7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Jay.P.A said: I've got to agree with DDID. He's learning from the one of the best captains, John Terry. He's learning how to use his influence as captain to dictate how the match should be officiated, and protect himself. I don't see any other captain doing anything different to be fair. Jack's instrumental to this team both physically and mentally. He’s losing his temper. There’s no profound thought behind it. He’s not mapping out out how he he wants the opposition to react, no tactics. Just losing his rag. I think some people have some claret tinted specs on when it comes to Jack. You are right though, having Terry there will be huge for him if we go up this year and he stays, I think he’ll be an even bigger influence on him over a longer period of time. As I said before, I wasn’t having a pop at him, and that with the right mentoring he will know when and where is the right time to pipe up and when not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, 7392craig said: He’s losing his temper. There’s no profound thought behind it. He’s not mapping out out how he he wants the opposition to react, no tactics. Just losing his rag. When? Sunday was a fairly unique situation, almost nobody kept their cool. I feel like you're making this up but if you have any further evidence please present it and I'm ready to review my opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: When? Sunday was a fairly unique situation, almost nobody kept their cool. I feel like you're making this up but if you have any further evidence please present it and I'm ready to review my opinion. Sunday was unique and certainly something I’m not blaming Jack for. For some reason you think that my original post was because of that game, I have never said that. And I’m certainly not combing through previous games to find you videos of Jack losing his temper. We both know he does. It’s whether you feel it’s the right thing to do or not, I do not. Somebody posted that it’s Jacks job to complain to the referee, that I believe is also correct. As I keep saying, it’s that he shouldn’t be kicking off with opposition players. Aggression in the game is something we’ve been missing, not off the ball incidents where you could be sent off and I believe it’s the captain who should be setting an example to the other players. Again, it’s probably not worth going any further as I feel we’re just not going to agree on this. edit: Looking back on this, I can see that the timing of my original post would make it seem that I was blaming Jack for incidents such as the one against Leeds. Let me make the point that I am absolutely not. Edited May 1, 2019 by 7392craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 16 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: When? Sunday was a fairly unique situation, almost nobody kept their cool. I feel like you're making this up but if you have any further evidence please present it and I'm ready to review my opinion. Also, what possible reason could I have for making this up? Have I ever posted anything on this forum to suggest that that is something I would do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 1 minute ago, 7392craig said: Also, what possible reason could I have for making this up? Have I ever posted anything on this forum to suggest that that is something I would do? Give an example then. It’s easy enough to do if you’ve seen it with the regularity you’re implying, surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, bobzy said: Give an example then. It’s easy enough to do if you’ve seen it with the regularity you’re implying, surely? Any foul that he’s still not on the ground from he usually gets up and gets in the face of the opposition. Now I know that it’s the reaction of most players after a foul, I just think that you’re giving the opposition a chance to either play act like Bamford did the other other day. Or the rest of our players join in and could potentially get themselves booked. Honestly would you rather he did that or just laugh at the player and complain to the referee so the other player gets booked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelle Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 I was actually on a swedish leeds forum recently. Long story short Jack came up as a subject. One guy said he hates Jack, but fair enough mostly because he's so good and hard to take the ball from. I said that I can imagine why other fans hate him, if nothing else so just for possibly being the best player in the league. Then another guy came around and said that he wasn't close to being the best in the league, and started to compare him to Hernandez and Phillips saying they had more assists and goals to their tally. As I was on their forum I tried to be kind of diplomatic and didn't go against him. Fair enough to the other guys on that forum they took him down quite fast saying they'd love to have Jack in the team and that the comparison to Hernandez was ridiculous. So I guess they're not all that bad. And now that guy, who didn't think much of Jack, started to go on about how unfair the league is as Hourihane wasn't punished for that "punch". I'll stay away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Have to be honest, I kinda get the sense Jack is captain in name only. For me, the leader on the pitch is Mings, I watched the Leeds game back the other night and Mings was front and centre for every flashpoint, calming the situation down with his majestic 8 foot frame. Even when Adomah 'scored' and started giving some shit to Jansson, it was Mings who was there first to step in. I love Jack, but I think I love Mings even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Pelle said: I was actually on a swedish leeds forum recently. Long story short Jack came up as a subject. One guy said he hates Jack, but fair enough mostly because he's so good and hard to take the ball from. I said that I can imagine why other fans hate him, if nothing else so just for possibly being the best player in the league. Then another guy came around and said that he wasn't close to being the best in the league, and started to compare him to Hernandez and Phillips saying they had more assists and goals to their tally. As I was on their forum I tried to be kind of diplomatic and didn't go against him. Fair enough to the other guys on that forum they took him down quite fast saying they'd love to have Jack in the team and that the comparison to Hernandez was ridiculous. So I guess they're not all that bad. And now that guy, who didn't think much of Jack, started to go on about how unfair the league is as Hourihane wasn't punished for that "punch". I'll stay away. There’s no reason for any opposition fans to hate him other than jealousy. He’s comfortably the most talented player in the league. People point out his goals and assists against him but what about his key pass stat? I think he’s the highest in the league even with all the games he’s missed. If there was a stat for assist of an assist he’d be walking it and would get much more praise. Edited May 1, 2019 by 7392craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay.P.A Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 