Popular Post Stevo985 Posted October 9, 2020 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted October 9, 2020 I think Southgate just has a very rigid style he likes to play and Grealish isn't ideally suited. Southgate is safe. He likes the team to be relatively defensively sound and he seems to just want people to move the ball back and forth and probe for openings. It's like an Aldi version of Pep football that makes for an incredibly boring watch. I think part of his problem with Jack is Jack obviously likes to hold onto the ball, dribble, take players on etc and that doesn't sit right with Gareth because he sees it as not moving the ball etc. What he should be doing is seeing that his system doesn't always work and having a player like Jack that can COMPLIMENT his style is absolutely ideal. Time will tell if he's stubborn enough to ignore him 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted October 9, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted October 9, 2020 I hope he doesn't play against Belgium. I can see them twatting us with Southgate’s lackwit management. I would rather Jack isn't part of that. He will then get loads of pressure and a lot of it will about the fact we got twatted without him playing Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 9, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 9, 2020 1 minute ago, Stevo985 said: I think Southgate just has a very rigid style he likes to play and Grealish isn't ideally suited. Southgate is safe. He likes the team to be relatively defensively sound and he seems to just want people to move the ball back and forth and probe for openings. It's like an Aldi version of Pep football that makes for an incredibly boring watch. I think part of his problem with Jack is Jack obviously likes to hold onto the ball, dribble, take players on etc and that doesn't sit right with Gareth because he sees it as not moving the ball etc. What he should be doing is seeing that his system doesn't always work and having a player like Jack that can COMPLIMENT his style is absolutely ideal. Time will tell if he's stubborn enough to ignore him I think Southgate doesn't have a genuinely reliable defence & goalkeeper, and so compensates by trying to have the midfield more defensive minded. He's got a wealth of good and pacy attackers. I think he's quite flexible on formations and stuff. 3-4-3, 5-3-2, 4-4-2... At the moment he's experimenting, and last night was a big experiment - the team he put out had (I think they said on the telly) only 50 odd caps between them. First half they played like strangers, second half they'd pretty much sorted it out and were miles better. He found some good new players for England, and did that because he was willing to put out such an experimental line up. I agree, I don't like the 2 holding midfielders either and you're dead right that Jack could and should be the magic ingredient in England's best side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 8 minutes ago, sidcow said: I hope he doesn't play against Belgium. I can see them twatting us with Southgate’s lackwit management. I would rather Jack isn't part of that. He will then get loads of pressure and a lot of it will about the fact we got twatted without him playing Jack. Totally agree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 14 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: I think Southgate just has a very rigid style he likes to play and Grealish isn't ideally suited. Southgate is safe. He likes the team to be relatively defensively sound and he seems to just want people to move the ball back and forth and probe for openings. It's like an Aldi version of Pep football that makes for an incredibly boring watch. I think part of his problem with Jack is Jack obviously likes to hold onto the ball, dribble, take players on etc and that doesn't sit right with Gareth because he sees it as not moving the ball etc. What he should be doing is seeing that his system doesn't always work and having a player like Jack that can COMPLIMENT his style is absolutely ideal. Time will tell if he's stubborn enough to ignore him those openings being 40 yard+ balls in to space down the channels behind the full backs for the winger to run on to, ings and grealish don't stand a chance playing that way surprised last night how keen on it lee Dixon was, kept repeating the problem vs Denmark was the attacking players kept wanting the ball played in short to feet...you know like actual proper good football...the biggest frustration with southgate is we have players capable of doing it but a manager who isnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 11 minutes ago, blandy said: i agree, I don't like the 2 holding midfielders either and you're dead right that Jack could and should be the magic ingredient in England's best side. I think both winks and phillips are better than how he has them playing too, both are more adventurous, he's shackled them along with the full backs it badly needs Henderson back in there to see what the plan is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, villa4europe said: I think both winks and phillips are better than how he has them playing too, both are more adventurous, he's shackled them along with the full backs it badly needs Henderson back in there to see what the plan is It was utterly ridiculous to play 3 centre backs and 2 wing backs with 2 holding midfielders in front of them. It just leaves a massive gap in front of them before you get to the front three. How can someone like Southgate, who was a very good player, not see that his tactics are woeful. Just shows how good Grealish is that he still shone even in such an awful system. 