Bollitics: VT General Election Poll #3 - GE Week One

[Chindie]

Simon Schama does seem to have a thing about expressive hands. He's almost camp.

As for the show generally, Schama may as well not be there, Miliband has come across reasonably well but he has that aura of slimey and has toed the party line proper, Ming Campbell is another Liberal Democrat who has impressed (if he does have a habit of self depreciation that grates after the fifth time), he speaks sense, imo. Theresa May has done the the same as Miliband but somehow, to my mind, come across infinitely worse. And Janet Daley, I just don't like and I'm not sure what she's done.

And we discovered that calling the Tories closeted homophobics is easy but not necessarily accurate. Just a few of them are.

[bickster]

My results

Party

Green Party: 53%

Labour Party: 51%

Liberal Democrats: 50%

Conservative Party: 38%

Which kinda confirms that if I don't spoil my ballot I'll vote Green

[Reality]

Theresa May comes across as the old English teacher nobody liked. Hag.

[tonyh29]

11 % Labour

16% Green Party

58% Tory

68% UKIP

some of the questions are a bit flawed though as they require more than a simple Yes No answer

[LJRM050389]

Labour Party: 66%

Liberal Democrats: 55%

Green Party: 53%

Id say that is about right, I am after all a Labour Party Member

[thetrees]

I clicked all parties, including the ones that I would never consider voting for and got:

BNP 69%

UKIP 69%

Tory 68%

Labour 29%

Lib Dem 13%

Green 11%

Considering that I did not think an English Parliament was important and did not support a referendum on EU membership. However, being concerned about the economy and immigration apparently puts you right up there.

Perhaps I should do it again and remove the parties that I wouldn't vote for!

[drat01]

It seems that the true side of the Tory plans are starting to come out and who will benefit from their "ideas"

Tory cuts in health care will favour advisor who just happens to run private healthcare scheme

One of David Cameron's independent efficiency experts who identified the £12bn spending savings an incoming Conservative government could make this year chairs a private healthcare firm that openly admits it will benefit from NHS spending cutbacks.

Sir Peter Gershon chairs General Healthcare Group, the largest private sector health firm in the UK. The Conservatives have relied on Gershon's analysis of efficiency savings to enable them to promise scrapping most of the government's planned national insurance increase – a move that has left Labour flatfooted at the outset of the election campaign.

.........

When / If the Tory party actually admits how they plan to fund their ideas the people may actually see who they are looking after and how impacted the man in the street will be - i.e. severely - while their "buddies" are left to gain.

The whole thing of this "businessman" endorsing their view is starting to unwind and showing again who and what they favour and it aint the man in street -- it's the man in the mansion

[Jon]

Good cartoon in the Indie today, it showed the 3 parties as horses in a race. The lib dems had the Horse (cable) riding the jockey (clegg), Labour as Mandelson as a jockey whipping a dead horse (brown) and the tories as a trojan horse (with Cameron's face), inside of which were thatcher, Tebbit and some other unidentifed (by me) nasty tory from their (imo) grim past, holding up a sign saying "no gays, blacks or irish".

Spot on.

edit - here it is

Very good.

indeed it is.

so good i thought i'd post it as a pic here, for posterity.

[Jon]

Oh dear. My results:

UK Independence Party: 59%

Liberal Democrats: 54%

British National Party: 46%

Green Party: 45%

Labour Party: 41%

Conservative Party: 35%

really not sure how they get these results, as i'm a big pro european, and am massively in favour of our continued membership of the EU, but there you go.

Still, at least The Tories came out bottom

voted Lib dem in the poll, as that's how i'll be voting in the GE. Them or green.

[tonyh29]

it's the man in the mansion

that should please all the labour MP's then

[Xann]

One of David Cameron's independent efficiency experts who identified the £12bn spending savings an incoming Conservative government could make this year chairs a private healthcare firm that openly admits it will benefit from NHS spending cutbacks.

It's stuff like this that makes my blood boil.

[tonyh29]

really not sure how they get these results

as a lot of us seem to be coming out as UKIP i wonder if they don't run the website and have rigged it

It's stuff like this that makes my blood boil.

the thing is people probably just see the headline and go into blood boil rage ..IF one looks beyond the headline you'd see

Labour has also supported the use of private firms in the NHS.

