chrissmith921 Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 from a Brian Moore, who is more one-eyed than a cock. but not more one eyed than you chris. Wales were the better side just, for the Goode sin binning he was the first player at the break down tried to take the ball, welsh player held on for dear life Goode got knocked of his feet it should have been a English penalty for Wales holding on. Gatland got it right told the ref England will slow the ball down and he fell for it hook line and sinker. The best team in the world slow the ball down and cheat every game and that is NZ. I really don't think there is much in the differnce between Wales and Ireland, Ireland find the forwards battle just, but Wales overall have a better backline. Goode shouldnt have been binned? He went to ground with the player and tried wrestling it off him on the ground - I was up in U14 and could see it was Goode at fault - the next 3 players in were Welsh and couldnt lift the ball out - jesus.... Just because NZ do it doesnt mean its right - plus theres a difference between slowing the ball up and killing it, you should know that with a Glam Wanderers background... Plus I find it amusing you say Ireland have the better forwards - their scrum is weak and around the park their tight 5 offer very little in comparison to Wales. Admittedly, they've got themselves a dynamic, powerful 8 who will cause problems in open play for anyone but as Wales move the ball side to side very quickly, it brings the athleticism of the packs into play - covering that sort of yardage is pretty difficult... - Wales have the edge here. No doubt in my mind on that. Anyway, you win some, you lose some. Unless you're England. Then you win some, or the ref robs you, eh? Still fancy the jocks and the English to do something to Ireland before the game in Cardiff - and you know Wales are doing something right if even Jeremy Guscott comes out and says Wales will slam it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villamark Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Plus I find it amusing you say Ireland have the better forwards - their scrum is weak and around the park their tight 5 offer very little in comparison to Wales. Admittedly, they've got themselves a dynamic, powerful 8 who will cause problems in open play for anyone but as Wales move the ball side to side very quickly, it brings the athleticism of the packs into play - covering that sort of yardage is pretty difficult... - Wales have the edge here. No doubt in my mind on that. The Irish tight 5 have 2 heinken cup medals so they are no mugs, the srum is not weak at all and they are a hard working pack. I am saying there is not much in it but Ireland edge it. Who's the other Irish second row? O callahan good player but I rate gough ahead of him. The thing is Chris, are wales the best team in the six nations yes but are they the best by miles no. If Ireland would have got rid of Eddie O' Sullivan years ago the irish team would have had a grand slam, if they would not have kep Gatland then I think they may have had a couple. You should know about poor coachs after gareth jenkins. Goode was on his feet when he went for the ball, he did get knocked off his feet and should have let go, but halfpenny did hold on, so penalty England Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walesavfc Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Not fit to lace Shane's boots. Nope 2 World cup finals a winners medal, World player of the year for a few years... your right Shane couldn`t lace Wilkinsons boots I also think this is another false dawn for the Welsh as it was under Graham Henry. I agree Tbh they don`t look like they are building like England are, England are looking forward like they did under Clive Woodward. not the todays or even this or next year but looking 2 years ahead and trying new talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Not fit to lace Shane's boots. Nope 2 World cup finals a winners medal, World player of the year for a few years... your right Shane couldn`t lace Wilkinsons boots Oh very good, I see what you've done there. Yeah, Wilko was very good for a bit. But if you want to talk outside halves of yesteryear, then you might end up on the losing side of an arument with a Wales supporter. Cliff Morgan, Phil Bennett, Barry John, Gareth Davies, Jiffy, Jenkins were all good back in the day too but, like Jonny, they're a bit passed it now. So we don't miss them and wouldn't want them in the side. Gareth Edwards on the other hand could probably still do a job on England. The mere fact that an England fan is bemoaning the lack of Wilkinson as a reason for defeat and equating his absence to that of Williams (the current World Player of the Year) speaks volumes. As for Silverware, Shane's got two grand slam medals to his name and not many are betting against him getting a third. Not a World Cup, but not bad going. Ian Balshaw has got a W/C winners medal. Do England want him back too? And for what its worth, if you offered me Wilkinson in his prime, or Shane Williams, the little wizard would be chosen every time. Jonny was a very good player. Shane's a genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 Plus I find it amusing you say Ireland have the better forwards - their scrum is weak and around the park their tight 5 offer very little in comparison to Wales. Admittedly, they've