7 defensive players at home to Wales? Really? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted October 9, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted October 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Okonokos said: My dad is a blues fan and he consistently says that Grealish is one of the best players he's ever seen. They know. I know loads of. Blues fans, they say the same through gritted teeth. Last night Jack looked lethargic and he was still our best player. Our boys gonna be a massive star despite all the negativity, Southgate's behavior is a disgrace tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 F365 with a little shot at Southgate Quote Rating the players: England 3-0 Wales A fresh England side had plenty of positives from victory over Wales. Jack Grealish is quite good, eh? HARRY WINKS Was sent to the shop by Jonny Williams in the 30th minute and decided not to return. Pretty controversial when you think about it. KALVIN PHILLIPS Find yourself someone who loves you a fraction of the amount Phillips adores a diagonal. Far more effective on the ball than Winks in terms of accuracy and ambition, and feels like the better long-term option for England’s sort of quarterback role if the two are in any sort of direct competition. That is now something we should all wish to see in an ampitheatre surrounded by lions with top knots. JACK GREALISH He was alright but Mason Mount played really well. MASON MOUNT Alright, chill out. Mount was actually great in his little cameo, linking up wonderfully and showing the sort of energy Southgate will love. But Grealish was phenomenal. His cross for Calvert-Lewin was the first moment of genuine quality from either team, displaying the sort of game-defining talent that can no longer be ignored. Any suggestion that he is not tactically fluid enough and England do not have a system that suits him can be summarily dismissed as utter codswallop old boy. You find room for that, whatever the cost. https://www.football365.com/news/england-player-ratings-wales-grealish-coady-calvert-lewin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 13 minutes ago, Okonokos said: It was utterly ridiculous to play 3 centre backs and 2 wing backs with 2 holding midfielders in front of them. It just leaves a massive gap in front of them before you get to the front three. How can someone like Southgate, who was a very good player, not see that his tactics are woeful. Just shows how good Grealish is that he still shone even in such an awful system. 7 defensive players at home to Wales? Really? that's annoyingly why he is right with his praise of mount, he does link the midfield with the attack but at the same time that's because he gives mount more freedom to go forward than he does phillips and winks whilst also finally letting the wing backs cross the half way line the tactical tweak that comes with the last 2 sub appearances mount has made is how England should set up from the start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, villa4europe said: that's annoyingly why he is right with his praise of mount, he does link the midfield with the attack but at the same time that's because he gives mount more freedom to go forward than he does phillips and winks whilst also finally letting the wing backs cross the half way line the tactical tweak that comes with the last 2 sub appearances mount has made is how England should set up from the start I've got nothing against Mount. He's a good player and Southgate is right to praise him but how he keeps dismissing Grealish and changing the topic when asked about him is really odd and makes him look a bit pathetic. Mount is good but Grealish is special. That's the difference. Mount offers things that other players offer whereas Grealish has something no other player has. He's a once in a generation talent. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 10 hours ago, A'Villan said: Are you playing funny buggers with me? In case you would actually like to know, I don't seek to create issues for others or talk down about people as a pastime. If I were to be unfair with him, then wouldn't I be perpetuating the sort of behaviour that has made people take issue with Southgate's treatment of our Jack? It was just an off the cuff comment. I’m pretty sure it won’t change how Southgate manages England or his strange treatment of Jack. The moral high ground is all yours. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarryOnVilla Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Stevo985 said: I think Southgate just has a very rigid style he likes to play and Grealish isn't ideally suited. Southgate is safe. He likes the team to be relatively defensively sound and he seems to just want people to move the ball back and forth and probe for openings. It's like an Aldi version of Pep football that makes for an incredibly boring watch. I think part of his problem with Jack is Jack obviously likes to hold onto the ball, dribble, take players on etc and that doesn't sit right with Gareth because he sees it as not moving the ball etc. What he should be doing is seeing that his system doesn't always work and having a player like Jack that can COMPLIMENT his style is absolutely ideal. Time will tell if he's stubborn enough to ignore him I’d say this is the mostly likely reality... also Jack is probably in the most competitive England squad there’s been in ages. Just look at the positions jack plays in. ALW, Sterling and Rashford. ACM, Maddison and MAsOn mOunT. All these players are good, real good. If we take our Villa caps off, and look at it objectively, it’s