Europe or CL this season or next he should probably go. If he wasn't Villa through and through he would of got a move by now. Only if people pay us £150m now though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 The only argument to make for having him centrally while Barkley is out, is that he's such a great footballer it's a less net loss having him centrally than any other player moving out of position for instance AEG to the right. Where AEG would struggle to make the same impact cause he's not good enough to handle whatever is thrown at him, Grealish probably can without the performances taking too much of a hit. But he is miles better on the left. Personally I'd keep him left and Barkley centrally. If Barkley is out, get Traore in centrally. Buy a new right winger to rotate with Trez. Let AEG come in when necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 Just now, Lord Willard said: He should be playing CL football. He deserves to play on the biggest stage where he strives. This why it pisses me off that the officials give United 3 points and us 0. Theyll drop off and come end of the season those 3 points will help them secure 4th. If we don't get into Europe or CL this season or next he should probably go. If he wasn't Villa through and through he would of got a move by now. Only if people pay us £150m now though I'm sorry, cause I know this sounds harsh, but that is such a small club mentality and a perpetual loser thing to say. Why even go there? He is a fantastic footballer. We're a big big club. We've won most stuff there is to win, and we are supposed to support a world class player leaving, who incidentally also is a supporter of said club, just because we need to improve to win things? We're not on the same planet methinks. That mentality right there, is why we are where we are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudevillaisnice Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 12 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: We've won most stuff there is to win, and we are supposed to support a world class player leaving, who incidentally also is a supporter of said club, just because we need to improve to win things? We're not on the same planet methinks. Modern football I’m afraid. We haven’t won anything of note for a while. We have made a lot of improvement this season and I’m sure if we continue at this improvement level we are bound to win something of note eventually but that’s just it eventually... equally a footballers career is short and Jack I’m sure wants to win things at the end of the day. It would set us back as a club back if he were to leave. Anyway it’s one for next summer. Hopefully United drop off. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Willard Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 6 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I'm sorry, cause I know this sounds harsh, but that is such a small club mentality and a perpetual loser thing to say. Why even go there? He is a fantastic footballer. We're a big big club. We've won most stuff there is to win, and we are supposed to support a world class player leaving, who incidentally also is a supporter of said club, just because we need to improve to win things? We're not on the same planet methinks. That mentality right there, is why we are where we are. We are a big club, our history is one of the best in English football. We aren't where we are now because of our mentality. We are where we are because we've been run badly for years. Doug Ellis should of invested when we were top of the league but let Man United pull away. Randy should of got someone like Purslow in when he was incharge instead he let ONeil spend what he wanted. We were then bought by a Fraud... We are now on the up. Which is brilliant but we've got a player that could be getting the exposure of Messi, Ronaldo, Fernandes, De Bruyne etc. We need to be getting into Europe this season or CL next season for him otherwise we are holding his career back. On a selfish side, I don't want him to ever leave. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 I think we've had a losing mentality since JG and BL. It's gotten better after Deano came in, but it's enforced by stuff like you wrote. To me it's small time loser thinking. 'We have something good so it should move on to something better' not 'we have something good so maybe times are changing and lets buy better players to improve on that further'. Didn’t mean to be hard on you, but I'm allergic to that way of thought and to me it's a loser's mindset. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 33 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I'm sorry, cause I know this sounds harsh, but that is such a small club mentality and a perpetual loser thing to say. Why even go there? He is a fantastic footballer. We're a big big club. We've won most stuff there is to win, and we are supposed to support a world class player leaving, who incidentally also is a supporter of said club, just because we need to improve to win things? We're not on the same planet methinks. That mentality right there, is why we are where we are. The problem we have is that we have to tell people were a big club, our actions over the last god knows how many years havent backed that up. I agree with the sentiment, we should stop worrying about jack leaving and start being the club he shouldn't want to leave. Breaking into the England side was important, signings like Barkley are important (and need to be replicated), I think we probably need to qualify for Europe this year as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 41 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: The only argument to make for having him centrally while Barkley is out, is that he's such a great footballer it's a less net loss having him centrally than any other player moving out of position for instance AEG to the right. Where AEG would struggle to make the same impact cause he's not good enough to handle whatever is thrown at him, Grealish probably can without the performances taking too much of a hit. But he is miles better on the left. Personally I'd keep him left and Barkley centrally. If Barkley is out, get Traore in centrally. Buy a new right winger to rotate with Trez. Let AEG come in when necessary. That's also really the only argument being made at the moment. Barkley central with Grealish left + A.N. Other is still our strongest side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 8 minutes ago, Keyblade said: That's also really the only argument being made at the moment. Barkley central with Grealish left + A.N. Other is still our strongest side. That's ok. I'd still argue Grealish left, Traore centrally and AEG right, is a better option than what we're currently playing. Traore simply is better centrally. AEG might not like the right, but at least he has the attributes to make it work reasonably well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eholm Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 39 minutes ago, dudevillaisnice said: Modern football I’m afraid. We haven’t won anything of note for a while. We have made a lot of improvement this season and I’m sure if we continue at this improvement level we are bound to win something of note eventually but that’s just it eventually... equally a footballers career is short and Jack I’m sure wants to win things at the end of the day. It would set us back as a club back if he were to