The "Witton Lane" Boxing Chat Thread

[Demitri_C]

22 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

"

One thing I have point out is that there was a disgusting fix in place via Al Haymon/ PBC. A couple of things, at the start of round 8 where Wilder was badly hurt, the ref inexplicably gave Wilder a time out to see the doctor, he was then after ordered to a neutral corner, giving him like another 10 seconds rest when he was badly hurt, I couldn't believe what I was seeing. Also, Wilder was up on all judges cards going into the 10th round, I say bullshit, he was down by at least 2-3 points on any sane card. 

Oh yes I forgot to mention this. I could not believe tha5 was not highlighted more it was a complete disgrace. This is why I would rather they fight outside the states. That would never be allowed in the UK. If that was ortiz he wouldn’t have been given that opportunity and it did help him.

if Ortiz is 58 as some have said he is a bloody good boxer, really did well and he should hav3 son but that break in the 8th definitely helped.

with your earlier comment has wilder got a chin, must remember it was towards end of the round. Would have been a knock down if there was another minute left.

i think Joshua can also put wilder to sleep. It’s who hits first fir me, and I think Joshua is a more intelligent boxer, but wilder has that awkward swing and better with his footwork

[Dr_Pangloss]

1 minute ago, Demitri_C said:

Oh yes I forgot to mention this. I could not believe tha5 was not highlighted more it was a complete disgrace. This is why I would rather they fight outside the states. That would never be allowed in the UK. If that was ortiz he wouldn’t have been given that opportunity and it did help him.

if Ortiz is 58 as some have said he is a bloody good boxer, really did well and he should hav3 son but that break in the 8th definitely helped.

with your earlier comment has wilder got a chin, must remember it was towards end of the round. Would have been a knock down if there was another minute left.

i think Joshua can also put wilder to sleep. It’s who hits first fir me, and I think Joshua is a more intelligent boxer, but wilder has that awkward swing and better with his footwork

LOL there's never any BS in the UK? Of course there is. Ortiz is not 58 LOL, probably closer to 45. Wilder certainly has a better chin than advertised, he was badly hurt with 40 seconds to go, was still out on his feet in the following round, but still didn't go down, and Ortiz is a much harder and better puncher than someone like Dillian Whyte who rocked Joshua badly. Give the guy a bit more credit LOL

[Demitri_C]

1 minute ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

LOL there's never any BS in the UK? Of course there is. Ortiz is not 58 LOL, probably closer to 45. Wilder certainly has a better chin than advertised, he was badly hurt with 40 seconds to go, was still out on his feet in the following round, but still didn't go down, and Ortiz is a much harder and better puncher than someone like Dillian Whyte who rocked Joshua badly. Give the guy a bit more credit LOL

When was the last one in the heavyweight division like this? The only one I can think of recently is maybe the takao fight didn5 need to be stopped. However that was not blatantly helping an opponent like wilder was yesterday. 

Even 45 he was really impressive. Whyte vs Ortiz would actually be a good fight. 

As for wilder look Ortiz is finally a decent fighter on cv it’s a good win for him. But he was completely outboxed for most of the fight. I wasnt that impressed. He certainly in my view wouldn’t have had a chance against Lennox or Tyson. 

[Dr_Pangloss]

6 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

When was the last one in the heavyweight division like this? The only one I can think of recently is maybe the takao fight didn5 need to be stopped. However that was not blatantly helping an opponent like wilder was yesterday. 

Even 45 he was really impressive. Whyte vs Ortiz would actually be a good fight. 

As for wilder look Ortiz is finally a decent fighter on cv it’s a good win for him. But he was completely outboxed for most of the fight. I wasnt that impressed. He certainly in my view wouldn’t have had a chance against Lennox or Tyson. 

When Klitschko was bludgeoning Joshua around the ring in round 5 of their fight for about 1 and a half minutes with virtually no response, you just know that if it was the other way round the fight would have been stopped. There's always hometown cooking involved, whether in the US or UK to be honest, but I generally think the fight should happen in the states but with no PBC influence, which is possible, 

In terms of your point about how the division shapes to the past, you are of course right, a prime Lennox Lewis would smash Joshua and Wilder to pieces on the same night. 

