Premier League Spurs - Arry's gone but we still dislike them...

[kurtsimonw]

if Upson was only added due to Kings injury (which is a completely false claim, by the way) that he has regularly been selected above every other CB in England (aside from Terry/Rio obviously) under Capello?

Because Capello rates him as the best fit alternative? I nwould have thought that was obvious.

I don't think you can understand English.

There was a squad of 6 centre backs picked, got it? John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Matthew Upson, Phil Jagielka, Joleon Lescott and Ledley King. That much we agree on?

You said the only reason Upson was called up was due to King being injured, correct? Surely this suggests that he is rated less than the other 5 by Capello, as he was only called up due to Kings absence (which is a false claim, Upson was named in the orignal squad, but I'll humour you).

So why is it, that seeing as you think that Capello feels Upson is rated lower than these, that he is STARTING games? Lescott and Jagielka had been fit, yet Upson was still starting.

Your lack of logic is fightening.

[chrissmith921]

Has King ever won player of the month then?

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

King's a good player when he's fit.

Thing is he is never fit, ergo there is no point discussing how good he is as he will never be consistent enough to be a top player

[Parky]

if Upson was only added due to Kings injury (which is a completely false claim, by the way) that he has regularly been selected above every other CB in England (aside from Terry/Rio obviously) under Capello?

Because Capello rates him as the best fit alternative? I nwould have thought that was obvious.

I don't think you can understand English.

There was a squad of 6 centre backs picked, got it? John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Matthew Upson, Phil Jagielka, Joleon Lescott and Ledley King. That much we agree on?

You said the only reason Upson was called up was due to King being injured, correct? Surely this suggests that he is rated less than the other 5 by Capello, as he was only called up due to Kings absence (which is a false claim, Upson was named in the orignal squad, but I'll humour you).

So why is it, that seeing as you think that Capello feels Upson is rated lower than these, that he is STARTING games? Lescott and Jagielka had been fit, yet Upson was still starting.

Your lack of logic is fightening.

Not at all, I think the fact that Jagielka is long term injured, Lescott is having a torrid time at city and Upson is looking fairly comfortable and assured is why he is now Capellos first pick.

[dappadan]

Point out one TRUE FACT that paints McGrath as equal, or inferior, a player to King. Please.

When did I say that? Please. You keep coming back to it. When did I say that?

I said there isnt a gulf in class that some would suggest.

Jeez what a bunch of m0ngs

Yeah and you said this on a VILLA forum, think you are the mong for expecting a different reaction.

[Parky]

Has King ever won player of the month then?

Yes

[chrissmith921]

if Upson was only added due to Kings injury (which is a completely false claim, by the way) that he has regularly been selected above every other CB in England (aside from Terry/Rio obviously) under Capello?

Because Capello rates him as the best fit alternative? I nwould have thought that was obvious.

I don't think you can understand English.

There was a squad of 6 centre backs picked, got it? John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Matthew Upson, Phil Jagielka, Joleon Lescott and Ledley King. That much we agree on?

You said the only reason Upson was called up was due to King being injured, correct? Surely this suggests that he is rated less than the other 5 by Capello, as he was only called up due to Kings absence (which is a false claim, Upson was named in the orignal squad, but I'll humour you).

So why is it, that seeing as you think that Capello feels Upson is rated lower than these, that he is STARTING games? Lescott and Jagielka had been fit, yet Upson was still starting.

Your lack of logic is fightening.

Not at all, I think the fact that Jagielka is long term injured, Lescott is having a torrid time at city and Upson is looking fairly comfortable and assured is why he is now Capellos first pick.

Nothing to do with the fact he's a better player than those mentioned then? Seeing as they were all fit for the said fixtures. And playing well.

[kurtsimonw]

if Upson was only added due to Kings injury (which is a completely false claim, by the way) that he has regularly been selected above every other CB in England (aside from Terry/Rio obviously) under Capello?

Because Capello rates him as the best fit alternative? I nwould have thought that was obvious.

I don't think you can understand English.

There was a squad of 6 centre backs picked, got it? John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Matthew Upson, Phil Jagielka, Joleon Lescott and Ledley King. That much we agree on?

You said the only reason Upson was called up was due to King being injured, correct? Surely this suggests that he is rated less than the other 5 by Capello, as he was only called up due to Kings absence (which is a false claim, Upson was named in the orignal squad, but I'll humour you).

So why is it, that seeing as you think that Capello feels Upson is rated lower than these, that he is STARTING games? Lescott and Jagielka had been fit, yet Upson was still starting.

Your lack of logic is fightening.

Not at all, I think the fact that Jagielka is long term injured, Lescott is having a torrid time at city and Upson is looking fairly comfortable and assured is why he is now Capellos first pick.

Jagielka wasn't injured at the time mate, he was also called into the squad. And why, if you feel Upsons pick is so certain and comfortable now, would Capello only call him up to the squad (as a 6th CB) due to an injury to somebody else? Surely if Upson was such an obvious choice, he'd be the 3rd CB called up, not 6th, you fool.

But again, you're talking shite anyways. Matty Upson was called up in the original squad, your "He was only called up due to Kings injury" is complete bull.

[kurtsimonw]

Not at all, I think the fact that Jagielka is long term injured, Lescott is having a torrid time at city and Upson is looking fairly comfortable and assured is why he is now Capellos first pick.

Nothing to do with the fact he's a better player than those mentioned then? Seeing as they were all fit for the said fixtures. And playing well.

Don't be silly. Lescott was having a 'torrid time' at Man City, apparently. Despite the fact they were having an incredible run with one of the leagues best defenses at said time, but we won't mention that.

[chrissmith921]

Has King ever won player of the month then?

