snowychap Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Getting skittled in Barbados. 49 for 7 having been 30 for 1 at lunch. Edited January 24, 2019 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 No match practice every time and guess what we start appallingly with the bat. Broad should have played too. This series is a write off already now after one spell of 30 overs ( what a joke that is ) and we may as well just use our second innings to learn how to bat against them. Still think we can win the series. Just need to win the toss next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Talking of collapses - WI have gone from 52 for 0 to 61 for 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I wonder if it is reasonable to suggest that the problem lies with our batting !! If I remember correctly ,they suffered a similar awful score against The Black Caps. Which would leave me to conclude that maybe the batting coach is not up to the job; I think I posted earlier in this thread that I thought Ramprakash was an odd choice, bearing in mind his performances against top level opposition. I readily admit to a SLIGHT bias but surely Jonathon Trott could have done a better job and I wonder if the bowlers are getting fed up with these poor performances. As for not picking Broad … words fail me...... when the Windies picked tall, fast bowlers for this wicket. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 The selection of Curran or Rashid over Broad was a mistake, one that's glaring in hindsight, but at the time of the toss, I think it was a closer call. They weren't so sure how the pitch was going to behave... BUT they might have had a better idea if they had had two or three matches to get some damn practice in. I very much echo what Aggers goes on about in terms of preparation. You've also got a skipper who was playing T20 for weeks before flying out before the tour. I'm prepared to give the batsman some benefit in a sense because of the lack of practice - plus credit must be given to really good west indies bowling. Certainly, I won't be judging Burns too severely until he's given a chance to bed into the side in home conditions. But we collapse so quickly under the faintest of pressures. Mentally Mo has become like Broad, his batting is so fluffy and weak. He's fine when we're in a good position, and there to accelerate the scoring but any pressure and he's utterly poo. I'd drop him down the order to no.10 on current form, have him there as spinner only. Curran has the talent to move up. For the next Test, Broad coming back in is a given, probably instead of Rashid, and personally I would bring Woakes back in for Curran. Woakes was so unlucky, got that smashing 100 at Lords, an injury sidelines him briefly and he's not got back in the side ( though not playing in Sri Lanka probably was a benefit for his average mind ) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 1 hour ago, veloman said: I wonder if it is reasonable to suggest that the problem lies with our batting !! If I remember correctly ,they suffered a similar awful score against The Black Caps. Which would leave me to conclude that maybe the batting coach is not up to the job; I think I posted earlier in this thread that I thought Ramprakash was an odd choice, bearing in mind his performances against top level opposition. I readily admit to a SLIGHT bias but surely Jonathon Trott could have done a better job and I wonder if the bowlers are getting fed up with these poor performances. As for not picking Broad … words fail me...... when the Windies picked tall, fast bowlers for this wicket. It seemed strange seeing Thorpe and Collingwood in the Sky studio. Thorpe I believe has been the ODI batting coach and we've been the best in the world in that form, and he was an exceptional Test batsman too, and Colly is highly thought of. England Lions are on tour as well, and I believe Trott is out there with them as batting coach. Not sure how Ramps is seen as better than them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 25, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 25, 2019 Genuine fast bowling blows England away every time. In Australia, in the Windies, anywhere. There's not many quicks of genuine pace in England - the only time the batters face extreme pace is in the tests, and they're (unsurprisingly) unprepared. On top of that, England is blessed with a whole bunch of excellent all-rounders - either WK/Batsmen or bowler/batsmen, but a shortage of top order quality batters. We're spoilt for middle- lower order players, but have only Joe Root who's proven test match standard top order batter. So it'll keep happening. Selecting Broad or Curran is neither here nor there, as a cause. Broad's a much better bowler, Curran yet another all rounder. It was the wrong pick, but not the cause. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, blandy said: Genuine fast bowling blows England away every time. In Australia, in the Windies, anywhere. There's not many quicks of genuine pace in England - the only time the batters face extreme pace is in the tests, and they're (unsurprisingly) unprepared. On top of that, England is blessed with a whole bunch of excellent all-rounders - either WK/Batsmen or bowler/batsmen, but a shortage of top order quality batters. We're spoilt for middle- lower order players, but have only Joe Root who's proven test match standard top order batter. So it'll keep happening. Selecting Broad or Curran is neither here nor there, as a cause. Broad's a much better bowler, Curran yet another all rounder. It was the wrong pick, but not the cause. Indeed, we are always about 40/2 at best and eventually you're going to get occasions where the middle order crumble in a heap like this. I'm not sure there is a lot we can do except trying different players. Jennings is lucky Cook retired and avoid getting dumped before this winter. I'd be tempted to look at Denly instead. Thinking about it, Duncan Fletcher was our best batting coach, perhaps they could get him to work with the batsmen. I'm not sure what he is up to nowadays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Sad to see that Olly Stone has come back from the WI and has been diagnosed with a stress fracture of the back. Seems that our quick bowling prospects are often very injury prone (see also Tongue at Worcs). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 38 minutes ago, snowychap said: Sad to see that Olly Stone has come back from the WI and has been diagnosed with a stress fracture of the back. Seems that our quick bowling prospects are often very injury prone (see also Tongue at Worcs). As Mikey Holding often says bowling fast is a very strange thing to put the human body through. It's not really designed to run up and hurl a ball at 90mph, it's just luck of the draw if you have a body that can cope with it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 8 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said: As Mikey Holding often says bowling fast is a very strange thing to put the human body through. It's not really designed to run up and hurl a ball at 90mph, it's just luck of the draw if you have a body that can cope with it. True. It appears that we are more unfortunate than others, though (perhaps that's only perception rather than correct). And then we (the national side/coaches) try and cock up others like Finn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 What the almighty ****? How do we let them put on almost 300 for the 7th wicket? That's just a crackers scorecard. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 1 hour ago, snowychap said: What the almighty ****? How do we let them put on almost 300 for the 7th wicket? That's just a crackers scorecard. Very flat pitch and very flat bowling. Holder is turning into one of the best cricketers in the world, a few years ago I thought he'd never fulfil his promise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 I blame Steve Bruce. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 On 26/01/2019 at 01:25, veloman said: I thought Ramprakash was an odd choice, bearing in mind his performances against top level opposition. It's interesting that England's batsmen look great at times but cave in under the slightest pressure, just like Ramprakash did. It's also interesting that Australia's batting coach is Graeme Hick - and the Australia batsmen look great at times but cave in under the slightest pressure, just like Hick did. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Yep - a brilliant comment MrDuck; I didn't see that comparison until you pointed it out. And both scored a plenty of runs at County level IIRC. So , England have dropped Jennings and brought in Denly . Hmmm , well I'm all for dropping Lancashire players but I'm not sure about this; has he had a long enough run ? Don't know if Broad has been brought back and therefore has Moeen Ali gone ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Squad is Burns, Denly, Bairstow, Root, Stokes, Buttler, Ali, Foakes, Curran, Broad, Leach Anderson so a 12 man squad. No Woakes sadly. Personally I would drop Moeen and play Leach instead. Mo is offering nothing with the bat and leach can offer solid enough control one end. Good luck to Mr Denly, too, though my expectations are cautiously low I must admit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 4 hours ago, Rodders said: Squad is Burns, Denly, Bairstow, Root, Stokes, Buttler, Ali, Foakes, Curran, Broad, Leach Anderson so a 12 man squad. No Woakes sadly. Personally I would drop Moeen and play Leach instead. Mo is offering nothing with the bat and leach can offer solid enough control one end. Good luck to Mr Denly, too, though my expectations are cautiously low I must admit. England are 42/3...first three out for single figures. Rubbish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 55/4. Aside from Bairstow counter punching with a few 4s, it's been another pathetic display. Though Root's ball was unplayable mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) Whilst I'm not expecting them to be in a massively sombre state, I'm not sure it's a great look having the England captain sporting a huge smile and having a good old laugh with Stokes when his side are 111-6. Edited January 31, 2019 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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