Gordon Brown has twice appointed Sir Peter as an efficiency adviser.

and there is no suggestion that his report to the Tories was influenced by any benefit that cuts would have to his company.

compare that with what was linked to above and it's not really as blood boiling is it ?

[Xann]

and there is no suggestion that his report to the Tories was influenced by any benefit that cuts would have to his company.

Oh aye.

[Malachite]

Things is everybody but everybody i speak to are sick to death of gobsh*te politicians and corrupt media, they have no idea who they want to vote for, care very little, are sick of listening to the same old spin like, "we will cut this tax" simply because its opposite to what the other main party says and there's some brownie points to be earned, not because they truly believe it has part of there policy.

Think we have reached a point where people no longer believe or care about the notion a none vote or a vote for the Liberal's is a vote for the other party blah blah, just doesn't wash.

This country needs change, ( as does the world) we can't go on in the same old way with blokes like Cameron Brown and Clegg saying all the same old stuff that is simply lip syncing ideas and agendas in the same format that Bevan used ( and before) to come to or get power.

Its like the motor car, we all know the motor car, the combustion engine is dead in the water, its a dinosaur, the world can't sustain it, its time to move on, not to keep something that's allowing a certain clique very rich people supplying a crucial part such as oil to keep supplying that crucial part and keeping them rich, at enormous cost to the rest of us.........that's wrong.

In the same way some very brave people hundreds of years ago stood up and kick started the industrial revolution, we now need that same kind of revolutionary thinking to take a fresh step up that evolutionary scale again, clearly our financial and banking world doesn't work anymore, our political world doesn't work, so common sense says it juts isn't working period. Example, who on here believes politicians, who on here, believes that in the main part these people are egotistical maniacs out for there own gain to enhance there own lives at your cost, this debate about the National Insurance 6billion we've been hearing so much about, who on here gives a toss about national Insurance. When i speak to people they are interested in what keeps money in there pockets such as, WHY DO WE PAY SO MUCH FOR FUEL AT THE PUMP COMPARED TO OUT EUROPEAN COUNTERPARTS, WHY DO WE PAY A TV LICENCE FEE WHEN THERE IS SUCH THINGS AS FREEVIEW, WHY DOES SCOTLAND AND WALES GET FREE PRESCRIPTIONS AND OUR PENSIONERS UP TO 70 ODD HAVE TO PAY, most people i know say these are the real things taking money our of people's pockets every year that all add up to being the real drain on all of us.

( the capitals are not shouting just emphasising the points that people make to me).

I have no idea who i will vote for if i bother, i think, like times of war maybe a hung parliament will get the best heads together across all parties and get the nation of the mire.

Not a rant guys just what people say to me...........cheers.

[kidlewis]

Hung Parliaments would only work when the parties are willing to compromise otherwise nothing would get done. Look at Italy.

It would benefit the LD's no matter what happens. At the very least they will have a couple of people in the cabinet (Cable and someone else most likely), which would give them more of an everyday presence in the role of government rather than just interviews with Cable and the odd question with Clegg in the middle of PMQ's.

What we need it to focus attentions on key matters.

I believe that the high speed rail link it crucial and needs significant time and investment and needs to be done properly. At the moment it looks like a half arsed effort. Nice try but needs work.

I think VAT could be the one to increase rather than NI. for every 0.5% added to VAT, it would bring in £500m. Now any increase would be passed onto the consumer anyway and you would get the odd big company who would soak up a 0.5%-1.0% increase to advertise how awesome they are that they aren't upping their prices.

I think it would be fairer than just putting up NI. Because you are only targeting people who spend quite a bit of money on goods each month. We are talking about 50p-£1 on something worth £100.

I would also put up duty on tobacco, but not by a massive amount. At the moment the tax burden on your average 20 pack is £4.82. Up that by 18p to £5 making a pack of fags about £6.50 for a big name brand. I see more people smoking roll ups now which is probably why.

VAT alone on cigarettes was £1.8bn with excise I propose going up by 18p (3.7%) that would equate to an extra £326m.