got themselves a dynamic, powerful 8 who will cause problems in open play for anyone but as Wales move the ball side to side very quickly, it brings the athleticism of the packs into play - covering that sort of yardage is pretty difficult... - Wales have the edge here. No doubt in my mind on that. The Irish tight 5 have 2 heinken cup medals so they are no mugs, the srum is not weak at all and they are a hard working pack. I am saying there is not much in it but Ireland edge it. Who's the other Irish second row? O callahan good player but I rate gough ahead of him. The thing is Chris, are wales the best team in the six nations yes but are they the best by miles no. If Ireland would have got rid of Eddie O' Sullivan years ago the irish team would have had a grand slam, if they would not have kep Gatland then I think they may have had a couple. You should know about poor coachs after gareth jenkins. Goode was on his feet when he went for the ball, he did get knocked off his feet and should have let go, but halfpenny did hold on, so penalty England Yes they have those medals but thats because they've been allowed to play their game - traditionally facing powerful English sides or Perpignan - sides who rely on a solid forward base rather than looking to move the ball at every opportunity. Munster have been shown up when they face sides who manage to move their front 5 around the park and Ireland will be the same. Yes they would have won slams had they kept Gatland, I agree there - but they didnt and their best side was the 2004-2007 side rather than the aging one they have now. I'd like to see what happens when O'Driscoll faces a defence that is semi organised - lets see how easily he cuts through that, because the Italians were the better side in that first half on Sunday against them and that was down to a solid defence while rushing 10/12 to make sure BOD didnt get any clean ball. The Irish only pulled clear once the Italians heads went down and that final score flattered them. Irelands tight 5 did nothing that made them look like they could handle Wales if Wales start to move the ball side to side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walesavfc Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Not fit to lace Shane's boots. Nope 2 World cup finals a winners medal, World player of the year for a few years... your right Shane couldn`t lace Wilkinsons boots Oh very good, I see what you've done there. Yeah, Wilko was very good for a bit. But if you want to talk outside halves of yesteryear, then you might end up on the losing side of an arument with a Wales supporter. Cliff Morgan, Phil Bennett, Barry John, Gareth Davies, Jiffy, Jenkins were all good back in the day too but, like Jonny, they're a bit passed it now. So we don't miss them and wouldn't want them in the side. Gareth Edwards on the other hand could probably still do a job on England. The mere fact that an England fan is bemoaning the lack of Wilkinson as a reason for defeat and equating his absence to that of Williams (the current World Player of the Year) speaks volumes. As for Silverware, Shane's got two grand slam medals to his name and not many are betting against him getting a third. Not a World Cup, but not bad going. Ian Balshaw has got a W/C winners medal. Do England want him back too? And for what its worth, if you offered me Wilkinson in his prime, or Shane Williams, the little wizard would be chosen every time. Jonny was a very good player. Shane's a genius. But its all about the Big stage and shane and nor have the others you mention played on it, is this Welsh side gonna get him a place on the BIG stage ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Like I say, Shane's acheivements are not as great as Wilkinsons. The 2003 England side was a great one. Better than the Wales 2008 (and I say 2008 cos I'm not yet sure the 2009 vintage is as good) one? Dunno, but I'd like to see them play each other. Is Gatland's Wales side capable of winning a World Cup? Possibly. I wouldn't bet against it. But ability is ability. Shane has more than Wilkinson. Which was my point. EDIT: Oh, and Lions tours are big stages. The World Cups of their day. And many in my list more than performed on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 If you put Wilkinson in the England side under the new ELV's you'll see that he's a very, very good kicker (out of hand and place), but an average fly half in terms of dictating the game. With the ELV's a lot more has gone onto the fly-half's responsibility to boss a game, and Wilkinson simply is behind others at it. In terms of kicking, first class - but controlling his backline?? Nah... no thanks. If you could take the American football route of bringing on a kicker solely for that duty, Wilkinson would be in, but he will struggle to get his place back soon espeically behind a pack that goes backwards. Shane however is a class above - he's easily the best winger on earth at the moment. Its good that he'll be back for France and to have Henson available will just mean we've got better options to bring off our bench. Keep on believing that the ref cost you that game - because he didn't. You were beaten by a better side and that side were lacking 3 huge players in Henson, Hook and Williams. Just imagine what would have happened if Williams had passed his fitness test... Personally, I think we would have