chrissmith921 Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share Posted February 15, 2009 wales didn't offer much and they were at home vs apparently a shit england team,who were still a lot better than wales what was the score fella we beat you, we could have stepped it up even further. you lot killed the ball at every break down then complain about yellows? give me a break!!! pipe dreams,england crushed you just when you thought wales had finally overtaken the english as the greatest northern hemisphere side england start to bring it back and its apparent wales arnt that great. england were better and that shocked a lot of people and if the ref hadn't had a disaster game england woulda won,wales discipline was just as bad as englands and yet the ref never gave no yellows to the wales and never gave us barely any penaltys,ryan jones should be binned he did exactly the same as goode and whoever took out armitage in mid air shoulda been binned to you got lucky thats all no room to gloat but when your english people seem to find this magic luck against us. Yeah, magic luck, nothing to do with being poor outwide? England werent better - re-watch the game before you make yourself even more of a tool than you are already - England got into Wales' half with the ball TWICE in the first 40 minutes. Yes they scored on both occasions but how well a side performs in rugby is directly visible by how much territory they have - bugger all by England - did exactly what Johnno sent them out there to do - damage limitation from the word go (as shown by Worsley in the backline for set pieces) and deliberate, consistent killing of the ball. Thats why Ryan Jones didnt go by the way - the big word is CONSISTENT killing of the ball. England killed it, killed it, killed it. Tindall was the 5th man to do it when he had his yellow and that was after 16 minutes. If you are killing the ball that many times in the first quarter of a game you are doing it because you are being over-run. You clearly do not have an understanding of the game if you think for a second that Wales a) didnt deserve to win and werent the better side. You got a beating, but not by the margin that the first hour deserved. You had 10 minutes (60-70) where you threatened yet you neglect the other 70 where you were backs and arses to the wall because you were so heavy under it its untrue. Typical English fan (regardless of sport) though - you lost, so blame the ref and call it bad luck. Let me just remind you, Wales were without the World player of the year on Saturday, our record try scorer... And we still stuffed you boys. Good luck for the rest of it, you'll probably get something off the Irish now but that just leaves us going into the final Saturday on a slam unless France pull their fingers out of the arses. referee cost you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Cos Lee Byrne didnt wrap his arms around the man - he went in looking for the high ball. Theres the difference - penalty for the offence, no card because there was no intent I'm sorry, Chris that's rubbish. Byrne had no idea where the ball was and no wish to know. He just ran headlong at where he knew the guy was going to be jumping and took the man out. I'm under no illusions that Kaplan 'lost England the game' but I did think that he did have a poor game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAZZAM Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 well its funny all the media outlets are agreeing with me in the ref cost us,he penilised england to hard and didnt punish wales you do realise that wales infriged just as much as england right?its only right at the start england did it to much but wales soon caught up.joke ref performance. who cares about shane williams we havent had johnny for a year. anyway roll on next game looks like england and ireland might be match of the tourney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 15, 2009 Moderator Share Posted February 15, 2009 well its funny all the media outlets are agreeing with me in the ref cost us,he penilised england to hard and didnt punish wales you do realise that wales infriged just as much as england right?its only right at the start england did it to much but wales soon caught up.joke ref performance. who cares about shane williams we havent had johnny for a year. anyway roll on next game looks like england and ireland might be match of the tourney. S'funny, I only read one report, the one in the Times and it hardly mentions the referee being bad you can read it here. And being as the times is a Murdoch paper you can be sure it is in their interests to have a strong England Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubav Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Still think the sheepdips will win it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swaib2004 Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Before looking at this thread or anything my words watching the game were... for **** sake ref give us something what you are giving them... said to the mrs it must be because we are English i always think the refs are harsh against us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 I never thought it was going to be a stuffing. I had Wales by 10-15 points. England were much better than I thought they would be. Worsley was immense, Ellis impressive and greater discipline would have made it closer, but still not close enough to win. I think England will do France. well its funny all the media outlets are agreeing with me in the ref cost