So if you up VAT to 18.5% and add 18p onto a pack of fags (and similarly to other tobacco products) then thats about £1bn-£1.35bn.

I would imagine spending would go down slightly due to these small increases but still that's another £1bn generated.

From figures I have looked at it appears VAT generates 75% that of NI and I think charging people who have money to spend in the recession a bit more is better than taxing everyone an extra 1% on their wages, because some people who work still might not have the money to spend on anything other than petrol and groceries.

Beer and Cider duty has gone up anyway, although are they not backing down on the cider tax?

I think Council Taxes have gone up everywhere from chatting to friends and family. Ours has gone up by nearly £10 a month, so councils and government will be reducing their shortfalls no doubt.

EDIT: We can only really go on the figures we can get hold of. Does anyone have any other hair brained ideas to try and increase revenue without hitting everyone? or perhaps a fairer way of bringing in revenue other than a blanket NI rise?

I would love to see some tax on utility companies without the ability for them to pass it onto the consumer. The amount people pay for elec and gas and the profits the companies end up making as a result is a bit disgraceful.

I don't mind paying 50p per month for this broadband tax, I think the internet is an important part of life now. So much so I think computer science should be a core subject in school, from building a computer to operating day to day programs like excel, word, even photoshop and powerpoint and basic HTML.

[TheWalletInspector]

Immigration was at the centre of the election campaign today as it emerged that virtually every extra job created under Labour has gone to a foreign worker.

Figures suggested an extraordinary 98.5 per cent of 1.67million new posts were taken by immigrants.

The Tories seized on the revelation as evidence that the Government has totally failed to deliver its pledge of 'British jobs for British workers'.

Mr and Mrs Brown speak to members of the public during a phonebank session at the Labour Party headquarters

Mr Brown, seen speaking to members of the public during a phonebank session at the Labour Party headquarters, said he opposes an immigration quota

As Gordon Brown tried to fight on the economy and cleaning up politics, he was confronted in the Commons about how British people of working age have lost out.

Shadow immigration minister Damian Green revealed unpublished figures showing there are almost 730,000 fewer British-born workers in the private sector than in 1997.

Mr Green said the Tories would reduce net migration to tens of thousands a year from the peaks of 200,000 under Labour by enforcing an annual cap.

Mr Brown rejected the idea of an immigration quota, which he said would do 'great damage to British business'.

But Mr Green said the official figures were 'the final proof that Gordon Brown was misleading the public when he promised British jobs for British workers'.

He added: 'Instead he has presided over boom and bust and left British workers in a worse position than when he took office 13 years ago.

'British workers have been betrayed. A Conservative government would introduce a genuine limit which would help us properly control immigration.

'We would reduce net immigration to the levels of the 1980s and 90s - tens of thousands a year, not the hundreds of thousands we have seen under Labour.'

The figures will boost Tory attacks on Gordon Brown but Labour are determined to shift the focus to Conservative economic plans - launching a bitter attack today.

They are defiant despite scores of business leaders backing Tory plans to curb National Insurance and clearly believe they can turn the tables on David Cameron.

Gordon Brown, at his first election press conference alongside Alistair Darling and Lord Mandelson, was claimed their proposals are 'flimsy' and drawn up on the back on an envelope, while the Chancellor declared they had 'thrown caution to the wind'.

Labour claims the Tory plans would mean making £37billion in savings this year, the equivalent of half the education budget, and argue they are totally incredible.

David Cameron is moving on to flesh out his plans for a 'Big Society' but will struggle to shift the agenda as the Lib Dems have also today rounded on his economic plans.

They say Tory plans on inheritance tax, tax breaks for married couples and National Insurance will cost £13.5billion but so far just £100million of this has been set out.

A new Lib Dem campaign poster claims they will have to raise VAT to 20.5 per cent to fund the proposals, costing an average family £389 a year.

The ONS figures on immigration show the total number of people in work in both the private and the public sector has risen from around 25.7million in 1997 to 27.4million at the end of last year, an increase of 1.67million.

But the number of workers born abroad has increased dramatically by 1.64million, from 1.9million to 3.5million.