1 hour ago, 7392craig said: He’s losing his temper. There’s no profound thought behind it. He’s not mapping out out how he he wants the opposition to react, no tactics. Just losing his rag. I think some people have some claret tinted specs on when it comes to Jack. You are right though, having Terry there will be huge for him if we go up this year and he stays, I think he’ll be an even bigger influence on him over a longer period of time. As I said before, I wasn’t having a pop at him, and that with the right mentoring he will know when and where is the right time to pipe up and when not. Can only be a good thing though mate. For too long we've been a team of, excuse my french, pussies. For you to see how a captain should behave - look at the Blues game. Even Blues fans were saying fair play to Jack Grealish, who is their no.1 public enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Just now, Jay.P.A said: Can only be a good thing though mate. For too long we've been a team of, excuse my french, pussies. For you to see how a captain should behave - look at the Blues game. Even Blues fans were saying fair play to Jack Grealish, who is their no.1 public enemy. Perhaps I am looking for a bit too much, I’d just prefer him to be the one calming the players down and walking them away from altercations. It’s easy to forget how young he is, and I’ve said I wouldn’t take the armband off him as I do believe he has the right people guiding him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay.P.A Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Roy Keane, Patrick Viera, John Terry, Steven Gerrard, Ramos, Puyol, etc were all different types of captains - but all consistently were talking in ref's ear during the game. Call it trying to gain a tactical advantage or just trying to sway the ref - it's what captains do. I don't think Dean Smith and the coaching team have a problem with it, and to be honest, Jack hasn't even been in trouble for it. He's not one to lose his temper and do something - he might display his temper, but doesn't act on it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 (edited) I actually think he's been quite professional for some time. The amount of times he gets kicked around on the pitch and just takes it in his stride, well it's quite impressive. Pretty sure most of us would have lost our shit several times. Not to mention how he handled being assaulted in the derby. Edited May 1, 2019 by KenjiOgiwara 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnyp Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 58 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: When? Sunday was a fairly unique situation, almost nobody kept their cool. I feel like you're making this up but if you have any further evidence please present it and I'm ready to review my opinion. It wasnt really. I thought jack was a bit whiny personally against Rotherham. Getting fouled yes but staying on your arse giving the ref and the opponent an earful is a bit annoying at times. I don't buy this " he needs to bring it to the attention of the ref " He doesn't . The ref will do his job. The footballer theirs. When he gets into this mindset he doesn't affect a game as he should . When he is on it, he's fantastic. Top players influence the game by what they do with the ball. If they get fouled, get on with. He was losing the rag with Phillips fouling him in non threatening positions on Sunday. 20 yards from goal fair enough but it wasn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7392craig Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 1 minute ago, Jay.P.A said: Roy Keane, Patrick Viera, John Terry, Steven Gerrard, Ramos, Puyol, etc were all different types of captains - but all consistently were talking in ref's ear during the game. Call it trying to gain a tactical advantage or just trying to sway the ref - it's what captains do. I don't think Dean Smith and the coaching team have a problem with it, and to be honest, Jack hasn't even been in trouble for it. He's not one to lose his temper and do something - he might display his temper, but doesn't act on it. Talking to the ref is fine, I think all captains should be trying to sway the ref as all the others will be doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelle Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 2 hours ago, 7392craig said: There’s no reason for any opposition fans to hate him other than jealousy. He’s comfortably the most talented player in the league. People point out his goals and assists against him but what about his key pass stat? I think he’s the highest in the league even with all the games he’s missed. If there was a stat for assist of an assist he’d be walking it and would get much more praise. Well, of course it's mostly because of jealousy. Had he been an average player they wouldn't care. Just as I hated Bale when he played for spuds. He was constantly diving, but he was also a phenomenal player and that made it worse. Not saying Jack is diving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 1 hour ago, 7392craig said: Talking to the ref is fine, I think all captains should be trying to sway the ref as all the others will be doing it. But if it’s about fouls against you personally, it seems to the crowd and importantly to the referee that you are just whining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czechlad Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Grealish is like Messi being captain. He is the best player on the team, so he gets the arm band. But the real captain is Mings and Whelan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted May 1, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted May 1, 2019 Players like Grealish need protection, you can't have a situation where legs are broken because the opposing team can't cope with them. Grealish is a once in a generation player and the tackle that went in on him Sunday could have took him out the game for 12 months. If we allow the thugs in the game to claim flair players are moaning when career ending tackles are coming in then we're really up against it . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cjay Posted May 1, 2019 Visiting Supporter Share Posted May 1, 2019 4 hours ago, 7392craig said: There’s no reason for any opposition fans to hate him other than jealousy. He’s comfortably the most talented player in the league. People point out his goals and assists against him but what about his key pass stat? I think he’s the highest in the league even with all the games he’s missed. If there was a stat for assist of an assist he’d be walking it and would get much more praise. Hernandez mate by quite a distance, only player with over 100 chances created in the league and most per game by some way, think Norwood is 2nd with about 95, Hernandez is on 115 i think, Grealish is miles down overall (but obviously has had injuries tbf), quite high per game i think, top 10, but last stat i saw the top 5 per game were Hernandez, Buendia, Benrahma, Norwood and someone random, cant remember who, Ben Marshall maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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