Edited March 4, 2018 by Dr_Pangloss

[Risso]

Wilder vs Fury wouldn't be one for the boxing purists would it?  Be like two windmills with boxing gloves going at each other.

[leemond2008]

2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

When was the last one in the heavyweight division like this? The only one I can think of recently is maybe the takao fight didn5 need to be stopped. However that was not blatantly helping an opponent like wilder was yesterday. 

Even 45 he was really impressive. Whyte vs Ortiz would actually be a good fight. 

As for wilder look Ortiz is finally a decent fighter on cv it’s a good win for him. But he was completely outboxed for most of the fight. I wasnt that impressed. He certainly in my view wouldn’t have had a chance against Lennox or Tyson. 

When was the last time that the UK needed to do anything dodgy in a HW fight? AJ has dominated and they have never had to pull out all stops to get him the win, I agree that the Takam fight didn't need to be stopped but it was in order to protect AJ's KO streak, the result would have ended up the same.

The punch that ended it was one for the highlight reel, even though Wilder was outboxed for most of the night I still tip him to beat AJ, AJ doesn't have any head movement whatsoever and I think that Wilder would be able to fight off the back foot and avoid AJ's power whilst popping out the jab, then when he lands something big AJ will feel it.

Although I'm not confident in that.

Just now, Risso said:

Wilder vs Fury wouldn't be one for the boxing purists would it?  Be like two windmills with boxing gloves going at each other.

Fury is definitely not a windmill, he's actually a very good boxer with little power for someone of his size

[Dr_Pangloss]

Bivol looked great against Barrera, Barrera fought a dirty fight but Bivol really schooled him, beautiful right hand to end it as well, really impressive!

[leemond2008]

I've not seen the fight yet (just watching the undercard for it at the minute) but I read that he started slow and it was only in the later rounds that he started breaking Barrera down, I had a feeling that would go long though.

[Demitri_C]

27 minutes ago, Risso said:

Wilder vs Fury wouldn't be one for the boxing purists would it?  Be like two windmills with boxing gloves going at each other.

Fury would be very awkward for wilder but as said above has so little punch power he would be able to hurt wilder. Got floored by Cunningham at crusierweight. Big questions over his chin. For me wilder would ko him.

[Demitri_C]

I don’t understand how the judges had wilder a round up. Absolutely ridiculous 

[Dr_Pangloss]

12 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

I don’t understand how the judges had wilder a round up. Absolutely ridiculous 

[Brumstopdogs]

Wilder would beat Joshua IMO.

Nobody can take those punches!

[Demitri_C]

9 hours ago, Brumstopdogs said:

Wilder would beat Joshua IMO.

Nobody can take those punches!

Not saying Joshua but generally, if he comes up against a intelligent boxer who dont get hit much wilder would lose as he has no style just swinging crazily hoping to connect. If someone who can outbox him goes up against him with power wilder loses.

Ortiz completely out boxed him but made a few mistakes. He didn't need to go for the no in the latter rounds.

If there was a Lennox around today he would humilate wilder.

[Dr_Pangloss]

6 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

Not saying Joshua but generally, if he comes up against a intelligent boxer who dont get hit much wilder would lose as he has no style just swinging crazily hoping to connect. If someone who can outbox him goes up against him with power wilder loses.

Ortiz completely out boxed him but made a few mistakes. He didn't need to go for the no in the latter rounds.

If there was a Lennox around today he would humilate wilder.

Wilder is not a great boxer at all, but he is the sports pound for pound hardest puncher, absolute elite class power and elite level athleticism, he also seems to always find a solution for getting his right hand home. You continually do him a massive disservice to be honest, he didn't win the fight by crazily swinging for the fences, the right hand that he threw to start Ortiz's demise in round ten was a beautiful short counter right thrown off the ropes from an almost Philly-shell like position and the punch that ended the right was a short uppercut on the inside. None of those were lucky swings. He's a limited one trick pony but it's a hell of a trick and thus far one he is always able to find a way to deliver.