a hard choice. One positive from this situation is Jack’s desire to be part of the England set up has made him work harder and become a far more consistent performer.. it’s brilliant, if he keeps it up, he’s going to be increasingly undeniable. Edited October 9, 2020 by CarryOnVilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, CarryOnVilla said: I’d say this is the mostly likely reality... also Jack is probably in the most competitive England squad there’s been in ages. Just look at the positions jack plays in. ALW, Sterling and Rashford. ACM, Maddison and MAsOn mOunT. All these players are good, real good. If we take our Villa caps off, and look at it objectively, it’s a hard choice. Maddison is every bit as bizarre as jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarryOnVilla Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Just now, villa4europe said: Maddison is every bit as bizarre as jack Both brilliant players, I’d love to see them play together, if it’s possible. The reasons why jack hasn’t been picked before, is Probably the same reason why Maddison wasn’t picked this time or last time. (Unless he’s injured?) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blunther Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 (edited) It's probably better for us it's taken so long for Grealish to get into the England set up. If he'd got in years ago he'd have been snapped up when we had our financial troubles, if not earlier, or he'd definitely have gone this summer. Now he's got a shiny new contract and we look decent, he'll hopefully stay. It says it all that people were surprised how good he was last night, when we all know that was a pretty mediocre performance in an unfamilair team for our Jack. People obviously just haven't been watching little unfashionable Aston Villa. I get that of opposition fans, in the same way I'm not going to go out of my way to watch say Burnley vs Southampton, but it's lazy from pundits. Keane last night giving out lazy tropes like his lack of end product over the last few seasons. His end-product has been fine, but what's happened there is Keane has looked how many assists he's got the last few years and drawn his conclusions, without considering the lack of quality players around Jack. This laziness suits us, but it does show just how many people high up in football haven't got the first clue about anything. Our Jack is a generational talent, and will probably end up being the best player I see play for Villa in my lifetime, past and future. He should be one of, if not the first name on the teamsheet for England, and Southgate will waste these Euros playing his formulaic football-by-numbers. Though he'll probably get us through to a QF or Sf if we get a good draw, and hang on to his job from that. The future doesn't seem any brighter, I assume Boothroyd is being groomed to succeed Southgate, since the only qualification needed is to manage the U21s. This next 5-6 years through to WC2026 is England's best chance to win something since 1996, and it's going to be wasted because the daft old bollocks at the FA want a clean-cut Yes Man in charge. Edited October 9, 2020 by blunther 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, CarryOnVilla said: Both brilliant players, I’d love to see them play together, if it’s possible. The reasons why jack hasn’t been picked before, is Probably the same reason why Maddison wasn’t picked this time or last time. (Unless he’s injured?) He likes to play football... I think they work together if jack is on the left, depending on sancho a 3 of jack, maddison and sterling behind kane is frightening with then rashford and sancho as out and out pacey wingers, which is what Southgate wants, he wants runners not footballers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Looking from the outside and someone who doesn't really follow the English national side from what I've seen Southgate want's to play a somewhat defensive oriented, lower possession based football relying on pacy wide players and transitions, set pieces and Kane falling down in and around the penalty area to score goals. Grealish doesn't really fit into this style. Then again I don't watch most England games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Southgate is thinking about when we come across the better teams. He is considering results rather than performance. So whilst this defending approach is horrible against weak teams it’s how he wants the team to learn how to play so they can grind out in result in tournament football. If we bore the country but get to the semi finals or final of the Euros nobody will complain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarryOnVilla Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 1 minute ago, villa4europe said: He likes to play football... I think they work together if jack is on the left, depending on sancho a 3 of jack, maddison and sterling behind kane is frightening with then rashford and sancho as out and out pacey wingers, which is what Southgate wants, he wants runners not footballers The possibilities for England’s attack. is mouthwatering. yes, that’s where I’m at, it appears Gareth wants runners. Everything about Southgate’s set up is safe. Safe passes, safe probing and and safe through balls for runners to pick up. but I suppose it’s the best he can do with the short time he has with the players. Yet, it’s so boring to watch. I swear watching his England play football is the most boring thing on earth. Even Sean Dyche would be nodding off watching that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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