leave. Anyway it’s one for next summer. Hopefully United drop off. Good post. I don’t see it as a ‘loser’ mentality to be realistic that one of the best players in the PL will both want to play at the highest level and will clearly get that opportunity from another club. As had been said, we are prob at least 3 seasons away from challenging top 4 and by then Jack will be 28. I hate to say it but we can’t expect him to stay for that long. He is a phenomenal player and in my 40+ years of watching the Villa, probably the best I have seen. He needs to be challenging for titles and CL medals - and he will want fo that before we are in a position to offer him that its not a loser mind set it is a realistic acceptance that this is the way the modern game works. Jack himself said just after signing the contract that he didn’t know where he would be playing this season so clearly there were talks and interest. I am certain that Lange has a Jack replacement high on his list of priorities as unless we challenge top 4 next season he will be gone. Your best players will always move on to more successful clubs - even Utd lost Ronaldo to Madrid. One day we may be in a position where WE are able to attract the best players in the world by consistently challenging at the very top; until then Jack won’t be the first and definitely won’t be the last to move onto bigger and better things. Realism NOT resignation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 Not a personal dig at anyone but we're not a big club anymore. You can thank our stint in the championship for that. To be a big club you need to be sustaining title challenges, winning trophies, getting champions League, winning league titles and buying the best players. We've got the right ingredients for that now but we've been a shambles for so long people have forgotten we were the first giants of the game. Jack wants CL football and trophies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 1 hour ago, dudevillaisnice said: Modern football I’m afraid. We haven’t won anything of note for a while. We have made a lot of improvement this season and I’m sure if we continue at this improvement level we are bound to win something of note eventually It's not though. Modern football isn't thinking like a loser. You are correct in what you're saying. We haven't won anything for a while, but there's that and thinking like you won't ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 12 minutes ago, eholm said: Good post. I don’t see it as a ‘loser’ mentality to be realistic that one of the best players in the PL will both want to play at the highest level and will clearly get that opportunity from another club. As had been said, we are prob at least 3 seasons away from challenging top 4 and by then Jack will be 28. I hate to say it but we can’t expect him to stay for that long. He is a phenomenal player and in my 40+ years of watching the Villa, probably the best I have seen. He needs to be challenging for titles and CL medals - and he will want fo that before we are in a position to offer him that its not a loser mind set it is a realistic acceptance that this is the way the modern game works. Jack himself said just after signing the contract that he didn’t know where he would be playing this season so clearly there were talks and interest. I am certain that Lange has a Jack replacement high on his list of priorities as unless we challenge top 4 next season he will be gone. Your best players will always move on to more successful clubs - even Utd lost Ronaldo to Madrid. One day we may be in a position where WE are able to attract the best players in the world by consistently challenging at the very top; until then Jack won’t be the first and definitely won’t be the last to move onto bigger and better things. Realism NOT resignation. That's not what's said either. What was said is that we should bend over and let him leave to get trophies. Which is the same small time loser mentality we had with Barry, Young, Milner etc. It's time to get past that and rather think that we need to build to achieve those trophies here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eholm Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 46 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: That's not what's said either. What was said is that we should bend over and let him leave to get trophies. Which is the same small time loser mentality we had with Barry, Young, Milner etc. It's time to get past that and rather think that we need to build to achieve those trophies here. It’s a valiant sentiment, however, the realistic machinations of football will trump sentiment all day long. If a player wants to leave he will leave - simple. There is no way that we can keep Jack if he seeks a more elite challenge for trophies. That’s not bending over, that’s football imo. Good to have differing opinions and I’m sure that enjoying Jack whilst he is here is something we can all agree on - however long that may be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Sulberto21 said: Not a personal dig at anyone but we're not a big club anymore. You can thank our stint in the championship for that. To be a big club you need to be sustaining title challenges, winning trophies, getting champions League, winning league titles and buying the best players. We've got the right ingredients for that now but we've been a shambles for so long people have forgotten we were the first giants of the game. Jack wants CL football and trophies. What a crock of shit! So by your reckoning Leicester are a bigger club than us based on recent history? Lol. You ever heard of the term 'sleeping giants'? Big clubs fall on hard times all the time. They don't stop being big though. Man City for example. Will never be bigger than the scum half of that city. Doesn't matter how successful they are they just won't. They've won titles galore in recent years yet couldn't fill the ground weekly even when successful. Why is that? Would we struggle to fill ours if we had that success? The likes of City, Chelsea etc are far more successful than us in recent years. Still not bigger clubs though. Make no mistake as poor as we have been until recently the size of a club is not only judged by what you have won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMelvillan Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 Popped on to redcafe, the man utd forum for the craic and jeez, if you think we love jack on here you should take a look at that lot. He has his own thread with 8 or 9 pages since yesterdays game. All want to sign him, obviously, many think he is a nob, many believe he is a utd fan, most think he is gettable, quite a few with an unhealthy obsession over the size of his calves. One particularly charming chap admitted that he would gladly stab a baby to sign him . £100m seems to be the concensus on what he would cost them this summer. But no one baulking at that price as they think he would help them win the league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROTTERDAM1982 Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 He won't go before next summer, 2022, so , for me, we have 18 months, 3 transfer windows, to buy players , either to replace him, or encourage him to stay. A good striker this transfer window, and Barkley in the summer,as long as he proves his fitness, would be a minimum for me. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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