us, Which ones? The Observer or Sunday Times certainly didn't. Nor the BBC website. you do realise that wales infriged just as much as england right? Watch it again. They really didn't. joke ref performance. He wasn't great, but the only glaring error was not binning Byrne. He didn't fly into the challenge in the same way as the Scottish prop did last week but I still think he deserved to go. But if you think he cost England the game, then you don't know very much about Rugby. How about England's outside half commiting a nailed on, cynical, sin binnable offence, and then not being around to bag a relatively easy 3 points a few minutes later? Or Vickery's inexplicable refusal to bind properly. Andy "Bench Press" Sheridan doing nowt with or without the ball? Or the constant and, Sackey's try excepted, generally poor kicking out of hand. who cares about shane williams we havent had johnny for a year. Not fit to lace Shane's boots. anyway roll on next game looks like england and ireland might be match of the tourney. What makes you think that? I think Wales vs France will be the loosest, most open game. Scotland vs England is going to be massive too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 Its the Englishmans attitude - blame the referee. KAZZAM you obviously have no idea about the laws of the game - if you did you would have seen England illegally killing the ball from the first minute. If you'd seen that, you'd realise why you had the yellows. Also, what is it now, 9 yellows in the last 3 tests for England? Theres a reason - you're cheating f**kers, but no good at it. Lets be honest here, if the referee has pinged your team 4 times already for falling on the ball, do you think Tindall was wise to do it? If the referee is penalising the illegal binding by Vickery, do you think he's wise to carry on doing it? snowy - unfortunately thats how it is - he didnt wrap the man up in the air, so it was not tackling a man off the ground - so a penalty was the right decision. You lot are so bitter, you used to be the best in the world, now you're 3rd tier with the likes of Ireland... Also KAZZAM, Shane Williams is a far more influential player than Johnny Wilkinson, who now Rugby has forced England to drop their 10 man rugby bollocks will hardly feature for England again. Argue the point as much as you like, you were beaten by the better side and we didnt even play that well... We're better than you all over the park, we beat you up front, we battered you in the lineout (calling Kennedy the best lineout man in the world is like Newcastle fans calling themselves the best fans in the world...) and we battered you in the backs. You lot turned up with one thing on your mind and that was to defend with your arses to the wall and spoil the game. The referee saw it clearly and pinged you (rightfully) off the park for it. I really suggest you learn the rules KAZZAM because its clear you're generating your opinions from a Brian Moore, who is more one-eyed than a cock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dappadan Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Didn't Martin Johnson come out before the game and say it was his intention to get England to slow the game down? Silly comment if he did really as the ref would always be looking for that then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Forgot to mention the impressive try from Armitage by the way. If he can improve his kicking out of hand, England might have quite a player on their hands there. Not much in the way of substitutions late on form our boys Chris. I can see the argument for leaving Stephen Jones on as he was controlling things pretty well, but I would have thought a few more fresh legs were in order. Any ideas as to why WG didn't ring many changes? Also, while Phillips was solid enough, do you think there's a case for calling Peel up against the Frogs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villamark Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 from a Brian Moore, who is more one-eyed than a cock. but not more one eyed than you chris. Wales were the better side just, for the Goode sin binning he was the first player at the break down tried to take the ball, welsh player held on for dear life Goode got knocked of his feet it should have been a English penalty for Wales holding on. Gatland got it right told the ref England will slow the ball down and he fell for it hook line and sinker. The best team in the world slow the ball down and cheat every game and that is NZ. I really don't think there is much in the differnce between Wales and Ireland, Ireland find the forwards battle just, but Wales overall have a better backline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 I really don't think there is much in the differnce between Wales and Ireland, Ireland find the forwards battle just, but Wales overall have a better backline. Not sure about that Mark. Which Irish forwards would you select ahead of Welsh ones? Not trying to be biased, but comparing the two teams in almost every position I'd rather have a Welshman. O Connel instead of Gough maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 snowy - unfortunately thats how it is - he didnt wrap the man up in the air, so it was not tackling a man off the ground - so a penalty was the right decision. I think that is the most one-sided interpretation of any law that there could be. He made no attempt to play the ball and his play was dangerous. I'm sorry Chris but you are criticizing other posters for having a blinkered attitude