Yes

10 times this has been won by a defender during Kings generation.

King has won it once.

Micah Richards has also won it once, you asked when did I last watch MOTD, 2007? Yet you point out King is better, but he's not won an award since 2004... so...?

Since then by the way, we've seen such legends as Kevin Nolan, Andy Johnson (TWICE!) and Micah Richards (of course hes shit... ) win the award.

But they're also the best of their generation too :cool:

[kurtsimonw]

Has King ever won player of the month then?

Yes

10 times this has been won by a defender during Kings generation.

King has won it once.

Micah Richards has also won it once, you asked when did I last watch MOTD, 2007? Yet you point out King is better, but he's not won an award since 2004... so...?

Since then by the way, we've seen such legends as Kevin Nolan, Andy Johnson (TWICE!) and Micah Richards (of course hes shit... ) win the award.

But they're also the best of their generation too :cool:

To be fair he did miss out the * after he said that. Which would have mentioned that he is the best Spurs central defender of his generation, not named Jonathon Woodgate.

[chrissmith921]

Not at all, I think the fact that Jagielka is long term injured, Lescott is having a torrid time at city and Upson is looking fairly comfortable and assured is why he is now Capellos first pick.

Nothing to do with the fact he's a better player than those mentioned then? Seeing as they were all fit for the said fixtures. And playing well.

Don't be silly. Lescott was having a 'torrid time' at Man City, apparently. Despite the fact they were having an incredible run with one of the leagues best defenses at said time, but we won't mention that.

Oh, dont be silly, he was having a torrid time.

The same way Lennon has been 'causing panic and mayhem' throughout the Premier League.

:cool:

[chrissmith921]

Has King ever won player of the month then?

Yes

10 times this has been won by a defender during Kings generation.

King has won it once.

Micah Richards has also won it once, you asked when did I last watch MOTD, 2007? Yet you point out King is better, but he's not won an award since 2004... so...?

Since then by the way, we've seen such legends as Kevin Nolan, Andy Johnson (TWICE!) and Micah Richards (of course hes shit... ) win the award.

But they're also the best of their generation too :cool:

To be fair he did miss out the * after he said that. Which would have mentioned that he is the best Spurs central defender of his generation, not named Jonathon Woodgate.

And Sol Campbell.

Perhaps he means the best Spurs defender who's taken them for £40k a week to let him get pissed up, not train and most of the time not even play?!

[Parky]

England squad vs Ukraine:

1st Competitive game after Ledleys call up.

England: James, Johnson, Ferdinand (Jagielka 88), Terry, Cole, Lennon (Beckham 57), Lampard, Barry, Gerrard, Rooney, Crouch (Wright-Phillips 79).

Subs Not Used: Foster, Lescott, Carrick, Agbonlahor.

Of course Upson was always his first choice.

Honestly lads. Who gives a monkeys about player of the month?

Who honestly thinks Micah Richards is playing well at the moment?

[chrissmith921]

Who thinks King is playing well at the moment?

Oh wait, hes not playing.

It doesnt matter how good you think he is - fact is hes NEVER produced the goods because he is never fit.

[Parky]

Who thinks King is playing well at the moment?

Oh wait, hes not playing.

It doesnt matter how good you think he is - fact is hes NEVER produced the goods because he is never fit.

Looks like the constructive debate is out the window then.

[SimplySpurfect]

Who thinks King is playing well at the moment?

Oh wait, hes not playing.

It doesnt matter how good you think he is - fact is hes NEVER produced the goods because he is never fit.

When Spurs nearly finished 4th in 05/06, which coincidentally is also the last full season King managed to play without an injury disruption, he was part of the best defense outside of the top four.

King also earned rave reviews in Euro 2004 against France in the opening game, and would've most likely played in the rest of the competition had he not have to leave after the game to be at the birth of his child.

"King, who was starting his first match for England, looked impressive and the anonymity of Henry in the first half owed much to the Spurs centre-half's concentration at the back."

Link

But overall, this is a pointless debate to have. The average non-Spurs fan is going to remember Ledley King as a a good but injury prone player, in the same way as Darren Anderton, which is entirely understandable.

But Spurs fans, who've seen a hell of a lot more of him than non-Spurs fans, will always remember King as one of the greatest defenders they've ever seen, and will always look at his injury record and dodgy knee and wonder, "If only.."

[tinker]

IMO, King could have been one of the best and would have challenged Rio and Terry for a place in the England team IF and only IF he had not spent so much time injured.

Its a real shame for him and England/ Spurs. But the facts are he can't play more than one game a week without problems and this has cost him his place as being considered "one of the best of his generation" Sorry but thats the facts and it will mean he will never reach his full potential (like many other players)

Paul Mc Grath is in a different league to him and TBH most of the central defenders I have seen since, most players that have played with him would tell you that, funny thing is he wouldn't agree, but thats Paul Mc all over.

[Vojskovoda]

Oh dear, oh deary me. If we're on the subject of comparing McGrath to Ledley 'I'm not as overrated as Woodgate, but I'm still overrated' King, than I'll also chip in saying Laursen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> King.

This is what makes me dislike Spurs fans so much, why can't they ever just accept someone else is better than one of their own players?

[SimplySpurfect]

Oh dear, oh deary me. If we're on the subject of comparing McGrath to Ledley 'I'm not as overrated as Woodgate, but I'm still overrated' King, than I'll also chip in saying Laursen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> King.

This is what makes me dislike Spurs fans so much, why can't they ever just accept someone else is better than one of their own players?

Funny how you talk about over-rating players players but then you go and make that comparison between Laursen and King. Oh well, it takes all kinds, I suppose.