There were 23.8million British-born workers in employment at the end of last year, just 25,000 more than when Labour came to power. In the private sector, the number of British workers has actually fallen.

The number of posts for people of working age has increased since 1997 by over 500,000, to 20.5million.

But the number of British-born workers in the private sector has slumped by 726,000, from 18.4million to 17.7million.

The figures exclude people working beyond pension age, which critics say the Government includes as 'new jobs' in its assessments.

Last year, the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development said that, over ten years, only Luxembourg had seen more of its new jobs taken by migrants.

The latest totals do not include the hundreds of thousands of migrants employed in the 'black economy'.

Sir Andrew Green, of the Migrationwatch pressure group, said: 'The government's economic case for mass immigration is finally blown out of the water.'

A Labour Party spokesman said: 'Net inward migration has fallen and Labour has set out how we will use the points-based system to ensure that, as growth returns, our priority is to see rising levels of skills, wages and employment, not rising immigration.

'But we reject a Tory quota which is arbitrary and misleading - not covering most of those who apply to come to Britain - and bad for business and growth.

'Under the points-based system the door is currently closed to unskilled workers from outside the EU, and the rules are being tightened on students working part-time. Skilled jobs must be advertised in Jobcentre Plus before being opened to migrant workers.

'Unemployment is around half a million lower than people anticipated last year, as thousands of British workers benefit from the help and support we offer.

'With more than 480,000 vacancies right now we are making sure no one gets left behind.'

Daily Heil

[Jon]

Hung Parliaments would only work when the parties are willing to compromise otherwise nothing would get done.

Which is exactly what they should, therefore, do.

Compromise and agreement is a huge part of everyday life, and indeed working and business life too.

It is "the real world".

It would also be what the people would have elected, and parliamnet should reflect the will of the people.

If we elect a hung parliament with no overall majority, then the MP's we have elected should honour that, and work to those ends, and not say "well, i'm not working with those pricks, I want an overall majority, let's have another election".

Government by agreement, coalition and compromise can work, and if that is what the people have voted for, then so be it.

[tonyh29]

At the very least they will have a couple of people in the cabinet (Cable and someone else most likely)

I don't think Cable stands a chance , although the public may think he's the nuts for his false mystic meg claims , inside of Government they aren't quite so easily hoodwinked and he isn't thought to be that highly regarded .. but saying that maybe pandering to the Public is the name of the game at present

I see the Lib Dems have stated the tories are going to put VAT up as well in an attempt to scare voters who wont read beyond the headline ... Wonder if Clegg really believes he can win it , he doesn't seem to be cosying up to either side at present ?

Interestingly i read a few reports that reckon ANY government will have to put VAT up , regardless of what they put in their manifesto ... but from a raising money POV IF VAT went to 21% and also on zero rated items it would generate 40BN a year , and would wipe out the deficit in 3 -4 years .... now I suppose one way to look at it would be that the higher earners spend more and thus indirectly pay more when it comes to VAT .. but of course it wont be seen like that by anyone

WHY DO WE PAY SO MUCH FOR FUEL AT THE PUMP COMPARED TO OUT EUROPEAN COUNTERPARTS

Whilst I agree and there is no excuse for the way it keeps going up , I was in Hungary last week and paying 331 HUF a litre which works out at £1.08 .. care to guess the average Hungarian wage compared to the UK wage ?

[drat01]

Whilst I agree and there is no excuse for the way it keeps going up , I was in Hungary last week and paying 331 HUF a litre which works out at £1.08 .. care to guess the average Hungarian wage compared to the UK wage ?

Exactly Tony - blimey didn't expect those words in one of these threads - the cost of fuel and the myth that the UK is somehow way above Europe is one that keeps getting out there. The price is getting similar in most of Europe now

link

Also good to see the Mail playing the immigrant card so early

[tonyh29]

Government by agreement, coalition and compromise can work, and if that is what the people have voted for, then so be it.

yep Italy is a great example of how it works well ...oh wait

My concern though Jon is deals will have to be brokered and that is not in the interest of the country ..for example Look at the deals / concessions that Brown made to get 28 day detention through parliament .. hardly parliaments finest hour was it