to the ref and yet you are doing the same. Anyway, it seems, even in victory, that you are unable to take a balanced view of the game (I admit that you are being provoked into some of your opinion by the blaming of the ref on the part of others). In my view, Wales were the better side but not by much on the day. They may have not played well and that may well be down to the tactics that England employed on the day (i.e. slowing it down and killing it) but to claim as you did earlier that Wales could have stepped it up belied the evidence on the faces of your boys as they came off. They were as shot as the England side. I think, actually, by assessing it in the way in which you have that you don't give your side enough credit. England came with a game plan; Wales were without their most talented back; England stepped up their game (especially defensively) and yet Wales still won. Your guys found a way to get over the winning line when not firing (again for whatever reason) and exploited that. That's what good sides do. It might be best to concentrate on that as the outcome of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 A good summing up for me snowy, I agree - Both on how the day unfolded and the Byrne point. While I don't think Wales could have stepped it up as such the last few minutes felt fairly comfortable. I think a few more pairs of fresh legs might have made it even easier, relatively speaking, on us though and am not sure why Gatland didn't take this option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 I also think this is another false dawn for the Welsh as it was under Graham Henry. :wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 A good summing up for me snowy, I agree Cheers. While I don't think Wales could have stepped it up as such the last few minutes felt fairly comfortable. I think a few more pairs of fresh legs might have made it even easier, relatively speaking, on us though and am not sure why Gatland didn't take this option. It seemed that way in the last few minutes. I wonder whether it may have felt differently had Flood taken those three points? I thought (and I'm only guessing here) that Wales themselves were relatively relaxed in the last throes of the game because they knew that they were more than a score ahead - if it had been less then they may have been more nervy and it is often when a side is nervy that they concede (especially something daft). On the subs point, I'm with you as I thought that was slightly strange but perhaps they made the decision that it was better not to risk a player slotting in, not being quite up to speed and giving something silly away. I guess one could say that those unused subs were the spare caacity in that if Wales had needed to score more points then the subs would have come on but as that would have required a different game situation then I think it is a dangerous hypothetical course on which to take the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villamark Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Not sure about that Mark. Which Irish forwards would you select ahead of Welsh ones? Not trying to be biased, but comparing the two teams in almost every position I'd rather have a Welshman. O Connel instead of Gough maybe. As I said it is close, but I think the whole Irish backrow would start ahead of the Welsh backrow as well as O Connell and Flannery, the props would go with the Welsh props. Scrum half Ireland, flyhalf draw, inside centre Wales, outside Ireland. back 3 Wales but they are not as far ahead as some on here might think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 As I said it is close, but I think the whole Irish backrow would start ahead of the Welsh backrow You wouldn't pick Martyn Williams, arguably the finest open-side of his generation?? Leaving out Ryan Jones? I'd have Alun Wyn Jones over Flannery all day long too. Be interesting to see how the Lions squad shapes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villamark Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 I would go for wallace at 7, not as good on the ground as williams but better ball carrier and more disruptive tackler. On form ,ryan Jones has not been at his best so yes would leave him out. Flannery is at hooker so not aginst AW Jones it's close call but think over all his line out throwing is better than mathew rees although he had a good game on saturday , as A W Jones would be against O' Connel both great players but would go for O'C. I think gethin Jenkins is a great player work rate is imense so would go for him. I rate Adam Jones as well but John Hayes is playing well, I used to think he was useless but he has got better with age. Ireland and Wales are both good sides, if they played each other 5 times Wales would win 3 but they are not in the same class as NZ or SA and are not miles ahead of Ireland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Oops, sorry mark, shown up my lack of knowledge about the Irish hooker/second row there. :oops: I'll concede that Matthew Rees is a bit of a weak link. Isn't mobility an issue with Hayes? Adam Jones certainly put himself about a bit on Saturday. AWJ's handling and general footballing skills would give him the nod for me. Who's the other Irish second row? Ireland have surprised me to be honest. I thought they were a spent force, but they're proving me wrong and I now have to agree with your assessment about the 3 games out of 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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