rested him anyway for the French game Santa_Rosa - To your question a few pages back (sorry!) I'd pick Phillips to start, keep their back row from moving out by offering the powerful threat down the sides of the rucks. This is part of the reason I think Wales find so much space out wide - they know they cant keep a lightweight tackler in tight because Phillips will bust that and if he doesnt, Andy Powell is on hand. When sides start chasing the game against us, the ball is a lot cleaner, quicker. Peel then can come in and get that backline cranking the scoreboard up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 The next round is upon us - some huge games that will see how the rest of the Championship goes... A full strength Wales visit France on Friday night - a win there would almost certainly mean they will be competing for the Grand Slam when Ireland come to Cardiff at the end of the tournament, England face the Irish which will be a test for Ireland - England gave Wales some headaches with an excellent defensive performance, Ireland are yet to face a solid defence in this tournament and it could prove to be their undoing - while the Scots should get their first win of this years event over Italy. Whats your predictions for this weekend then? I'm going for Wales by 9 in Paris, England to beat the Irish by 4 and the Scots to win by 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 This week I shall mostly be supporting France, England and Italy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 France to turn on the magic and beat Wales by 5. :winkold: England to get beaten by Ireland - margin maybe 10 points. Scots to win by 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 27, 2009 Author Share Posted February 27, 2009 England told to shut up and stop complaining, the ref didn't rob ya. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/english/7912721.stm England backs coach Brian Smith has been reprimanded for his criticism of Jonathan Kaplan's refereeing in the Six Nations match against Wales. Smith accused him of not being even-handed with England, claiming he had been swayed by the Wales management. "Comments that appear to question the performance of Kaplan were unwarranted," said the International Rugby Board in a statement. "The official review of the match ranks Kaplan's performance as high." The statement added: "The IRB is satisfied that Kaplan followed the correct protocol for addressing both teams on and off the field and dealt with England and Wales in a fair and professional manner and refereed what was in front of him. "An official process exists for unions to give feedback to the IRB on refereeing performances. "IRB referee manager Paddy O'Brien and the Rugby Football Union elite rugby director Rob Andrew shared a very positive meeting on Monday, which makes the timing of the comments regrettable and unfortunate." Smith had not held back in his criticism of Kaplan, who he believed had come under pressure from Wales to find fault in England's play at the breakdown. "His whole demeanour through that match, the way he addressed our team in the changing room beforehand - he had clearly had heaps of pressure put on by Wales," said Smith, following the 23-15 defeat on 14 February. "The way our team was addressed prior to the Wales game took me a little bit by surprise. It was clear to me that Wales had done their job in terms of getting stuck into the referee. "Fair play to them for doing it. Teams are looking at every advantage they can get. "What we are really trying to say to the refs is: 'Please judge us the same way you judge other teams and do not come into the game with a preconceived idea'." England face Ireland at Croke Park on Saturday. Hmmm, perhaps the view on here that the ref robbed you was a bit, umm, incorrect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villamark Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 IRB back ref after a poor game, not really a shock is it, England being quite clever puting pressure on ref before the Ireland game. The Welsh management did a job on Kaplan before the game which too be fair is there job. It gets done at the level I play at never mind international level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissmith921 Posted February 27, 2009 Author Share Posted February 27, 2009 I think it gets done at every level mate - the pressure our local Village side put on a referee before a make-or-break game a couple of years ago was clear to see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 England told to shut up and stop complaining, the ref didn't rob ya. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/english/7912721.stm England backs coach Brian Smith has been reprimanded for his criticism of Jonathan Kaplan's refereeing in the Six Nations match against Wales. Smith accused him of not being even-handed with England, claiming he had been swayed by the Wales management. "Comments that appear to question the performance of Kaplan were unwarranted," said the International Rugby Board in a statement. "The official review of the match ranks Kaplan's performance as high." The statement added: "The IRB is satisfied that Kaplan followed the correct protocol for addressing both teams on and off the field and dealt with England and Wales in a fair and professional manner and refereed what was in front of him. "An official process exists for unions to give feedback to the IRB on refereeing performances. "IRB referee manager Paddy O'Brien and the Rugby Football Union elite rugby director Rob Andrew shared a very positive meeting on Monday, which makes the timing of the comments regrettable and unfortunate." Smith had not held back in his criticism of Kaplan, who he believed had come under pressure from Wales to find fault in England's play at the breakdown. "His whole demeanour through that match, the way he addressed our team in the changing room beforehand - he had clearly had heaps of pressure put on by Wales," said Smith, following the 23-15 defeat on 14 February. "The way our team was addressed prior to the Wales game took me a little bit by surprise. It was clear to me that Wales had done their job in terms of getting stuck into the referee. "Fair play to them for doing it. Teams are looking at every advantage they can get. "What we are really trying to say to the refs is: 'Please judge us the same way you judge other teams and do not come into the game with a preconceived idea'." England face Ireland at Croke Park on Saturday. Hmmm, perhaps the view on here that the ref robbed you was a bit, umm, incorrect? Well, frankly no, since when has a governing body ever slammed a ref. In in one word, never. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santa_Rosa Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 So not only are Enlgand not as good as Wales on the pitch, they're not as good off it as well? And when have an England side needed an excuse for being beaten? In a word, never. FWIW I have no idea how this round will go, they will all be close. But cards on the table time: Wales by 6 points, as long as the right France turn up. Or the wrong one, depending on your loyalties. Ireland by 8 Scotland by 5, and only because of home advantage and only if they start Patterson to kick all the penalties that the Italians will inevitably give away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 France win England - too close to call Scotland win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bully Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 I hope France, Ireland and Italy to win. I predict Wales, Ireland and Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 England told to shut up and stop complaining, the ref didn't rob ya. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/english/7912721.stm England backs coach Brian Smith has been reprimanded for his criticism of Jonathan Kaplan's refereeing in the Six Nations match against Wales. Smith accused him of not being even-handed with England, claiming he had been swayed by the Wales management. "Comments that appear to question the performance of Kaplan were unwarranted," said the International Rugby Board in a statement. "The official review of the match ranks Kaplan's performance as high." The statement added: "The IRB is satisfied that Kaplan followed the correct protocol for addressing both teams on and off the field and dealt with England and Wales in a fair and professional manner and refereed what was in front of him. "An official process exists for unions to give feedback to the IRB on refereeing performances. "IRB referee manager Paddy O'Brien and the Rugby Football Union elite rugby director Rob Andrew shared a very positive meeting on Monday, which makes the timing of the comments regrettable and unfortunate." Smith had not held back in his criticism of Kaplan, who he believed had come under pressure from Wales to find fault in England's play at the breakdown. "His whole demeanour through that match, the way he addressed our team in the changing room beforehand - he had clearly had heaps of pressure put on by Wales," said Smith, following the 23-15 defeat on 14 February. "The way our team was addressed prior to the Wales game took me a little bit by surprise. It was clear to me that Wales had done their job in terms of getting stuck into the referee. "Fair play to them for doing it. Teams are looking at every advantage they can get. "What we are really trying to say to the refs is: 'Please judge us the same way you judge other teams and do not come into the game with a preconceived idea'." England face Ireland at Croke Park on Saturday. Hmmm, perhaps the view on here that the ref robbed you was a bit, umm, incorrect? Your views are very, very ironic and somewhat hyprocritical in light of some of the vitriol I've heard directed the referee's way in Welsh games during my five and a half years in Cardiff. Even during the England game this year (which I watched in Sydney), I was surrounded by Welsh guys who thought that every decision that went England's way was part of some conspiracy to screw them over. Face it, every single team will act hard done by by the ref if things aren't going their way. It's not a uniquely English trait FFS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walesavfc Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 any 1 watching the France v Wales game ? France should be winning it by at least 5, was def a try dissalowed cos they said it wasn`t grounded, and Wales should have had Tom Shanklin sin binned for closelining Imanol Harinordoquy in the air The rugby gods are shining on Wales tonight. and officials seem to be helping them alot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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