Lewis of course would destroy him, it'd be like the Michael Grant fight. But Lewis would also take out Anthony Joshua in a similar way, but then Lewis is considered one of the very best to do it and no current heavyweight will ever get close to him on such a list.

Edited March 5, 2018 by Dr_Pangloss

[Demitri_C]

56 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

Wilder is not a great boxer at all, but he is the sports pound for pound hardest puncher, absolute elite class power and elite level athleticism, he also seems to always find a solution for getting his right hand home. You continually do him a massive disservice to be honest, he didn't win the fight by crazily swinging for the fences, the right hand that he threw to start Ortiz's demise in round ten was a beautiful short counter right thrown off the ropes from an almost Philly-shell like position and the punch that ended the right was a short uppercut on the inside. None of those were lucky swings. He's a limited one trick pony but it's a hell of a trick and thus far one he is always able to find a way to deliver.

Lewis of course would destroy him, it'd be like the Michael Grant fight. But Lewis would also take out Anthony Joshua in a similar way, but then Lewis is considered one of the very best to do it and no current heavyweight will ever get close to him on such a list.

I just don't rate wilder. I will of cause give him credit for beating Ortiz however wilder is not a great boxer. He has been out boxed by three boxers  the last two being Washington and Ortiz. If these guys were heavy punches like wilder he would have lost. Klitscko is a harder punches than Ortiz and I think Joshua is a harder puncher than klitscko. Ortiz hurt wilder there is no doubted that. That says ti me Joshua can hurt wilder. But i think Joshua stamina is poor so I think unless it's a knockout in first 5 wilder wins late on.

Second paragraph I agree 100%. None of these heavyweights these days come close to Lewis. What a boxer.

[sheepyvillian]

I think Tyson Fury would make Wilder look silly, and embarrass him in to submission. I would take Joshua to beat Wilder, too. He just needs to keep a tight defence, and for me, he comes out the Victor. As good as Lewis was, let's not forget he lost twice to two comparatively average heavyweights, even though he avenged both. He seemed to lack motivation in some fights. Such a shame him and Bowe didn't clash as pros.

[AVFCDAN]

11 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said:

I think Tyson Fury would make Wilder look silly, and embarrass him in to submission. I would take Joshua to beat Wilder, too. He just needs to keep a tight defence, and for me, he comes out the Victor. As good as Lewis was, let's not forget he lost twice to two comparatively average heavyweights, even though he avenged both. He seemed to lack motivation in some fights. Such a shame him and Bowe didn't clash as pros.

Can't think of anyone in the division that beats Fury to be honest.

The look of disgust you get from people when you casually mention that Fury would school Joshua is priceless.

[Dr_Pangloss]

Fury has been out for over 2 years and has badly abused his body, I would not back him against any 'top' heavyweight right now, too much of a red flag. In Fury's prime I'd back him to beat Joshua easily, in principle he'd do a similar job on Wilder but I can see how Wilder would land the straight right hand against him and Fury's chin is poor.

[Demitri_C]

27 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said:

I think Tyson Fury would make Wilder look silly, and embarrass him in to submission. I would take Joshua to beat Wilder, too. He just needs to keep a tight defence, and for me, he comes out the Victor. As good as Lewis was, let's not forget he lost twice to two comparatively average heavyweights, even though he avenged both. He seemed to lack motivation in some fights. Such a shame him and Bowe didn't clash as pros.

One of those defeats Lewis was clearly unwell you could see it.  But rematch Lewis humilated him.

Fury has no chin though wilder would absolutely knock him out with that right hand. Fury is a smarter boxer than wilder though.

Id love to see that fight 

[AVFCDAN]

4 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

Fury has been out for over 2 years and has badly abused his body, I would not back him against any 'top' heavyweight right now, too much of a red flag. In Fury's prime I'd back him to beat Joshua easily, in principle he'd do a similar job on Wilder but I can see how Wilder would land the straight right hand against him and Fury's chin is poor.

Well yeah, if Fury jumped in the ring right now he could lose to anyone but if he gets a couple of tuneups under his belt I would still back him to beat anyone in the division. Time is still very much on his side.